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3/4 Ton as Dedicated TV?

jbloch
Explorer
Explorer
I appreciate all the expertise from the contributors to this forum. The amount of misinformation we've received from dealers/salespeople is discouraging, so it's great to have a forum like this with people who actually tow!

We are planning on stepping up to a Forest River Salem 30QBSS:

Dry weight = 6575
GVWR = 9780
Hitch weight = 980

This also means we will need to step up in TV class.

We stopped at a Ford dealer to look at F150/250s and were told the Expedition could pull that TT weight with no problem, but right off the bat the max tongue weight for the Expedition (with WD) is only 920# which seems to eliminate it right away.

We have two kids and would prefer to pull this with a full-size SUV but a ~'05 Suburban 8.1 is probably not an option for us, so I'm starting to focus on a slightly older 3/4 ton truck to use as a dedicated TV.

I would appreciate any input anybody would like to provide. I've learned a lot looking throughout this forum but every situation is a little different so just wanted to post mine. Thank you ahead of time.
65 REPLIES 65

Acdii
Explorer
Explorer
Yes, but it is also a very informative thread 🙂 It helped me make a decision on trailers easier, so think of it as my way of saying, Thanks! 🙂

JIMNLIN
Explorer
Explorer
B-n-B wrote:
Holy dead thread Batman! :S

LOL...yeah looks like the weight police get to beat the dead horse some more. :Z
"good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" ............ Will Rogers

'03 2500 QC Dodge/Cummins HO 3.73 6 speed manual Jacobs Westach
'97 Park Avanue 28' 5er 11200 two slides

4Kellys
Explorer
Explorer
And remember it's just a rating, Weigh your truck with everything in it for a trip including gas. Subtract that from the truck's GVWR and that's your payload. When I did that my payload dropped by 450lbs.

B-n-B
Explorer III
Explorer III
Holy dead thread Batman! :S
2019 Chevy 3500HD LTZ DRW
2025 Bigfoot 10.4

Acdii
Explorer
Explorer
Interesting discussion. Something I found out long ago, the only difference between an F250 and the F350(except Dually) is one leaf spring. Everything else is identical. I had an F350 Dually and while I was waiting for service I took a walk out to the new trucks and compared the two, they were side by side so that made it easy. Both were the same configuration, 4x4, long beds, supercabs. I counted leaves and the 350 had one more than the 250, all the rest of the components were the same, including the axles, both happened to have the same gear ratios. Both were also power strokes, 6.0 turbo eaters. What it boils down to in this case is that sticker on the door. You pay a lot extra for 4 leaf spring leaves and a sticker going 3/4 to 1 ton, unless it's a dually. I wish I could afford a dedicated TV, I would snap up another F350 Dually diesel in a moment. Great tow vehicle and not that bad a daily driver, but a maintenance ***** when used as a DD. Be prepared to dish out $100 every 5K miles for an oil change. I hitched up to my New Yorker HT and it pulled like there was nothing back there. Had to keep looking back to make sure it was still there.

As for the F150's, they have some of the strongest frames in the 1/2T market. Hydro formed tubes, not channels like the Superduty I had. My F150 has a stronger frame than my Dually did. What it does boil down to, and was pretty much pointed out very well is the axle rates. Mine has a 4050# rear axle, front is 3450#. That adds up to 7500#. GVWR is 7100#, with the 3:15 gears it equates to a GCWR of 14,500#. So provided you can keep the TW in the payload range, you can pull up to a 7000# trailer. Trailers I am looking at fall into the 7000# GVWR. I may go a little over the Payload rating, I feel it is way under rated at 1470# for a RWD 5.5' truck. Heck I loaded nearly 2000# into a 1979 Ford LTD wagon and it hauled and stopped just fine, due to the magic of air shocks. The rear axle is not much different than what is on my F150, standard 9" axle.

Just to be sure of the numbers though, going to load all the people in and take it to the scales. I have no need to have anything in the bed, not planning to take a lot with us, just clothes, food, and other essentials. No bikes, or other gear. I know by myself I can pull either trailer I am looking at and be way under payload, but add in 4 others, 2 adults and two kids and its going to be a little over by maybe 200-300#, but still within the 7100# GVWR of the truck itself. I pulled my New Yorker HT with it and it felt like it was back there, unlike the Dually, but the EB definitely has the power to pull it. It's about the same weight rating as the TT I am looking into. It just has a lower COG than a TT, which makes for a more stable platform.

So with that said, unless you are going to pull a TT of 7000# gross or lower, don't use the F150 as the TV.

Oh BTW, reason I even popped into this thread, I was doing a search for a Wildwood 30QBSS to find out its TW and other specs and this was the first that popped up, and pretty much answered my question. Yes my F150 can tow it, but it would be over the top of rated specs, so I ruled that trailer out. Looks like the KZ Frontier 2405 is leading the pack. Its ratings are all falling right where I need them to. Its not much longer than my New Yorker and its GVWR is the same with a lighter wet TW.

lbrjet
Explorer
Explorer
The HD version of the F150 has been around for a long time, it is not new with aluminum. Ford actually decreased the GVWR on 2015 F150 trucks, including the HD, making the aluminum difference in payload almost negligible as the payloads are only slightly higher than prior years.
2010 F250 4X4 5.4L 3.73 LS
2011 Flagstaff 831FKBSS
Equalizer E4 1200/12000

RoyBell
Explorer
Explorer
JIMNLIN wrote:
RoyBell wrote:
Curious as how Ford can increase payload so much over other half tons. Is it the Aluminum body, beefier springs? What are the axle ratings?

