Eye opening CAT weighing

[Boomerweps]

For last weekend's camping, I was going by a truck stop with CAT scales and wanted to get some ready to camp weights on my rig. Onboard was my wife, lab, & me.
I had to get out to use the call buttons, likely causing a little of the noticed errors, like the reweighing being 160# less, even though I tried to at least straddle the 1st & 2nd scale platforms. For the reweigh, I just took off the load bars and put them in the TV.
My TV GVWR IS 6180, with WDH the TV axles totaled 5920, without WDH 5840.
Front axle rated at 2960, with WDH 2600, without 2380.
Rear axle rated at 3340, with WDH 3320, without 3460!
Trailer axle weighed in with WDH 3680, without WDH 3600.
First Gross weight was 9600, reweigh was 9440?
So yes, the numbers do NOT all match up mathematically.
I did not unhook for a tongue weight nor did I get a just the TV weight. Two missing parts of the puzzle. The TV is rated to tow 5225 with the factory tow package, so I have got a good safety margin there, although I only have 260# margin on my GVWR when using the WDH.

What I do surmise, I am slightly over weight on my rear axle until I put the load bars on. I need to put anything I can from the TV into the trailer and clear out whatever gear I can out of the TV. The WDH is putting 220# to the front axle.
Other than get a new TV (not an option this year), any comments or suggestions? Should I increase the leverage on the load bars to move more weight to the front? It's a flat bar and platform linkage, so not as simple as bumping up a chain link. Husky Centerline with 600/6K load bars. Right now I feel really stable and level when towing.

[Boomerweps]

Double checked my tires. While they are Castle Rock, they are load range D, 8 PR equivalent, rated for 75 mph, and 2040#. So they mate well with a 3500# axle and should be able to handle the extra weight. I have not yet found a 205/75R14 in a load range E. Bigger wheels & tires, IMO, really should have the axle replaced with a 5K and that isn't cost effective.

[CharlesinGA]

When running at max trailer axle weight or more, the tires are the biggest concern. Stepping up a size or even a diameter (new rims of course) would help immensely (provided you have the wheel well room for the larger tires). You will find that the tires are probably the exact same weight capacity as the axle. If nothing else, get a set of the best tires you can find for a trailer. I'm going to suggest Carlisle Radial Trail HD on the success of a co-worker with that tire, and I haven't read of problems with it. I think Goodyear also has a decent trailer tire.

Charles

[Boomerweps]

Grit dog wrote:
You just said it tows well. HP is one thing you recognize it's lacking. Handling is acceptable, so don't drove yourself nuts storing silverware in the glove box and splitting the tools to 4 corners of the TT.
You're good!

Thanks. I was just shocked at that I was well past the capacities of the TT & TV axles.
I will keep it in mind for each future loadout until I get a higher capacity TV.
I'll keep nickel & dimeing the items in the trailer and my TV to cut more weight but I won't obsess (too much more) on it 😉

[Grit_dog]

Boomerweps wrote:
Just crawled under the TT to check the axle. Clearly marked 3500 pounds. So all the extra/overage listed in the specs is tongue weight. And, if I understand how the WDH works, more tension puts not only more weight to the TV's front axle but some goes back to the TT axle. Man, I really need to diagram out my rig with weights so I can clearly explain to SWMBO our limitations in TT loading.
Still unloading stuff. Cut our metal silverware weight by half, saved another 1.05#! That was in addition to removing 26.4# from the TT last night, and 23# from the TV. Discussed leaving the cast iron at home depending on our menu, that went over surprisingly well 😉
Haven't used the factory metal platform yet, considering moving the spare tire elsewhere and pulling the platform. It's got to be 40-50#.

You just said it towa well. HP is one thing you recognize it's lacking. Handling is acceptable, so don't drove yourself nuts storing silverware in the glove box and splitting the tools to 4 corners of the TT.
You're good!

[Grit_dog]

Old-Biscuit wrote:
YES....re-adjust WDH to move MORE weight to TV Front axle

Then go camping!

Read, he already added weight to the front.

