Rec/Con fuse shutting off

[CarolineGates]

Hi, I live full-time in my 2010 Cougar fifth wheel. I know it is a light-use unit so I try to take good care of it. Like others, I do worry about fire.

For the first time in the three years I have owned this unit a breaker has shut off.

It is the Rec/Con breaker. I understand that stands for receptacle circuit and converter.

I don't know what those mean, receptacle circuit and converter.

Doesn't sound good. It has shut off twice in the past three days.

I would appreciate someone telling me what Rec/Con means in simple terms and what I should do about this, if anything. Any info would be appreciated.

[CarolineGates]

I hope to find out about the battery charge tomorrow, Wedesday when my friend comes to Bandon to help with all this stuff.

One of my heaters (remember I run them at only half of the 1500 has been on the GFI all along. That is in the bedroom. The fireplace style heater is in the living room. Now that my propane is leaking somewhere (we will work on that tomorrow to find the leak) I have just those two heaters that give me a total of 1500 in the entire RV, so with temps in the 20's and 30's and now 40's at night lately it is not warm in the morning, but I get "solar" heat from the sun and it can get quite warm.

[MrWizard]

What was the out come of the battery test,
Is it good , bad, on its way out?

[red31]

I think I'd use the GFI and the MICRO circuits for the heaters, gotta turn off the heat to mico or make coffee.

In a popup the A/C plugs in and that is what I used for electric heater.

[wa8yxm]

You are correct that REC/CON is Recepticals and Converter.

Depending on your converter it can easily draw up to 10 amps (Take the last two digits of the model number and divide by 10, write that number down, now divide by 5 write that number down, add the two together and that's the peak draw).

Add to that whatever is plugged in. Heaters. Fans. Hair Dryers. Deep Fryer. And you have the click of darkness.

The solution on the converter is to let the battery charge, as the battery charges the needs go down down down to the point where the converter with FULLY charge batteries is in the single amp range.

[j-d]

Here's Caroline's panel.

She emailed the pic to me and I've uploaded it and linked it here. She's ordered a new 15/15 breaker for that circuit.

We have those Cutler-Hammer siamese breakers in our coach. I found two circuits on one pole of one of them, and a blank space in the box. Split those two apart, and used the second pole of a new breaker to add a dedicated 15A outlet for an electric heater. This at least divides some of the load.

Case pends...

[Charlie_D_]

j-d wrote:

CarolineGates wrote:
Member from Sunny Florida suggested to leave the MAIN ON, every branch circuit OFF and then power up one branch at a time so map out which outlets are powered by each breaker....

By "branch circuit" do you mean turn off the switches for a/c, GFI, hot water, micro? Just leave main on, then use the tester/I will try a night lite.

Exactly! You got it! The idea is to test one circuit at a time and see which outlets each one feeds. You may find one branch/breaker/circuit is all outlets/receptacles on one end or one side of your Cougar. That way, you can be sure to plug high-wattage stuff into separate CIRCUITS, not just separate Outlets in the same Circuit.

I'd sure love to see a picture of your breaker box and it's labeling as to what they say feeds what.

No electrician but the OP second sentence makes no sense to me. What does make sense is to turn off all breakers then turn 1 breaker on at a time. Check every outlet to determine what each breaker energizes.

[CarolineGates]

The breaker is 15. I might have mentioned that in a previous post, this conversation has been a long one. I have explained that my heaters are 1,500 each like most space heaters are. I have never and do not run them at 1,500. I run each at half that in two different rooms. I have done this three years in this rig and seven years in my old Alfa. I have ordered a new breaker which will be here Tuesday. My Cougar is not a big fancy RV, it is lite and probably not built very well, but it is all I have. Meanwhile, we expect a hard freeze here on the South Oregon Coast down to 28 from Wed-Fri. I will be running my propane furnace during that time and also my living room heater at half. I already have the meter as mentioned before and will be checking everything by Tuesday. We have a holiday coming up and my town of 2,000 shuts down, nothing open. I got 1.7 inches of rain overnight, snow in the mtns. I will let y'all know how things work out, thanks for your help, and I am sure your comments will be very helpful to someone else down the line. I don't see a place to add photos, but I have them.

[Bobbo]

CarolineGates wrote:
Member from Sunny Florida suggested to leave the MAIN ON, every branch circuit OFF and then power up one branch at a time so map out which outlets are powered by each breaker....

