Boondocker converters vs.Progressive converters?

[rrupert]

I have seen the Boondocker converters mentioned a lot but I haven't seen any reviews or comparisons anywhere. When my WFCO bites the dust I want to get something that is going to work well.

Your thoughts?

[philh]

time2roll wrote:

rrupert wrote:
Adding to the conversation, I have two 6 volt GC2 batteries. What kind of twist do those put into the charging?

GC2 really appreciate 14.4 to 14.8 volts charging for long life and good service.

AKA Progressive Dynamic or Boondocker

[MEXICOWANDERER]

Many WFCO's and up 0-stage every day i.e. wheel chocks.

[time2roll]

rrupert wrote:
Adding to the conversation, I have two 6 volt GC2 batteries. What kind of twist do those put into the charging?

GC2 really appreciate 14.4 to 14.8 volts charging for long life and good service.

[rrupert]

Adding to the conversation, I have two 6 volt GC2 batteries. What kind of twist do those put into the charging?

[BFL13]

rrupert wrote:

time2roll wrote:
Yes that would be a single stage converter. Low for charging and a bit high for float charge in warm weather.

So you are saying my WFCO is not three stage regardless of what the manual says?

He is saying effectively, you have a single stage.

It is a three-stage, where it will go into boost only if it "sees" under 13.2v on start-up. That is /was in the manual about the 13.2v "trigger". Can't say about the 13.2, but you need to be not using the trailer at the time or it will stay at 13.6.

[philh]

rrupert wrote:
So you are saying my WFCO is not three stage regardless of what the manual says?

Even with a totally discharged 12v battery, WFCO didn't go into boost mode. Putting in (2) 6v batteries, it was an easy decision to upgrade the charger.

[rrupert]

time2roll wrote:
Yes that would be a single stage converter. Low for charging and a bit high for float charge in warm weather.

So you are saying my WFCO is not three stage regardless of what the manual says?

[time2roll]

Yes that would be a single stage converter. Low for charging and a bit high for float charge in warm weather.

[BFL13]

Your batteries will die an early death from never seeing 14.x voltage during a recharge. You need to reach "gassing voltage" (14.2ish) with flooded batts to get the bubbles that mix the electrolyte properly. AGMs require at least 14.4v to recharge.

How early a death? Depends. Does that matter with the cost of new batteries and your budget? Depends. If things are going ok as is for you, you don't need to do anything special.

When you first turn on the charger, the battery voltage "spikes" from 12.x to 13.x. The more Resistance the charger "sees" the higher the spike's voltage will be. Low battery has lower R, and the wires to the battery from charger have R that is added to what the charger sees. Fatter, shorter wire has lower R than longer thinner wire.

Very important is that the charging amps as a percentage of the bank AH size (the charging rate) affects the degree of spiking. Lower charging rate, less spike. If you put a 55 amp charger on a pair of batts at 50% SOC, the spike will be over 13.2 volts. Same 55 on four batts, it could work.

The WFCO needs to see less than 13.2v on start up as the spike, or it will not go into boost. To get it to see less than 13.2v, you must:

- have a low charging rate
- low battery in SOC
- short, fat wiring to the battery.

BUT- to get the low charging rate needed, you will have low charging rate, and a very long generator run time. Too long.

So if you want to see "boost" and want shorter gen time, you can't get there with a WFCO!

The PD will at least get you the 14.4 by hitting the Charge Wizard. Gen time depends on getting enough of an amps size charger for the size of the bank in AH. Now all you need is a big enough gen to run that size charger. And a place to carry that big of a gen.

[rrupert]

time2roll wrote:

rrupert wrote:
The WFCO 8955 is a three-stage converter and appears to be operating okay now but I am always keeping an eye on it.

Have you ever seen boost mode 14.4 volts?
After 3 days of minimal use do you actually see storage mode 13.2 volts?

These are the functions that often just don't work.

I have never seen the 14.4, but I have never let the batteries get down below 12.2 volts. The constant voltage is 13.7 while sitting on charge with just the LP/CO detector drawing any current.

[time2roll]

rrupert wrote:
The WFCO 8955 is a three-stage converter and appears to be operating okay now but I am always keeping an eye on it.

Have you ever seen boost mode 14.4 volts?
After 3 days of minimal use do you actually see storage mode 13.2 volts?

These are the functions that often just don't work.

[rrupert]

Duplicate post?

[rrupert]

Thanks for all the great information! I think I will be leaning toward the PD with the Charge Wizard when the time comes. The WFCO 8955 is a three-stage converter and appears to be operating okay now but I am always keeping an eye on it.

[landyacht318]

I am firmly in the manual adjustable voltage camp for myself, but those who want automatic I have installed PD9245's or Iota DLS-45.

I like the PD better as one can push a button once for 4 more hours of 14.4v, or 14.8 if they get the PD92xx-14.8 model version. They can also hold that button for a bit longer and force 13.6v, or hold it longer to force 13.2v.

I kind of forget the Iota Algorithm, I think it applies its 45 amps until 14.8 is reached at converter ouput terminals, holds that for a while then drops to 14.2v, then after a period of time it then reverts to a lower 'float' voltage. But it is serving its owners and their Costco gc-2s well.

The Powermax automatic models do not hold 14.x volts long enough in my opinion, but probably OK with healthy flooded batts when there is unlimited grid time to plug in. AGMS I say to hold Vabs until amps taper to 0.5% of capacity each and every time when doing so is possible.

With manual, I basically choose 14.7v, or 13.6 on my 40 amp manual adjustable voltage meanwell power supply on an AGM battery. I will adjust those up or down for battery temperature. I have left it at 14.7v overnight many nights, long after the battery was fully charged. No mushroom cloud! Amazing! This AGM Battery is 5.5 years old and ~1100 deep cycles and least 100 of those cycles to the 30% charged range.

If one can properly and fully recharge Lead acid deep cycle or even marine batteries, whether flooded or AGm or GEL, they can achieve impressive lifespans.
Properly and fully almost absolutely requires a human with a brain and the wherewithall to decide how high for how long, whereas 'automatic' falls short of this, to some degree' in most instances. Automatic could certainly be good enough, especially for those whose batteres will age out with few uses per year before they cycle out, like those used by full timers mostly off grid.
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While Trojan specs a 14.82v absorption voltage, it is not as if 14.4v will not be able to fully charge the battery, it will however take longer. Trojan's 14.82v recommendation is likely based upon the fact that 14.82v is some degree less likely to allow chronic undercharging due to too little generator/grid time.
They determined that a 14.82 absorption voltage recommendation is likely to reduce the amount of batteries they have to warranty. In my opinion.

I think anybody generator recharging who wants 'automatic', would be best served by the PD -14.8v model even on AGMs that spec 14.7v max, and anybody who can remember to manually adjust voltage when on the grid, would be better served with adjustable voltage powermax models.

My 40 amp meanwell power supply requires voltage potentiometer modification and better ventlation and heatsinking to be run flat out at max amperage, and voltage adjusted often.

My Northstar AGM recommends 14.46 as Vabs. It has seen 14.7 Vabs most of its life... 5.5 years and 1100+ deep cycles.

I opine that absorption voltage duration, is more important than achieving a precise Absorption voltage 'recommended' by the battery manufacturer. On lead acid batteries anyway.