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Battery Equalization

goldwinghauler
Explorer
Explorer
OK first Happy Thanksgiving.
Now I have a truck camper with two 6 volt batteries. I need to purchase a battery charger the puts out at least 15 volts for equalization. Does anyone know which charger to buy? The batteries are sulphating and need to be cleaned up. In case you are interested they are Trojan T105's.
2017 Dodge Ram 3500HD Cummins Diesel CC LB 4WD Dually w/ Supersprings SSA-24 and Hellwig Big Wig Sway Bar
2018 Eagle Cap 1165
46 REPLIES 46

mena661
Explorer
Explorer
Yes, 20 hr rating basically gets "converted" to straight amps for this purpose. So, a 150Ah battery should be equalized at a constant 7.5 amps until the SG in each cell stops rising. How fast this gets accomplished depends on the size of the battery bank (larger banks equal slower equalizes) but mine takes 2-3 hours with 10+ amps going in (I don't have any control currently so amps will taper like it does when charging...mine starts somewhere over 12 and will drop to 6 or so). MEX says I need two of those HF's to make it really fast. I could just separate the pairs and do it that way too. For knowing what full is I go by Trojan's guide (mine are Trojan's) of 1.275 at 77F and I do compensate for temp. I figure if the SG rise stops over that I'm good. You get some SG lag anyways so best not to overdo it. Sometimes mine will stop under 1.275 but if I leave them sit with no charging for 8 hrs or so and check again, it will be right at my baseline 1.285 or thereabouts.

NinerBikes
Explorer
Explorer
mena661 wrote:
Niner, equalization voltage recommended by MEX is 5% of the 20 hr rate. I typically charge until SG stops rising in all the cells or when I hit 16V (I'll let them cool and come back later for another round...only happened once). I have a good charger for this from HF also recommended by him. It's a heavy transformer based one (just need to slow down the voltage rise for it to be perfect). All that is dependent on temps (Trojan has SG and voltage temp compensation in their users guide).


I am confused here. 20 hour rating is in amperage... so 5% of 150Ah is 7.5 amps. Now, at what voltage do we want the battery to finish at at 7.5 amps? 16.0, 15.7, or are we going to be testing the SG every 10 minutes? Is 1.260 SG good on my Nevermax 24 with 75 Ah? Is the chemistry different on a Trojan with heavy plates that 1.280 or 1.275 is where an equalized battery should sit? 1.290 is too high /hot. What about summer blend SG's for semi tropical and tropical temp areas in the desert?

Variables, variables, variables. Think I'll hop on over to a Harbor Freight and give my CTek 7002 US a rest, stupid thing cost me a fortune for a bunch of BS hype.

mena661
Explorer
Explorer
Niner, equalization voltage recommended by MEX is 5% of the 20 hr rate. I typically charge until SG stops rising in all the cells or when I hit 16V (I'll let them cool and come back later for another round...only happened once). I have a good charger for this from HF also recommended by him. It's a heavy transformer based one (just need to slow down the voltage rise for it to be perfect). All that is dependent on temps (Trojan has SG and voltage temp compensation in their users guide).

NinerBikes
Explorer
Explorer
MEXICOWANDERER wrote:
๐Ÿ™‚ Ninerbikes my crack about chickens was meant to finish conveying my feelings on this thread about PWM chargers (i.e. smart chargers) and pulse charge de-sulfation.

They don't work. Take T-105's with cell readings of say 1.250, 1.260, 1.235, 1.270, 1.255. 1.230 after thoroughly charging them. Connect a whizz-bang super-smart solid state charger and grab a calendar.

There has been enough written in this forum about the inexpensive Harbor Freight manual 10-amp charger that I hoped you had read about it. I assumed you had.

Go to a gigantic battery battery manufacturing plant. One that has a hundred thousand dollar line charger. What kind of charger is it? It is a series charger designed to run constant amperage through the batteries. If there is a problem in the greening stage of manufacturing, it is resolved (hopefully) by a constant current charge.