Because they use a higher 7850 GVWR than other 1/2 tons.
One poster mentioned look at the numbers.
Ok lets do some math.......real numbers.
Any F150 out here cannot carry 2650 lb payload in the bed of the truck. Even the F150 HD with those bigger 4800 RAWR will be over loaded when placing all 2650 lbs in the bed such as a truck camper or 5th wheel or load of RR ties from the farm and ranch store.
The F150 super crew 4x4 truck may weigh 2500 lbs on the rear axle (probably more).
Now add 2650 lbs in the bed.
According to the math 2500 plus 2650 = 5150 lbs for a overloaded 4800 rear axle/wheels and rear suspension.

The most a F150 HD with a 4800 RAWR can carry in the bed is around 2300-2400 lbs before the rear axle is over loaded.

GVWR payloads will be placed over the trucks front and rear axles such as a plumbers over head rack that sits in the bed and the front of the trucks frame.

Years back a 1/2 ton might of had 6200-6600 GVWR and 3800-3900 RAWR so a GVWR payload didn't over load the trucks RAWR.

As was mentione look at the numbers. Then do some math.


Are the axles really 4800lbs?

Ford.com lists curb weight of F150 double cab, 6' bed 4x4 with the 3.5 EB as 4600lbs curb weight.

Assuming 40% over the rear, that's 1840 lbs,

Payload is listed as 2170 lbs for this model. Together that= 4010 lbs, which should be good for most any half ton pickup (my Tundra rear is rated about 4020 lbs I believe).

Not sure what HD raises what to because their site sucks. But if the axles really are upgraded to 4800 lbs I could see payload increasing from 2170lbs to 2970 lbs.

Bravo to Ford for making a light truck. I see where the savings is now. My truck weighs almost 1000 lbs more than the same type of V8 F150. The benefit of the Aluminum body is higher payload/towing.

JIMNLIN
Explorer
Explorer
RoyBell wrote:
Curious as how Ford can increase payload so much over other half tons. Is it the Aluminum body, beefier springs? What are the axle ratings?

Because they use a higher 7850 GVWR than other 1/2 tons.
One poster mentioned look at the numbers.
Ok lets do some math.......real numbers.
Any F150 out here cannot carry 2650 lb payload in the bed of the truck. Even the F150 HD with those bigger 4800 RAWR will be over loaded when placing all 2650 lbs in the bed such as a truck camper or 5th wheel or load of RR ties from the farm and ranch store.
The F150 super crew 4x4 truck may weigh 2500 lbs on the rear axle (probably more).
Now add 2650 lbs in the bed.
According to the math 2500 plus 2650 = 5150 lbs for a overloaded 4800 rear axle/wheels and rear suspension.

The most a F150 HD with a 4800 RAWR can carry in the bed is around 2300-2400 lbs before the rear axle is over loaded.

GVWR payloads will be placed over the trucks front and rear axles such as a plumbers over head rack that sits in the bed and the front of the trucks frame.

Years back a 1/2 ton might of had 6200-6600 GVWR and 3800-3900 RAWR so a GVWR payload didn't over load the trucks RAWR.

As was mentione look at the numbers. Then do some math.
"good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" ............ Will Rogers

'03 2500 QC Dodge/Cummins HO 3.73 6 speed manual Jacobs Westach
'97 Park Avanue 28' 5er 11200 two slides

Samsonsworld
Explorer
Explorer
Boondoc wrote:
You will be getting 8-11 mpg,.


Yep...unloaded.

Boondoc
Explorer
Explorer
I recommend an F250 with the V10 6.8L, same engine used in F550 tow trucks, gas Class A motorhomes, and many other applications. Extremely reliable motor. You will be getting 8-11 mpg, but no loud diesel noise, more fill up options, and cheaper than diesel. Avoid Ford Diesels. You can go Dodge Cummins, good motor but you pay a premium for it and the Dodge trucks are******quality.

RoyBell
Explorer
Explorer
hawkeye-08 wrote:

I think the big mistake is folks look at tow rating (I know I did at first), not realizing that the payload or hitch specs are going to come into play before tow rating in most cases with travel trailer...


This. 12,000 lb tow rating sounds awesome until you look at payload, axle ratings, and hitch rating. Then you realize your 11,000 lb TT will pull the hitch right off the bumper if it doesn't snap your axles in half first 😄

Samsonsworld
Explorer
Explorer
hawkeye-08 wrote:
Folks should stop thinking of needing a 1/2 ton or 3/4 ton or 1 ton, but rather work the numbers for their setup (or proposed setup). There are many capable trucks out there, get the one that meets your needs.

Please don't assume from post above that all Ford F150s have a 2650lb payload, but there are some. The door sticker is your friend.. Some 3/4ton pickups have dismal payload ratings.

I think the big mistake is folks look at tow rating (I know I did at first), not realizing that the payload or hitch specs are going to come into play before tow rating in most cases with travel trailer...

We have a 3/4ton that is my occasional driver (I work from home), but otherwise is dedicated to towing.


I agree 100%.

hawkeye-08
Explorer III
Explorer III
Folks should stop thinking of needing a 1/2 ton or 3/4 ton or 1 ton, but rather work the numbers for their setup (or proposed setup). There are many capable trucks out there, get the one that meets your needs.

Please don't assume from post above that all Ford F150s have a 2650lb payload, but there are some. The door sticker is your friend.. Some 3/4ton pickups have dismal payload ratings.

I think the big mistake is folks look at tow rating (I know I did at first), not realizing that the payload or hitch specs are going to come into play before tow rating in most cases with travel trailer...

We have a 3/4ton that is my occasional driver (I work from home), but otherwise is dedicated to towing.

RoyBell
Explorer
Explorer
Curious as how Ford can increase payload so much over other half tons. Is it the Aluminum body, beefier springs? What are the axle ratings?