Pets left alone in RV at campground?

[solismaris]

We are now a dog owner and would consider bringing her on next camping trip. Question for all: is it considered acceptable to leave dog in trailer while we are away?

Windows and vents will be open, curtains drawn, propane will be turned off. Where I travel no AC is needed. Dog is not a barker.

I asked at one place and they said no unattended pets. Of course they did. Maybe better to not ask and do it surreptitiously?

Surely campers with dogs are still able to get away for a restaurant, museum, other no-pets tourist attractions?

[MFL]

I think the OP got the answer to their question, from a number of posters, with common sense. I agree with some of them, as to the rule being posted, for whatever is needed, like alcohol not allowed, no parking on grass, quiet times. It takes the argument out of the picture, when there IS A PROBLEM.

Like many issues on this forum, some will argue relentlessly, needing the last word, so they feel most important. It is easy to pick out the radicals, that just want to be right.

Dogs are a big part of many families, and more has been done to accommodate these fur family members in recent years. Many motels, even high end places allow your dog in your room now. Some charge extra, no problem, but to compete with other CGs, or hotels, to keep your business they are doing it.

True in an emergency, such as a fire, or natural disaster, a dog could die in a camper, in your S&B house, or a tree fall on them. Bad things do happen, people die, pets die, a sad thing for sure, but a fact of life.

A responsible pet owner, is a good camping neighbor. The same ones that ignore their dog barking, also let their kids run loose in every ones campsite, and the ones drinking/partying outside, even after quiet time.

The OP asking about their new family member, is an indication to me, that they are going to be a responsible dog owner, capable of getting much enjoyment from their new best friend.

Jerry

[cruising_spud]

To answer the question (no moral judgement included)-yes, people leave their dogs alone at campgrounds all the time ("no dogs alone" signs or not).

Our experience-we have taken two dogs camping (we had one dog at a time). Our first dog was fine being alone. Our second dog was a bit anxious. We have a Class C,and did not want the dogs going near the steering wheel, gas pedals, or large front window, so we put a baby gate across the front. We also shut the windows, no matter what the weather, because we did not want to risk either dog panicking and going through a window screen. We shut the curtains and left plenty of fresh water and a treat. We gave doggy cbd to our second dog, to help with the anxiety.

We would also give our dog a loooong walk before leaving in the hope that this would cause her to sleep. To check and see if our dogs barked when we were away-we drove away from the campsite, parked, and walked back to the campsite, sat outside and read for an hour. We never heard a peep. We would also ask neighbors (if any were around) whether they heard barking or not.

There is surveillance equipment that you can use-the problem is that I think you need a reliable internet source and/or unlimited data.

We were careful not to be gone too long. Five hours was our limit.

[Lantley]

Some of the doomsday scenario you guys bring up are a bit much. Yes people do suddenly become ill and leave pets abandoned but this is not common.
People have heart attacks while driving on the highway with and without pets in the car but we don't prohibit driving.
Emergencies will always occur but they will have to be dealt with on a case by case basis.
I do believe some unattended pet rules are in place simply to limit CG liability
when things go wrong, such as pets being abandoned for weeks, be it intentionally or do to unforeseen illness.

[toedtoes]

LMHS wrote:
Weekenders vs Fulltimers

Fulltime. Current park allows pets to be left inside rigs. Not barkers. Not left out all day and/or overnight. If the park you prefer does not allow pets to be left alone, then change your preferences.

Previous park made a rule that didn't allow dogs to be put in a kennel crate outside, unattended. That was because some worthless weekenders took off for almost a week and left their two dogs in a kennel crate covered with a black cover... in NM summer. No one knew. One dog died, one barely survived. The people were arrested when they finally showed back up.

It's not a weekender vs fulltimer issue. There are folks of both camping styles following the rules and ignoring the rules.

Not every weekender is a partier looking to get high and cause problems. Not every fulltimer is a quiet retired couple who hide quietly in their RV except for the four hours they leave to eat out and shop/sightsee.

Your story is why it can be dangerous even leaving the dog inside an RV unattended. What if they had left the dogs in a trailer and took off. The result could very easily have been the same.

And what if you only intended to leave the dogs for an hour or two, but were in a car accident and unconscious in a hospital for a week? No one would know or expect your dogs were in the RV starving.