Is there a completely manual or adjustable PWM charger? I don't think so. The public has been brainwashed to the point where they won't buy a charger unless it sports some miracle type Ponce de Leon cycle that suposedly would jump start Frankenstein.

This all is no reflection on you. My sarcasm is directed solely at companies that spend eight dollars on a plastic case and two bucks on what's inside then claim it'll do "anything".


Mex, a bit about my backround. I was a lowly grunt in the late 1970's working at Sears Roebuck and company in the Tire Buster and later the battery and electrical department in the Los Angeles area. I tested a lot of batteries, starters, alternators, generators, etc. I gave the thumbs up or thumbs down to a lot of Sears DieHard batteries. I did a lot of load tests for 10 seconds at 500 amps plus and expected the batteries voltage to stay above 9.6 Volts. 10.0 was marginal. I put a ton of customers batteries on a huge rack with a trickle charger that took a couple of days to fully recharge a depleted group 27. A DieHard 4301 was our all time best selling battery. This was a part time job while going to school at a University, it paid a lot better than minimum wage at the time, and I got good raises regularly while there.

I don't know the volts or the amps the trickle charger provided. We were not given access to that info. I looked for 13.7 to 14.4 Volts after a motor started being provided to the battery via an alternator and voltage regulator, depending on the charge state of the battery and what the alternator/regulator could provide.

I am in here to learn. If I repeat an often asked question, forgive me. I don't do much shopping at Harbor Freight, I've no idea what that latest charger does to give 11 amps at what ever finished voltage. that's what works for 225 amp 6v batteries. Is that a different set of amps for a 150 Ah T1275, about 2/3's of 11 amps, due to a T6 being 225 amp hours? I don't know, but is 7 amps better for the T1275? Therefore, I ask... tons of variables from capacities of batteries. All of which effect charge rates, optimal amps to provide and optimal voltage. I worked a ton every day with a Frias No 1. I treated the glass and rubber on them like gold, never broke one, unlike a lot of the other employee guys in the battery shop. That instrument was like gold.

BFL13
Explorer II
Explorer II
It is likely that more could be done to equalize them but I don't want to overdo it either so they do great but not for long. In this case I would like them to last a while even if not up to full rating.
1. 1991 Oakland 28DB Class C
on Ford E350-460-7.5 Gas EFI
Photo in Profile
2. 1991 Bighorn 9.5ft Truck Camper on 2003 Chev 2500HD 6.0 Gas
See Profile for Electronic set-ups for 1. and 2.

mena661
Explorer
Explorer
BFL, I think you could get more out of those T1275's with that manual HF charger and it would take considerably less time to do it. Something about 10+ amps at over 15V seems to get the batts working as they should.

MEXICOWANDERER
Explorer
Explorer
๐Ÿ™‚ Ninerbikes my crack about chickens was meant to finish conveying my feelings on this thread about PWM chargers (i.e. smart chargers) and pulse charge de-sulfation.

They don't work. Take T-105's with cell readings of say 1.250, 1.260, 1.235, 1.270, 1.255. 1.230 after thoroughly charging them. Connect a whizz-bang super-smart solid state charger and grab a calendar.

There has been enough written in this forum about the inexpensive Harbor Freight manual 10-amp charger that I hoped you had read about it. I assumed you had.

Go to a gigantic battery battery manufacturing plant. One that has a hundred thousand dollar line charger. What kind of charger is it? It is a series charger designed to run constant amperage through the batteries. If there is a problem in the greening stage of manufacturing, it is resolved (hopefully) by a constant current charge.

Is there a completely manual or adjustable PWM charger? I don't think so. The public has been brainwashed to the point where they won't buy a charger unless it sports some miracle type Ponce de Leon cycle that suposedly would jump start Frankenstein.

This all is no reflection on you. My sarcasm is directed solely at companies that spend eight dollars on a plastic case and two bucks on what's inside then claim it'll do "anything".

