Death of an Excursion
...
I think my gasser 2000 Excursion may be done for, at about 115k on the odometer.
Today I stopped at NAPA to check on cost and immediate availability of a new (not rebuilt) starter. For the few minutes I was in the store, I let my Ex idle outside, as it was just starting to blow a bit of interior heat from the short trip from home.
Apparently during my few minutes absence, the V-10 lost all oil pressure while I was in the store. As I returned, I could hear rather loud lifter noise, not unlike a smallblock chevy I once heard that was out of oil. A quick check of the dash revealed the oil light and no readable pressure on the guage, so I shut it off. It has plenty of clean oil (changed @ about 1500 miles), no leaks. It has always had excellent oil pressure in the past.
It was idling so smooth too....
The engine is normally reasonably quiet on start-up and very quiet after about 30-45 seconds. The starter engagement solenoid has recently been failing to make contact for the run-motor phase in below zero F temps, but it started right up this morning with temps around 30F. The trip to the store was only about 5 minutes. Just lucky it wasn't a few days later, where I would have installed the new starter ($180).
With the dead truck parked in NAPA's lot for the night, I called my wife for a ride and did some hasty checking with local service shops. This is probably beyond me and my shop/lift bay is temporarily filled with a relatives furniture right now. Nobody has much of an idea what would cause such a sudden catastrophic loss of oil pressure at idle. Many shops don't like to work internally on the Triton motors because of special tools needed for major overhaul.
My favorite shop (Ford truck guy) estimated at least about $450 for R&I (remove & install) of the engine because it will supposedly have to be lifted to pull the pan (crankcase) and look. Hopefully, just a loose sump, or failed oil pump could be replaced thusly. It shouldn't have spun a bearing at idle, and that assembly is still quiet, a good sign. I questioned the camshafts too, until I realised that they are roller cams. Flat tappet overhead cams are touchy about lubrication, often wiping the cams when insufficient lube happens. The rollers are probably ok yet. Hope.
So far the best guess was a young fellow at the Ford dealer that noted that the 5.4L V-8's occasionally drop a "fiber" thrust washer off the crankshaft and lose all oil pressure to the top end. One might assume that the similar V-10 has the same thrust management. I asked if the washer was two-piece... "No". I asked if it was installed over the snout then... "No".
I asked, "New Engine?" The answer was, "Yes". By that, I wonder how Ford gets the washers on new cranks?
This is an aging $8000 truck and a rebuilt long-block engine cost about $5k. Installation at Ford is about $1800 more.
I would consider a used engine, but they are almost all high mileage now. I am also still looking at $2500-3000, and I'm not too fond of the 2-valve blown sparkplug syndrome. Every 100k miles, new plugs are due and it appears unpredictable whether they will stay in place the first time, let alone the second 100k "tune-up". Already did that once ($800)... and then noted an oddball coil pack replacement on another cylinder, so maybe done twice.
I don't know what previous owners did for sure, the bain of "pre-owned". I did get Ford service records that implied reasonable care, including the 1st 100k plugs done by the dealer, which I unfortunately took as a plus.
While back at the NAPA store, I was able to look at a blow-apart picture of the main bearings, and sure enough, there appears to be no usual "saddle-shaped" center main with thrust surfaces, and they did have a separate part number for "thrust-spacers", although nothing in stock. In spite of the Ford techs analysis, it might be possible to replace these afterall, if that indeed is the problem.
Anybody else got any more ideas?
Thanks,
Wes
...
I think my gasser 2000 Excursion may be done for, at about 115k on the odometer.
Today I stopped at NAPA to check on cost and immediate availability of a new (not rebuilt) starter. For the few minutes I was in the store, I let my Ex idle outside, as it was just starting to blow a bit of interior heat from the short trip from home.
Apparently during my few minutes absence, the V-10 lost all oil pressure while I was in the store. As I returned, I could hear rather loud lifter noise, not unlike a smallblock chevy I once heard that was out of oil. A quick check of the dash revealed the oil light and no readable pressure on the guage, so I shut it off. It has plenty of clean oil (changed @ about 1500 miles), no leaks. It has always had excellent oil pressure in the past.
It was idling so smooth too....
The engine is normally reasonably quiet on start-up and very quiet after about 30-45 seconds. The starter engagement solenoid has recently been failing to make contact for the run-motor phase in below zero F temps, but it started right up this morning with temps around 30F. The trip to the store was only about 5 minutes. Just lucky it wasn't a few days later, where I would have installed the new starter ($180).
With the dead truck parked in NAPA's lot for the night, I called my wife for a ride and did some hasty checking with local service shops. This is probably beyond me and my shop/lift bay is temporarily filled with a relatives furniture right now. Nobody has much of an idea what would cause such a sudden catastrophic loss of oil pressure at idle. Many shops don't like to work internally on the Triton motors because of special tools needed for major overhaul.
My favorite shop (Ford truck guy) estimated at least about $450 for R&I (remove & install) of the engine because it will supposedly have to be lifted to pull the pan (crankcase) and look. Hopefully, just a loose sump, or failed oil pump could be replaced thusly. It shouldn't have spun a bearing at idle, and that assembly is still quiet, a good sign. I questioned the camshafts too, until I realised that they are roller cams. Flat tappet overhead cams are touchy about lubrication, often wiping the cams when insufficient lube happens. The rollers are probably ok yet. Hope.
So far the best guess was a young fellow at the Ford dealer that noted that the 5.4L V-8's occasionally drop a "fiber" thrust washer off the crankshaft and lose all oil pressure to the top end. One might assume that the similar V-10 has the same thrust management. I asked if the washer was two-piece... "No". I asked if it was installed over the snout then... "No".
I asked, "New Engine?" The answer was, "Yes". By that, I wonder how Ford gets the washers on new cranks?
This is an aging $8000 truck and a rebuilt long-block engine cost about $5k. Installation at Ford is about $1800 more.
I would consider a used engine, but they are almost all high mileage now. I am also still looking at $2500-3000, and I'm not too fond of the 2-valve blown sparkplug syndrome. Every 100k miles, new plugs are due and it appears unpredictable whether they will stay in place the first time, let alone the second 100k "tune-up". Already did that once ($800)... and then noted an oddball coil pack replacement on another cylinder, so maybe done twice.
I don't know what previous owners did for sure, the bain of "pre-owned". I did get Ford service records that implied reasonable care, including the 1st 100k plugs done by the dealer, which I unfortunately took as a plus.
While back at the NAPA store, I was able to look at a blow-apart picture of the main bearings, and sure enough, there appears to be no usual "saddle-shaped" center main with thrust surfaces, and they did have a separate part number for "thrust-spacers", although nothing in stock. In spite of the Ford techs analysis, it might be possible to replace these afterall, if that indeed is the problem.
Anybody else got any more ideas?
Thanks,
Wes
...
