Basics of Lithium conversion... I'm lost!

[C_Schomer]

I did a search and it's mostly Greek... to me. I'd like to know the key points for, hopefully, a straight across lead/acid to lithium conversion.
My old Flow-Rite watering system just overflowed 2 cells (GRRRR) and I'm thinking this might be the time to convert.
So far I see that SiO2 is better than Li but I don't know why or what the difference is, and charging is much simpler for lithium and not so fussy.
I currently have 2 of the bigger Sams 6gc's that have dimensions and specs similar to T-105s, 2 X 120 watt panels and a Morning Star controller with remote panel/setpoint, that the PO installed.
I don't use an inverter for any 120ac loads. I'm nearly always plugged in to 120. I have no big 12vdc loads... my 5er has full LED lighting but I use a 12vdc bipap for very rare boondocking. The biggest addition might be a 12vdc fridge, someday.
Is there 6v and 12v lithium batteries? I seldom need the capacity I have now but I don't want to give it up, for the times I need the 12vdc bipap. Can I get similar capacity with lithiums and also fit the 2 x 6gc foot print? How much capacity to run a 12vdc fridge? Do I need a different solar controller or just reprogram my existing one? Thanks bunches! Craig

[3_tons]

Per PT: “ Nice list, but I won't put any "house" battery inside my living quarters.”

So do you keep your computer outside?? 🙂 (lol!)...Note too, when considering danger, what is more dangerous, a non-venting LFP battery (non-hazardous’ during shipment), or multiple interior housed propane appliances subject to the duress of road vibration?? Truth is we cannot escape our very dangerous world...JMHO

3 tons

[FWC]

Wouldn't an engineer specify the highest performing battery, then go check with accounting as to whether it is within budget?

Now that the pricing is close to equivalent (or soon will be), why wouldn't you want a lighter, faster charging, longer lasting battery for the same money? Just because it is too fancy?

MEXICOWANDERER wrote:
Tomorrow is not today. I deal in today. I don't need a Versachi suit to impress myself. A lithium battery bank is justified for long runs of deep cycling use. What is the percentage of RVers that camp longer than a week off grid? Trying to convince a weekend warrior that a lithium bank is justified is like trying to convince a deer hunter an RPG is indispensable. Remember a pessimists glass is half empty N optimist's glass is half full. AN ENGINEER figures out the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

[3_tons]

I find being a Cynic works because in this way I’m never disappointed...

3 tons

[3_tons]

“ Trying to convince a weekend warrior that a lithium bank is justified is like trying to convince a deer hunter an RPG is indispensable. Remember a pessimists glass is half empty N optimist's glass is half full. AN ENGINEER figures out the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.”

Battery choice (Uh, choice is good right??) should be a cogent determination best made by ‘thinking individuals’ rather than non-sentient zombies (e.g. your referenced Moo-cows...)...Admittedly, this culls the herd considerably - and those remaining are often a minority of individuals who choose to plan ahead and possess the ability to see beyond the trendy slogans of bumper stickers...

I would also note the ‘perceived infallibility’ of those poor Morton-Thiokol ‘engineer-experts’ who made the failed O-ring selection, and final launch call for the Challenger shuttle...This example highlights why one should avoid the temptation of outsourcing their own *critical thinking’ skills...

*(e.g. discounting the vagaries of non-user ‘opinion polls’...)

3 tons, in the High NV Desert

[pianotuna]

3 tons,

I am your outlier.

Nice list, but I won't put any "house" battery inside my living quarters. I'll have to work as long as I can, so going south is not feasible.

Mex, I need to run an O2 concentrator overnight without a generator running. I can do this on 7.2 kwh of battery bank. SiO2 meets my needs for extreme cold. So do Li Titinate. I moved to AGM because I did not enjoy laying in the snow to service the 875 amp-hour flooded battery bank.

[MEXICOWANDERER]

Tomorrow is not today. I deal in today. I don't need a Versachi suit to impress myself. A lithium battery bank is justified for long runs of deep cycling use. What is the percentage of RVers that camp longer than a week off grid? Trying to convince a weekend warrior that a lithium bank is justified is like trying to convince a deer hunter an RPG is indispensable. Remember a pessimists glass is half empty N optimist's glass is half full. AN ENGINEER figures out the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

[3_tons]

pianotuna wrote:

time2roll wrote:
Small thermostatically controlled pad heater can easily keep your battery at 5c or better.

Not at -30 to -40.

Question: So to be intellectually honest, -30 to -40 (though possible) should be viewed by most as an outlier scenario - Are we now suddenly to believe that as thinking beings we’re devoid of ingenuity, creativity and resourcefulness, else we perish of malfeasance ??...To overcome the dreaded contagion of mental paralysis, how about this just for starters:

a) insulated battery box
b) electric heating strip
c) interior mounting (beneath dinette seat??...worries gone!!)
d) be sensible and migrate to a warmer climate
e) SiO2 as an alternative to counter (uninsulated) extreme WX??
F) demand that the nanny-state tax your neighbor to subsidize your battery requirements (a standard fair green subsidy thingy - lol )

The point is, where there’s a will there’s a way, eh?? Geeze!!...time now to take some personal responsibility, “Improvise, Adapt and Overcome” your issues...

3 tons

[time2roll]

pianotuna wrote:

time2roll wrote:
Small thermostatically controlled pad heater can easily keep your battery at 5c or better.

Not at -30 to -40.

I bet your home is above 5c when it hits -40. Suddenly a little battery can't be kept warm?
Maybe a bit more effort but come on.

[pianotuna]

time2roll wrote:
Small thermostatically controlled pad heater can easily keep your battery at 5c or better.

Not at -30 to -40.

[time2roll]

Again LFP can be lower cost than a LV handbag. And for a direct price comparison you need to go to Walmart not the fancy mall.

[3_tons]

Mex (et al...), I doubt one needs to worry - As cost continue to drop, trust that those who do make the transition to LFP’ are much less incentivized in reviving a social caste system than they are appreciating the simple advantages of a Lithium battery...However, your point Sir is duly noted...

Caste System:

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/caste-system

3 tons

[MEXICOWANDERER]

It is designed to allow people to think for themselves and not to moo all the way to the milk barn. I used to laugh commuting to work in a '59 Rambler American. Cars with loping engines, superbird fins, and terror struck faces awaiting an inevitable crunch. They would have spent hours twisting your arm why their commute was better.

Some of these arguments remind me of women who would rather die than be seen with a Louis Vuitton 2019 handbag. 🙂

[3_tons]

Ha, a guy in my neighborhood has a McLaren (come to think of it, he has a LFP too 🙂 !), and he has to have it trucked to San Francisco just to have the oil changed...Ugg, I dared not want to know the cost involved -

3 tons, in the High NV Desert...

[time2roll]

Yes even the pre made boxes are not 20x cost. The DIY would seem to be on par to cost same per usable Ah as Costco GC2 and the like. What else would you do?

[SV_K]

My lights will shine just as bright as yours.

Actually they won't, as yours fully charged are over a half volt lower than mine fully charged. Our lights will be simpatico though when I'm down to 20% DOD, so there's that.