[toedtoes]

I don't disagree. I'm sure a LOT of campgrounds happily look the other way, or don't even realize. And I'm sure there are many dogs who quietly sleep the day away.

I just think it's important for folks to understand WHY these rules are in place, the risks, however slight, if they disregard the rules, and that just because Joe Blow jumps off a cliff doesn't make it a good idea for you to do the same.

Similarly, if someone posted asking if it was OK to drink alcohol in an dry campground, I would say "skip the alcohol" or pick another campground. If they choose to ignore the rule, fine that's on them. But they won't be doing based on me saying "it's no big deal".

Heck, you never know if the campground had a huge issue with alcohol just the week before and decides to be hardnosed about it as a result. And that person to whom you said "it's no big deal" ends up having their five generation family reumion ruined because they figured it was OK to have a quiet glass of wine before bed and the campground staff saw it and kicked them out.

[Lantley]

@ Toedtoes you raise some good points and I agree its probably not good advice to tell a newbie its OK to leave your dog everyone does it.
But ultimately my point is if you leave a behaved dog it won't be an issue.
If you leave a barker you may and should encounter the long arm of the CG. I'm all for enforcing the rule if the dog disturbs the peace, but I also believe in letting sleeping dogs lie if the dog is behaved.
Much in the way if you are a loud obnoxious drunk alcohol rules should be enforced.
However if you are a quiet law abiding camper with red plastic cup your RV should not be randomly searched for booze.

[LMHS]

Weekenders vs Fulltimers

Fulltime. Current park allows pets to be left inside rigs. Not barkers. Not left out all day and/or overnight. If the park you prefer does not allow pets to be left alone, then change your preferences.

Previous park made a rule that didn't allow dogs to be put in a kennel crate outside, unattended. That was because some worthless weekenders took off for almost a week and left their two dogs in a kennel crate covered with a black cover... in NM summer. No one knew. One dog died, one barely survived. The people were arrested when they finally showed back up.

[toedtoes]

Lantley wrote:

I consider the unattended dog rules similar to the no alcohol rules at Most state parks in my area.
If your drinking and causing problems the authorities can quickly enforce the rules without debate. If your dog is barking or disturbing the peace the authorities can quickly enforce the rules if necessary without debate.
However if you and your dog are well behaved there is no harm done and consequently no foul.
Sometimes rules are put in place as a deterrent to ensure compliant behavior vs. solely for enforcement.

In theory yes. But in reality, it's a lot different. With alcohol, they can simply say "put it away or leave". With dogs left unattended, they get all the arguments here in this thread " but he doesn't bark", "he's small and just sleeps all day", "but we want to eat out tonight", "but we can't take her into the themepark", and on and on. The rangers get very tired of the arguments. And when it gets bad enough, they say "fine. No dogs for you!" and enact laws banning dogs from the campgrounds completely.

This happened with "dogs on trails". Once they were allowed with the usual "pick up their poop", "keep dogs on trails", and "keep dogs on leash" laws. But people decided those were inconveniences and just for other people with bad dogs, etc. When cited, the owners whined and argued about why THEIR dog shouldn't have to follow the rules. Rangers got tired of it. They enacted laws that now prevent dogs from going on trails, etc.
Look I'm not saying that anyone who leaves their dog unattended at their campsite is evil. And if it were limited to just one or two campsites with quiet dogs, etc, I wouldn't argue so much against it.

But the truth is, for every person who IS ACTUALLY only leaving well behaved quiet dogs who sleep the four hours max the owners are out, there are a dozen idiots out there who will happily leave their loud obnoxious dogs all day every day. And as with "but my dog is friendly", dog owners (and I say this as a dog owner) tend to have selective amnesia for all the times the dog has not been friendly/quiet/polite/etc, insisting that their dog never barks because they've asked the neighbors, etc.

Folks will do as they want. But I won't tell a stranger on the internet that it's OK for them to leave their dog(s) unattended against the rules. I may tell someone I know well and whose dog I know well "it's against the rules, but if it's just a couple hours here and there and knowing your dog, no one will likely even realize you left him. Just be prepared for the repercussions IF you do get called out for it. You may be asked to leave with no refund. You may not be able to enjoy the rest of your stay because your plan to leave the dog behind each day has been curtailed."

