Hard start capacitor

[cliffy49]

I have this posted on another forum and don't seem to be getting any answers to the question.

Okay guys, my knowledge of electricity does not even make me dangerous. I have been doing a lot of reading in regards to getting a generator for my toy hauler and came across the term "Hard start capacitor". From what I could gather this works the same as a soft start kit.

If that is true, why would you use one versus the other. The only reason I can find after doing very limited research is that the soft start kit is $300 versus the $10-$15 for the capacitor. If some one could please explain the difference and also the pros and cons for each, I would greatly appreciate it.

Please take it easy on me, as I stated I know nothing about electricity other than don't stick a butter knife in the wall outlet. Thanks for all your help.

[Ron3rd]

Nice job.

[cliffy49]

Ron3rd wrote:

cliffy49 wrote:

TurnThePage wrote:
In your original post you mentioned getting a generator. A hard start cap, or a soft start device may allow you to go with a smaller generator. BUT as already pointed out, if you spend a little extra to get a generator that doesn't need one of those devices, your overall experience will likely be better because you will have plenty of power for anything else that may arise. We purchased a 3400 watt generator that allows us to use our RV pretty much any way we wish without worrying about power.

Also as was pointed out, the place those devices really shine is on questionable shore power.

Actually, the 3100 watt Champion is on my short list. Looking at Amazon, they are currently on sale for $549.00. I just may pull the trigger today.

That's a very good deal. Free Shipping too

Well ordered it yesterday. Should be here by sometime next week. Got the genny and ordered an hour meter for it. About $600 with tax. Best price before the Amazon sale was $775. I did find a refurbed unit for $569 but figured the new one for the same price was a better deal.:B

[Ron3rd]

cliffy49 wrote:

TurnThePage wrote:
In your original post you mentioned getting a generator. A hard start cap, or a soft start device may allow you to go with a smaller generator. BUT as already pointed out, if you spend a little extra to get a generator that doesn't need one of those devices, your overall experience will likely be better because you will have plenty of power for anything else that may arise. We purchased a 3400 watt generator that allows us to use our RV pretty much any way we wish without worrying about power.

Also as was pointed out, the place those devices really shine is on questionable shore power.

Actually, the 3100 watt Champion is on my short list. Looking at Amazon, they are currently on sale for $549.00. I just may pull the trigger today.

That's a very good deal. Free Shipping too

[jjrbus]

Wanted to run my AC with a Honda 2000 but it would not start the 20 year old 11k dometic. Put a Suppco in there they said, one guy even guaranteed it would work.

Son of a gun it worked! In cool weather, someplace between mid 70's and upper 90's it quit working and would fail to start.

Long story, read a lot of misinformation on the net and changed to an 8k window ac, with a hard start. The mighty little Honda runs it under all conditions. Sea level, Mountains, Death Valley, high humidity, never fails to start.

So in my WAG opinion, either a smaller AC or a larger genset is needed. After reading and if I wanted a bigger AC I would try the Micro Air soft start.

I like what I have read about the Champion generators, if I was going to buy one I would get the electric start as going out to start and stop the genset gets old.

[cliffy49]

TurnThePage wrote:
In your original post you mentioned getting a generator. A hard start cap, or a soft start device may allow you to go with a smaller generator. BUT as already pointed out, if you spend a little extra to get a generator that doesn't need one of those devices, your overall experience will likely be better because you will have plenty of power for anything else that may arise. We purchased a 3400 watt generator that allows us to use our RV pretty much any way we wish without worrying about power.

Also as was pointed out, the place those devices really shine is on questionable shore power.

Actually, the 3100 watt Champion is on my short list. Looking at Amazon, they are currently on sale for $549.00. I just may pull the trigger today.

[TurnThePage]

In your original post you mentioned getting a generator. A hard start cap, or a soft start device may allow you to go with a smaller generator. BUT as already pointed out, if you spend a little extra to get a generator that doesn't need one of those devices, your overall experience will likely be better because you will have plenty of power for anything else that may arise. We purchased a 3400 watt generator that allows us to use our RV pretty much any way we wish without worrying about power.

Also as was pointed out, the place those devices really shine is on questionable shore power.

[cliffy49]

cavie wrote:

cliffy49 wrote:
I have this posted on another forum and don't seem to be getting any answers to the question.