Sounds like it's setup just right. oP, don't get hung up on a couple hundred lbs when talking capacities. That is a very small margin of error on things with factors of safety.
If it actually worries you, get something bigger than needed for your towing duties.

[JBarca]

Boomerweps wrote:
Just crawled under the TT to check the axle. Clearly marked 3500 pounds. So all the extra/overage listed in the specs is tongue weight. And, if I understand how the WDH works, more tension puts not only more weight to the TV's front axle but some goes back to the TT axle. Man, I really need to diagram out my rig with weights so I can clearly explain to SWMBO our limitations in TT loading.
Still unloading stuff. Cut our metal silverware weight by half, saved another 1.05#! That was in addition to removing 26.4# from the TT last night, and 23# from the TV. Discussed leaving the cast iron at home depending on our menu, that went over surprisingly well 😉
Haven't used the factory metal platform yet, considering moving the spare tire elsewhere and pulling the platform. It's got to be 40-50#.

Don't feel bad... history repeats itself often! Everytime I weigh the camper it never ceases to amaze me what stuff weights. 20# here, 5 # there etc. it all adds up and is always shocking... While you have small camper, big campers have the same problem....

[Boomerweps]

Just crawled under the TT to check the axle. Clearly marked 3500 pounds. So all the extra/overage listed in the specs is tongue weight. And, if I understand how the WDH works, more tension puts not only more weight to the TV's front axle but some goes back to the TT axle. Man, I really need to diagram out my rig with weights so I can clearly explain to SWMBO our limitations in TT loading.
Still unloading stuff. Cut our metal silverware weight by half, saved another 1.05#! That was in addition to removing 26.4# from the TT last night, and 23# from the TV. Discussed leaving the cast iron at home depending on our menu, that went over surprisingly well 😉
Haven't used the factory metal platform yet, considering moving the spare tire elsewhere and pulling the platform. It's got to be 40-50#.

[Boomerweps]

Thanks all. Yup, I'll be carefully assessing what is in the trailer and the TV and removing all I can. Extra power cables, extra chairs for starters.
Considering calling up the scales to find out the best time to be able to set on the scales and unhook for trailer and tongue weight and separate TV weights. Food for thought. I've read where some that are "towing on the edge" of weight specs travel without food and such and run out from there campsite to the store for use while parked. THAT is over the top for me but I can apply that logic to not having more than needed for a couple days on board.
More data: My factory listed TT GVWR is 3877#, hitch weight 377#, CCC 780#, UVW 3097#
To me that means a 3500# axle and I am already overweight on the TT axle.

[APT]

Boomerweps wrote:

What I do surmise, I am slightly over weight on my rear axle until I put the load bars on...Other than get a new TV (not an option this year), any comments or suggestions? Should I increase the leverage on the load bars to move more weight to the front?

When you just put a trailer tongue on the ball, it acts as a lever with the rear axle/wheels as the fulcrum. So the rear axle typically gets 130-140% of the static tongue weight. Many TVs towing bumper pull RVs are over rear axle without a WDH. I would no worry about that, unless you are still over with properly adjusted WDH.

Suggestions? Find out the unhitched weight so you know how much front axle weight you lost and then restored with WDH. But I think you'll find out it is adjusted fairly well and it tows well. Happy camping!

[JBarca]

Boomerweps wrote:


I had to get out to use the call buttons, likely causing a little of the noticed errors, like the reweighing being 160# less, even though I tried to at least straddle the 1st & 2nd scale platforms. For the reweigh, I just took off the load bars and put them in the TV.

My TV GVWR IS 6180, with WDH the TV axles totaled 5920, without WDH 5840.
Front axle rated at 2960, with WDH 2600, without 2380.
Rear axle rated at 3340, with WDH 3320, without 3460!
Trailer axle weighed in with WDH 3680, without WDH 3600.
First Gross weight was 9600, reweigh was 9440?
So yes, the numbers do NOT all match up mathematically.

I did not unhook for a tongue weight nor did I get a just the TV weight. Two missing parts of the puzzle.