I'll add that one of the reasons for the rule is for safety of the dog. If you leave your dog in the RV while you spend the afternoon at the museum, there may be an emergency at the campground that makes it unsafe for your dog. Look at the thread with the RVs falling off the cliff.

1) they don't know a dog is in there because it's not allowed, so they don't try to get your dog out if there's a fire, etc. Your dog dies because it took you too long to get back when your monitoring alarms went off. And if you call the park for help, you put them at risk of injury/death to save your dog who shouldn't have been left alone in there.

2) If they need to get into your RV for some emergency reason, they unknowingly put themselves at risk confronting an unknown dog with no owners around.

3) if the dog gets out somehow, they now have a dog running loose who may be scared. And a scared dog could easily bite someone.

[bigred1cav]

Stay on your own site, would you prefer owners take dogs to showers?

[solismaris]

I like the comment "what goes on in my trailer is nobody's business". I've also been known to drink alcohol at state parks. I'll probably make some test runs with the dog - make like I am leaving and drive 5 minutes away and listen with a baby or dog monitor. Barking heard? Bad; abandon idea. No barking? Keep monitoring and start to go away longer periods

[Lantley]

toedtoes wrote:

Lantley wrote:

For the record experienced campers with well behaved dogs leave them unattended all the time.

That doesn't make it right. And for the record, I am an experienced camper with well-behaved dogs. I don't leave my dogs unattended in the campground if the rule is "dogs are not to be left unattended".

Look at it this way. You and your dog are experienced. Every day, you leave your dog behind in the RV while you go sightsee. The rules don't allow forthis, buy hey, your dog is well-behaved. Your neighbor, who is new to camping and who boarded his dog because the campground told him "no you can't leave your dog alone in the RV while you sightsee", sees you doing just that every day. He says to himself " well, obviously that rule is not enforced!". So for his next trip, he ignores the rule, brings his dog, and leaves the dog alone in the RV while he sightsees. His neighbor sees him ignoring the rule, so on their next trip, they do the same.

Now the campgrounds have a problem with dogs barking while their owners are out sightseeing. They are fed up with dog owners who disregard their rules. So they simply change the rule to "no dogs allowed". And now none of us get to enjoy camping with our dogs - all because some "experienced camper" chose to ignore the rules.

I consider the unattended dog rules similar to the no alcohol rules at Most state parks in my area.
If your drinking and causing problems the authorities can quickly enforce the rules without debate. If your dog is barking or disturbing the peace the authorities can quickly enforce the rules if necessary without debate.
However if you and your dog are well behaved there is no harm done and consequently no foul.
Sometimes rules are put in place as a deterrent to ensure compliant behavior vs. solely for enforcement.

[ppine]

Nope.

[dedmiston]

We travel with our dogs. They can't speak, but they seem to love the experience. Objectively though, they seem just as happy when we get home as they do when we hit the road. I guess their natural inclination is to be happy though.

We mostly boondock, so there aren't really any rules aside from general statewide cruelty regulations. So leaving them in the RV while we go exploring isn't illegal and we aren't breaking any rules.

They seem to absolutely love it. They seem to mostly sleep while we're gone, but that's based on the hearsay of others in our group who stay behind while we're out. According to our campmates, the dogs are a non-issue while we're gone.

On the other hand, they absolutely lose their minds when we return to camp. We jokingly say every time we return: "Cue barking dogs" and point to the trailer. They bark when they hear the gravel crunch of our tires, and then they stop when we get to the door. So there's about 45 seconds max of nuisance barking. Seems acceptable to us.

We also do the same thing when we camp in RV parks and have no misgivings about it. Our dogs aren't a nuisance (except for that 45 seconds when we return) unless someone messes with our camp. Again, this is based on witness accounts from neighboring spaces.

As far as I'm concerned, there's a hierarchy of concerns when it comes to bringing the dogs.

1. Most importantly is the safety and lack of cruelty to the dogs. Do they have food & water? Are they comfortable? Are they too hot or too cold?

2. Next is the impact on the neighbors. Do the dogs bark or fart or do anything else that will affect the neighbors?

3. Is there stimulation for the dogs or do they get bored to the point of frustration?

If the dogs are OK, aren't bothering anyone, and if you reward them with walks and other stimulation, then leaving them behind falls into what I consider to be the "victimless crime" category.

Are they unattended? Depends on how you define that. All their needs have been attended to and they aren't chained up outside where they can cause problems.