Okay guys, my knowledge of electricity does not even make me dangerous. I have been doing a lot of reading in regards to getting a generator for my toy hauler and came across the term "Hard start capacitor". From what I could gather this works the same as a soft start kit.

If that is true, why would you use one versus the other. The only reason I can find after doing very limited research is that the soft start kit is $300 versus the $10-$15 for the capacitor. If some one could please explain the difference and also the pros and cons for each, I would greatly appreciate it.

Please take it easy on me, as I stated I know nothing about electricity other than don't stick a butter knife in the wall outlet. Thanks for all your help.

I may have been involved if the other forum. Hard start Cap and soft start are tow very different things. Soft start ramps up the voltage slowly. It is best for a low voltage situation on newer equipment and marginal impassivity on 30 amp services. Hard start is just a larger "Kick in the ass" on start up usually used of older compresses. That being said, I am an electrician and use a Hard start on my 2011 A/C because I have a constant low voltage problem in my camp ground and I am cheap. If you have a newer unit on 30 amps I would go with the Soft Start. If say 5 years or older go with the hard start. Neither will do damage to your unit.

Cavie, thank you. This is the simplistic type of answer I was looking for.

As for some of the others, I am sorry I took up your time with my question. Going forward, if all you have for an answer is search, I would prefer that you don't even take the time to respond. If I had enough knowledge about electricity a search would have been sufficient. As my knowledge is very limited I was hoping that I could get an answer here. Yeah, I know this is a little harsh, but I always thought that the ide of the forum was to help those of us that needed it. Sorry for the rant but sometimes you just got to unload.

Mods, if this is inappropriate I apologize and you can do as you see fit with this post.

[cavie]

cliffy49 wrote:
I have this posted on another forum and don't seem to be getting any answers to the question.

Okay guys, my knowledge of electricity does not even make me dangerous. I have been doing a lot of reading in regards to getting a generator for my toy hauler and came across the term "Hard start capacitor". From what I could gather this works the same as a soft start kit.

If that is true, why would you use one versus the other. The only reason I can find after doing very limited research is that the soft start kit is $300 versus the $10-$15 for the capacitor. If some one could please explain the difference and also the pros and cons for each, I would greatly appreciate it.

Please take it easy on me, as I stated I know nothing about electricity other than don't stick a butter knife in the wall outlet. Thanks for all your help.

I may have been involved if the other forum. Hard start Cap and soft start are tow very different things. Soft start ramps up the voltage slowly. It is best for a low voltage situation on newer equipment and marginal impassivity on 30 amp services. Hard start is just a larger "Kick in the ass" on start up usually used of older compresses. That being said, I am an electrician and use a Hard start on my 2011 A/C because I have a constant low voltage problem in my camp ground and I am cheap. If you have a newer unit on 30 amps I would go with the Soft Start. If say 5 years or older go with the hard start. Neither will do damage to your unit.

[theoldwizard1]

Mike134 wrote:
Not so sure the micro air uses that old school method of starting motors. Have to deal with the heat from the resistors and the unit comes in a sealed plastic housing. I've serviced a few industrial motors and those reduced voltage starters using resistors you described get replaced with either soft starters or if speed control is desired VFDs.

Bottom line is you have to limit that huge start current spike. The cheapest way is a resistor. As for heat. The resistor is only "in the circuit" for less than a couple of seconds.

Industrial motors to me implies 3 phase. That is a whole different kettle of fish but a variable frequency device (VFD) work very well.

[STBRetired]

A hard start capacitor changes the phasing between the voltage and the current in the motor windings to increase the amount of torque generated. It can actually cause an increase in starting load on you generator. It is NOT what you want.

[Mike134]

Getting just a wee bit technical ... a "soft starter" temporarily switches a current limiting resistor inline (series) with the motor windings. It then removes the resistor after a few seconds (deluxe models may monitor the current and keep the resistor in the circuit until the current drops below a certain value).

Not so sure the micro air uses that old school method of starting motors. Have to deal with the heat from the resistors and the unit comes in a sealed plastic housing. I've serviced a few industrial motors and those reduced voltage starters using resistors you described get replaced with either soft starters or if speed control is desired VFDs.

[philh]

get EZ start instead.

[troubledwaters]

Put the $300 into a bigger generator. The increased wattage is much more useful for all kinds of other uses around the house and the toy hauler. The soft start is a one trick pony, wattage has multiple uses.

[Lwiddis]

X2, mike. OP, do some more reading.