The TV is rated to tow 5225 with the factory tow package, so I have got a good safety margin there, although I only have 260# margin on my GVWR when using the WDH.

What I do surmise, I am slightly over weight on my rear axle until I put the load bars on. I need to put anything I can from the TV into the trailer and clear out whatever gear I can out of the TV.

The WDH is putting 220# to the front axle.
Other than get a new TV (not an option this year), any comments or suggestions? Should I increase the leverage on the load bars to move more weight to the front? It's a flat bar and platform linkage, so not as simple as bumping up a chain link. Husky Centerline with 600/6K load bars. Right now I feel really stable and level when towing.

I will see if I can help some. A few things I see which may help show how close you are.

You are missing the truck front and rear axle weights unhitched with all your gear in it and a camper tongue weight. You really need them to tell the whole picture.

It is very hard to tell if your WD is set correctly without out it or how the camper is doing. While the rear axle for sure needs the WD hitch engaged and working, we so not know if you are already overdriving the front end. Your numbers show you are only 260# from GVWR so you do not have a lot of room left in the truck.

While by the numbers the front axle can carry more weight and it sounds like you want to move more gear to the camper. Normally that is a good idea but you have a situation you have not looked at yet.

The camper with WD engaged as it is set now is at 3,680# on the single axle camper. Look at the camper axle rating. Odds are high is is rated at 3,600# as there is no way Forest River is installing the next size larger axle. And the 3,600# limit you are already over it. The tires on the camper will be next with a problem. By adjusting the WD hitch to move more weight to the truck front axle, this will shift more weight to the camper and make the camper axle more over it's rating and the tires to follow.

This is the Wolf Pups ratings. http://www.forestriverinc.com/product-details.aspx?LineID=177&Image=5038&ShowParent=1

You are over your campers limits before you moved gear to it. Right now it shows you need to sort through your camping gear and TV gear and try and reduce any weight you can and not take it with you. For the campers axle/tire reasons and maybe the GVWR on the camper too, you should not shift more weight to the truck front axle. You are sort of stuck with only reducing total weight.

Hope this helps

John

[Boomerweps]

Fordlover wrote:
How does it tow?
I just retired my 2002 V8 Explorer from towing duties when we grew our trailer by 10 feet and 3K lbs. I did the same as you, loaded all our stuff in the trailer, kept the Explorer as empty as we could. It towed great, but was overloaded on the rear axle by a bit. The front wheel bearings needed replaced around 110K miles, and one rear went got noisy a few miles earlier. Otherwise I had no concerns with it. I still have the SUV, can't bring myself to sell it just yet...

It tows surprisingly well for a V6 mid size SUV. I just have to accept slowing down on EVERY rise on the interstate, I've become happy with being able to drive 55mph, unlike in the 1970's. If we had not "upgraded" our family vehicle last summer AND not just bought the TT, I'd be in a better financial position to upgrade the TV. Cart/horse thing ;( For now, we plan on mostly in state camping and not towing great distances while loaded for a long trip. We do have the hills of Pennsylvania to fight. Will likely buy a new TV within a couple years so we can tour the US with the TT 😉

[Boomerweps]

Removed 23# of tools out of the TV. Put them in the TT.
Weighed the hitch. Head is 51#, load bars are 26#, for a 77# hitch! (Does not include the bar platforms mounted to the TT frame.)
Reviewed the hitch manual and looked it over. Looks to be easier than I thought to change the load bar platforms on the TT frame. However they are supposed to be set by height so I'll likely only try moving it by one hole set.

[Fordlover]

How does it tow?
I just retired my 2002 V8 Explorer from towing duties when we grew our trailer by 10 feet and 3K lbs. I did the same as you, loaded all our stuff in the trailer, kept the Explorer as empty as we could. It towed great, but was overloaded on the rear axle by a bit. The front wheel bearings needed replaced around 110K miles, and one rear went got noisy a few miles earlier. Otherwise I had no concerns with it. I still have the SUV, can't bring myself to sell it just yet...

[Old-Biscuit]

YES....re-adjust WDH to move MORE weight to TV Front axle

Then go camping!