Similar to the "no alcohol" camps, what happens inside our RV isn't anybody's business provided nothing inside affects anybody outside. We've stayed at plenty of these dry camps, but we never pour out our liquor when we stay there. We just don't take it outside and don't cause any trouble.

Are we breaking the rules? Probably. We consider ourselves to be law abiding people, but we're also aware that we break the laws all the time (speed limits, rolling stops, etc.). We also break a few of the Ten Commandments from time to time. We're human.

We pay extra to have the dogs with us and we make sure they're well behaved and aren't harming or annoying anyone else. That seems good enough to me.

We have plenty of mantras in our family, and one of them is: "Don't let OUR problems turn into YOUR problems." As long as our dogs aren't negatively impacting you, then there's no problem.

It's kind of like the elements of a civil tort:

1. Duty owed
2. Duty breached
3. Damages result <<--- This is important here
4. The breach of duty is the proximate cause of the damages

Number three there is the basis of the saying "No harm, no foul". If there's no harm to anyone, then it's irrelevant whether we broke a rule (breached a duty) or not. You're OK. We're OK. The dogs are OK. Everybody is good.

[Samsonsworld]

toedtoes wrote:
If you need to go grocery shopping, then surely one of you can go to the store .

So explain again who's going to the store, me or the dog????

Think you're being a little presumptuous.

[toedtoes]

wildtoad wrote:
It’s impractical to never leave your pet alone in your RV when you need/want to go out for dinner, grocery shopping, or seek medical help.

I would argue that need is different than want. If you need emergency medical attention, then that would be one thing. If you need to go grocery shopping, then surely one of you can go to the store while the other stays behind with the dogs. As for eating out, you can always take the dogs for a drive to the restaurant, order takeout, and enjoy it in the company of your dogs.

wildtoad wrote:
Taking them with you and leaving them in the car kinda depends on the weather. Lots of dogs, cats, babies have perished in what some consider a mild climate, but park their car in the sun.

Yes, it does depend on the weather. That is why I do my research BEFORE I make trip plans to be sure that my dogs will be safe and comfortable in the car. I also think about this at home with even short car drives - will the car cool down enough during the drive for the dog to be comfortable - and that's for drives that don't require me to turn off the engine and/or get out of the car.

wildtoad wrote:
We take our dogs with us all the time because they are family, they are small loving creatures that wouldn’t hurt a flea, and usually only bark as we are backing out of the campsite and they realize they can’t go too.

My dogs are family too. Because of that, I plan my trips around them, rather than planning a trip where I know I will be violating a park/campground rule because I want it both ways (to take my dogs and to leave them behind).

I'm not sure what their being small has to do with anything. Small dogs are more often yappers. Small dogs are just as likely to have issues being left alone.

Yeah, the "my dog is nice" argument is a common one. My dogs are nice too and wouldn't hurt a flea - until something happens that causes them to react like a dog. I don't pretend my dogs would never cause a problem. It can happen with any dog. And for the record, the only dogs that have ever bitten me were small dogs.

wildtoad wrote:
We leave them in a climate controlled MH, and if we ever comeback and there’s a note from the ranger we will deal with at that time. We also drink in our RV even though the signs says no alcohol allowed. I do speed on a regular basis but not by much, another rule broken..O’ Darn.

That's fine. If you choose to break the rules because you find them unreasonable or too confining, etc.

For me, I consider what the repercussions of my breaking the rule are before I do so. Over the years, I've watched many places ban dogs completely because they got tired of dealing with the rule breakers. People let their "but he's friendly" dogs off leash and the dog attacked a leashed dog or a person. People didn't clean up after their dog. People left their dog unattended and the dog barked nonstop. It's fine if it's just one person ignoring the rule and doing so "responsibly". But as I mentioned, others see you doing it and so they do it. But they aren't responsible. The campground/park gets fed up with the complaints and dogs are no longer allowed at all.

I don't follow every law to the letter (I have sped on ocassion, etc). But I LOVE being able to take my dogs camping with me. So I follow the rules to ensure that I am not the cause for dogs being banned.

I have a friend who camps with us. I can tell she gets tired of planning things around the dogs. I tell her "that's what having dogs means. Just like having kids. You fit your lifestyle according to their needs - you don't force them into your lifestyle.