BFL13
Explorer II
Explorer II
Confusion there maybe. I did resurrect two T-1275s (12v, 150AH each) from about 85% good as new to about 90% good as new, but they still have uneven SGs per cell, even though all cells are way higher than when I first got them.

I should check and update those SGs since returning from the last camping trip where they got another couple of deep cycles and a recovery at home last week.

The SGs are not the same in each battery, so they are perhaps not ideal to parallel, but I parallel them while camping and separate them on individual Float chargers at home. Mex says they have evil interactions as they are, and will hurt my 6s if paralleled with them. I assume from that they could be evil to each other too.

I really like those T-1275s, evil or not. ๐Ÿ™‚
1. 1991 Oakland 28DB Class C
on Ford E350-460-7.5 Gas EFI
Photo in Profile
2. 1991 Bighorn 9.5ft Truck Camper on 2003 Chev 2500HD 6.0 Gas
See Profile for Electronic set-ups for 1. and 2.

NinerBikes
Explorer
Explorer
MEXICOWANDERER wrote:
I hang a dead chicken above a badly sulfated battery when I'm equalizing it - seems to work and I get to stew it after it does its dirty work. Something about chasing away the bad juju.


Mex, when a free T1275 is coming my way that might be only producing 80% of what it was doing when new... I'd like to try and do a repeat of what BFL13 managed to accomplish with some old Trojan 6v's he resurrected. I have nothing to lose, but some time trying to rejuventate them. If they work for another 3 or 4 years for my purposes, it will have been worth the effort.

No where did I mention that I was going to get a badly desulphated battery, that is an assumption on your part. Whether the batteries are 150 Ah or 225 Ah, both will work.

Edit again, I see BFL13 got T 1275's too. Not 6v's. The golf course a mile up the road from me has T1275's in their cart, and they are getting another new pallet of them in early December.

MEXICOWANDERER
Explorer
Explorer
Close!

Dead on, would be that sucker inch-crawling on the floor with hands and knees.

Wonder what'd happen if I mounted a "Spiral Turbulator" above the opened cells? You know, the one that spins the "charge" into hurricane force? Works for the carburetor, should work for the battery. The hydrogen vortex would put a new meaning on the word "Quantum Theory".

Salesmen hate me...

Canadian_Rainbi
Explorer
Explorer
MEXICOWANDERER wrote:
I hang a dead chicken above a badly sulfated battery when I'm equalizing it - seems to work and I get to stew it after it does its dirty work. Something about chasing away the bad juju.


Mex: is this perhaps the AFTER picture?

MEXICOWANDERER
Explorer
Explorer
I hang a dead chicken above a badly sulfated battery when I'm equalizing it - seems to work and I get to stew it after it does its dirty work. Something about chasing away the bad juju.

NinerBikes
Explorer
Explorer
Who makes a good pulse charge type PWM Charge Controller that will handle 15 amps at 15 + volts that is programmable for voltage? Something that de sulphates and can equalize charge too.

Matt_Colie
Explorer II
Explorer II
You can mess around and get close and maybe screw up you ~300$us worth of batteries, or, you can do it right for not much more cash out of pocket. Do some research on modern multistage converter/chargers and put one in the unit. These units will do everything that is necessary to keep the bank in the best possible condition. Sure, it will cost you a couple hundred bucks, but you only have to buy it once and you don't have to sit there and babysit it.

Matt
Matt & Mary Colie
A sailor, his bride and their black dogs (one dear dog is waiting for us at the bridge) going to see some dry places that have Geocaches in a coach made the year we married.

Tom_M1
Explorer
Explorer
Years ago a friend of mine had a very simple constant current charger. It consisted of a small box with a light bulb socket, a 120 VAC cord going in, and a cord with battery clamps coming out. It obviously had a diode inside the box. Charge current would depend on what wattage bulb you installed. This was a commercial product and obviously pre UL or OSHA days.
Tom
2005 Born Free 24RB
170ah Renogy LiFePo4 drop-in battery 400 watts solar
Towing 2016 Mini Cooper convertible on tow dolly
Minneapolis, MN