Group 24 Flooded to Group 31 AGM

[ApexAZ]

Hi all,

We are going to sign for our new toy hauler tomorrow and I inquired about upgrading the batteries that come with it from the group 24 flooded to group 31 AGM and as part of their quote, they said there is labor needed to rewire them.

They said part of the $250 labor is to upgrade the wiring to a heavier gauge wire to support the bigger batteries. What I'm a bit unclear on is whether this is just the wires needed to connect them in series, or will the wires that lead to the panel also need to be upgraded?

I know these batteries have higher amp hour ratings, but at the end of the day, they are still just 12v batteries, so I would think it would just require heavier gauge wire for connecting them in series, but that's it?

Can anyone confirm that's all that would be needed and that the rest of the electrical does not need to be modified to make this change? If so, it seems like something I could easily do myself I would think?

Thanks,

Brian

[ApexAZ]

Sandia Man wrote:
Wow, what a rip off, first they added warranty to your OTD price, and now what amounts to a few bucks of wiring they want $250. We are from the PHX area, which dealer are you purchasing your TH at so I can tell family and friends to beware. I asked our dealer when we purchased our TH what it would cost to beef up our battery bank, he stated first battery is included, only additional expense would be actual cost of extra batteries, no fake labor or wiring charges. I just asked for giggles anyway, we put a couple of 6 volt golfcart batteries from Samsclub since we mostly boondock and they are much hardier for that type of off grid RVing. Have lots of great times in your new TH!!!

I don't necessarily want to slander them in public; especially this forum. But if you want to PM me I will be happy to share the details.

I felt like I got a fair deal on the price, sans the extended warranty they slipped in, which we will deal with tomorrow and refuse all that before signing. It wasn't what I would consider a bargain basement price, but fair, and they beat some of the other larger dealers in the valley by quite a large margin. Especially considering how hot the market is right now. I guess the timing on the 21 models was just about right with the 22's coming out. Perhaps we could have gotten them down farther by waiting a bit longer while it continued to take up lot space, but we were ready now.

On the other hand, the parts department is nowhere near a good deal it seems, so I'll just do it myself. Not a big deal if it's just wiring 2 batteries together in series. It's just a bummer we'll end up wasting the batteries it comes with. But I guess we can see if they'll omit them completely and reduce the price a tad.

Anyway, assuming they honor their agreed price and don't try to force us into things we don't want, I'd say the experience hasn't been bad overall. I'm just not willing to waste $250 on what probably only amounts to about a 30 minute job, if that.

[ApexAZ]

BFL13 wrote:
There is no wiring change needed as noted above.

The only thing is the one 24 they supply will be wasted money when you go for two 6s or two 27s later, so the saving for you should be for them to keep their single 24 and reduce your cost, and you supply your own batts, or they supply the batts you want and give you the cost of that one 24 off the price of the other batts.

Yep, I tried that. They wouldn't go for it.

Makes a lot of sense, right? But nope.

[BFL13]

wa8yxm wrote:
Unless they upgrade the converter there is no need to re-wire.

True in its own way. Even with the OEM converter, it would probably do better at battery charging (but not necessarily at running the RV things) with fatter wire and higher amp fuse for that wire.

The OP is right to "suspect something".

[wa8yxm]

Unlless they upgrade the converter there is no need to re-wire.

[BFL13]

There is no wiring change needed as noted above.

The only thing is the one 24 they supply will be wasted money when you go for two 6s or two 27s later, so the saving for you should be for them to keep their single 24 and reduce your cost, and you supply your own batts, or they supply the batts you want and give you the cost of that one 24 off the price of the other batts.

[Sandia_Man]

Wow, what a rip off, first they added warranty to your OTD price, and now what amounts to a few bucks of wiring they want $250. We are from the PHX area, which dealer are you purchasing your TH at so I can tell family and friends to beware. I asked our dealer when we purchased our TH what it would cost to beef up our battery bank, he stated first battery is included, only additional expense would be actual cost of extra batteries, no fake labor or wiring charges. I just asked for giggles anyway, we put a couple of 6 volt golfcart batteries from Samsclub since we mostly boondock and they are much hardier for that type of off grid RVing. Have lots of great times in your new TH!!!

[ApexAZ]

Can anyone recommend a good AGM battery, or are they all similar?

[ApexAZ]

Boon Docker wrote:
Your trailer is going to draw the same amount of amperage whether you have a GR24 or a GR31. So heavier wiring is not needed.
If the $250 charge includes the upgraded AGM batteries then go for it. If it is just for heavier wiring tell them to pound sand.

That's kind of what I was thinking, but I don't know enough about electrical to know if somehow the larger batteries would somehow output more or something. It just seemed off.

So the bigger wire gauge is probably just to run them in series. What's frustrating is that they would have to wire this anyway to put the standard group 24 batteries in, because it comes with 2.

So the $250 labor is to do the batteries and install a larger battery compartment tray on the hitch. Seems like highway robbery to me.

Really appreciate the input. I'll just do it myself.

[countrykids]

X

[Ed_Gee]

Fully agree with Boon Docker... nothing in the coach is changing.... you still can only use so much power no matter how big your batteries are...and your battery charger is only capable of charging at whatever its max charge rate is.... so putting in bigger batteries does NOT require any change in wiring. Your shop is trying to scam you .... or they are idiots.

[Boon_Docker]

Your trailer is going to draw the same amount of amperage whether you have a GR24 or a GR31. So heavier wiring is not needed.
If the $250 charge includes the upgraded AGM batteries then go for it. If it is just for heavier wiring tell them to pound sand.

[countrykids]

Don’t sign until you get the correct answer on this. The dealer may be correct and we are both going to learn something or he is trying to get an extra $ 250. If that is true then you may want to walk away and not do business with him.