By "branch circuit" do you mean turn off the switches for a/c, GFI, hot water, micro? Just leave main on, then use the tester/I will try a night lite.

This is good information to have. Mine:

1. GFCI outlet at entrance door, also protecting outside outlet, kitchen outlet, bathroom outlet.

2. Hallway outlet, slideout outlet, bedroom outlet (by bed).

3. GFCI protected, inverter fed entertainment center outlets in front cabover and rear bedroom.

I have considered putting a GFCI outlet in the hallway, the first outlet in that string. All outlets would then be GFCI protected.

[westend]

The method to use to diagnose your problem is "Isolation". You want to break it down in easily observed pieces.

Also, answer some specific questions that are asked here. Do both heaters turn off when the breaker trips? The answer to that will isolate the problem to a single branch circuit.

Removing the battery cable from a battery terminal will isolate the problem to the converter circuit if all works in that situation.

[MEXICOWANDERER]

You did not state the amperage capacity of the breaker.

1,500 watts for both heaters PLUS the load of the converter, all on the same circuit, IS TOO MUCH AMPERAGE FOR LONG TERM 15-AMP RATED BREAKER RELIABILITY.

Pushed always at or near max capacity, a circuit breaker may live a THIRD as long as a breaker kicking back with say 300 watts will live.

Look at the breaker. Is it stamped "!5"?

Matter-of-fact, follow this troubleshooting technique. Costs NOTHING.

Load the breaker exactly like you do when it trips. However long it took to trip the other times, you need to feel the safe side with your fingers and see if it is warm. Is it warm to the touch?

If YES STOP RIGHT THERE!

Pull the shore power connection to make safe the entire rig.

With a screwdriver remove the screws holding the COVER to the box. The breaker is removed from the box by pulling up on the bottom end (outwards). Look INTENSELY at the wire that goes into the breaker and is fixed with a screw. Is the insulation at the end discolored in the least? Wiggle the wire. New good wire is not super soft. Overheated wire bends like solder after being hot for weeks or months.

Breakers are INEXPENSIVE. A replacement will tell you everything you need to know. Install it and run it. If it eventually trips, you have another problem. If the wire end was scorched, REPLACE THE BREAKER. Shine up the copper part of the wire. As long as you're here, check ALL OTHER SCREWS, every last one inside the box for tightness.

This is low-grade troubleshooting. Not rocket science. Save your money and then you do the simple job.

[CarolineGates]

Here is my heater set up. I have an elec fireplace with max of 1500. I run it on 750 or 800, whichever it is in a living room outlet. The other heater is about 12" x 10" and it is in the bedroom plugged into the wall where the red button is on the outlet (forget its name). It also I NEVER run them each at 1500 watts. I have run this this way for 3 yrs. The little heater is about four months old. It has a switch that is OFF/FAN/750w low/and 1500 high. It ALSO has a dial/thermostat that can reduce the heat at either 750 or 1500. I never use the 1500. I think the heater is fine. I will be having this checked by someone soon. I live in a fairly remote area on the south Oregon coast. In the next town north is Coos Bay/North Bend and there are several RV places there, but they want $180 just to drive their van to Bandon and back, plus the cost of the work and parts. So I have to try to figure this out myself first.

[j-d]

CarolineGates wrote:
Member from Sunny Florida suggested to leave the MAIN ON, every branch circuit OFF and then power up one branch at a time so map out which outlets are powered by each breaker....

By "branch circuit" do you mean turn off the switches for a/c, GFI, hot water, micro? Just leave main on, then use the tester/I will try a night lite.

Exactly! You got it! The idea is to test one circuit at a time and see which outlets each one feeds. You may find one branch/breaker/circuit is all outlets/receptacles on one end or one side of your Cougar. That way, you can be sure to plug high-wattage stuff into separate CIRCUITS, not just separate Outlets in the same Circuit.

I'd sure love to see a picture of your breaker box and it's labeling as to what they say feeds what.

[Charlie_D_]

Bad heater?

[MEXICOWANDERER]

TWO HEATERS GOING

Do BOTH shut off when the circuit breaker clicks off? Next time it does it, check BOTH heaters and see if they are playing possum.

The combination of 2 heaters going plus a converter on a SINGLE breaker may have "tired out" the one single circuit breaker. Breakers that "live" at or near their trip point, do not last nearly as long.