Diesel vs gas......................

[blt2ski]

OK folks, there have been a few to many diesel vs gas threads that have shall we say gone to "Hell and a hand basket"! So if all of you would put in you BEST, no flaming reasons for going gas vs diesel, pro and con, I will either leave your thread, or copy and paste pertinant info to the 4 posts of pro and con of diesel or gas. This can include the GM 8.1 vs Dmax or Ford V-8/10 vs PSD etc too.

Be real and honest in you answers, not hear say, flaming etc PLEASE!

If posts are good ones, I will leave, if inflamatory or trolling in nature, they will be deleted! I will get this stick'd to the top for future parusing for those that need this type of info.

Added 6-23-04

We are getting closer to answers I am looking for etc.

Stuff like Ken's - T-Bone posts are good. There are a few others of you that have not posted, some with a 9 point question and answer type to figure out how you went with one or the other. If you are one of those, PLEASE repost in this thread. I may have to look up whom has done this and PM you, but if you think this is you, you now know what to do.

Also, for those of you with $ per gallon for either fuel right now, I would prefer to see a post with ...."in my area, diesel is typically .10 less than unleaded" then explain your numbers. As currently in the Seattle area, diesel and unleaded are any where from 2.05 -2.30 per gallon, with mid test .10 more and premium about .20 more, with equal high low splits. Two weeks ago those prices were upwards of .30 -.40 per gallon more. people were posting $ per gallon that were for me. "I wish" If someone is reading your post a year from now, they may want to know where your paying 1.65, when the price of fuel is over $3 per gallon. Let's keep prices out of it if possible.

Bert and tin tipi, got into a good discusion on the pros and cons of RPM's, drive train etc. I would prefer to NOT see the quote of the other in responding threads, maybe just write a quick wording of re tranny gearing, instead of the whole 40 words or so in that paragragh, so the repsonse is shorter if possible quicker and easier to read etc.

I have deleted some 15+/- posts, that were off topic etc. Please note, I am trying to keep this at the top, as the ONLY gas/diesel thread in this area. So if one is trying to decide, we do not have to go thru this BS any more. As such, I will be deleting ANY future posts close to resembling this type of topic. I may have to change "this" title to a better one, if one has a better sounding title, to be more positive, better claification, let me know here, or in a PM/e-mail, what ever you feel most comfortible with.

Again thank you for all of you that are keeping responses positive, etc.

Also we could use a few more positive reasons to go gas, as many can see I have both gas and diesel, both have a place! Both have positive reasons to buy that fuel, lets keep the threads etc to that purpose only!

Marty

[usmc7277]

my 6.0 diesel is great! i dont know why anybody wouldnt want one if they are pulling a trailer. i added a few aftermarket performance parts and WOW great performance and economy! i purchaced my add on from vehicle specialities and they did a great job!

good camping happy holidays

[hone_eagle]

bert-Kapuskasing 1970, christmas, our jeep gasser started every day outside,no they weren't pugged in(the cummins,duramax,psd's) and i don't think they were running or we would not have got any sleep as they were right outside the door.when i said they started they started,they didn't like it, lotsa smoke and clatter but they ran. ya i know at 40 below all bets are off but i was illustrating to our southern neighbours that at around zero they should'nt worry(of course all systems like batteries,fuel etc. must be in top condition)

[Schlickenmeyer]

I had my '01 Cummins start in -13 with out any help. Sure, I plug in when I can, did that with my cars too. Just being nice. But the new Cummins I believe is factory spec to -20 no plug in. (If you have good batteries, etc..). A lot of cars won't do that. So they are getting better as they evolve.

[BertP]

Sweetpete I live north of you and never have trouble starting,in fact been up north of Sudbarry and saw all three makes of diesels start in temps that are the same in both F and C ,lined up in front of the motel they clattered but started up no problems and they could'nt plug them in.love my truck to

Start at -40??? Gassers won't do that. I lived in Yellowknife (about 600 miles north of Edmonton) for 10 years and am quite familiar with the cold. No engine will start at -40 without some external source of heat to warm them up or a great deal of persuation in the form of ether. At that temperature, you would be lucky to get the engine to turn over because the battery is likely frozen. There is a reason for those electric battery blankets.

As for diesels, many dealers here in the Edmonton area routinely tow their brand new diesels into the shop to warm them up so they will start at temperatures a hell of a lot warmer than -40. I plug my DMax in if it is going to be colder than -10.

[OnEdit} Those diesels you saw running outside a hotel in Ontario were probably left running all night. That is quite common in the colder climes because if you shut them off, you have to wait until Spring to get them going again 🙂

Bert

[hone_eagle]

Sweetpete I live north of you and never have trouble starting,in fact been up north of Sudbarry and saw all three makes of diesels start in temps that are the same in both F and C ,lined up in front of the motel they clattered but started up no problems and they could'nt plug them in.love my truck to

[SweetPete]

I love my gas engine. My brother has a PSD w/ 110000 miles on it. He says that even if he plugs it in at night, it sometimes has trouble starting in the morning. Here in Cleveland, it gets pretty cold. Anyways, with that being said, I just like the "no hassle" start up of a gasser. No plug-in, no troubles. Not to mention, what happens if I'm on a job site and my truck has been sitting all day in the cold. I just don't like thinking that I'd have to plug it in just to get home.

So...there's my $.02 It might not be a great reason to avoid diesel, but for now, it works for me. Either way, I LOVE TRUCKS!!

[DutchAndBarb]

I guess the best thing about this forum is that everyone is allowed their own opinion!:B:W:W

[DutchAndBarb]

The best thing about the forum??? Everyone is allowed their opinion. :B:B

[c_traveler2]

I went with diesel mainly for the longivity of the truck. Even with diesel prices on the high side here in Calif. I don't have any regets about my truck..F250/6.0/ext cb/lb/camper pkg...2004:C

[djs523]

Gas vs Diesel - Economics.

The diesel gas specs have been changing and will evolve to ultra low sulfur diesel in 06. Right now diesel supply is low and will continue low for on road diesel as refining capacity to make low and ultra low sulfur diesel constrains the market. More manufacturing will move to #2 fuel oil as the investment to meet the low sulfur demainds is a steep one.

You are beginning to see legislation proposed (currently one bill in NJ) requiring the retrofiting of all diesel engines to reduce particulate and emissions.

[crickeydog]

Tow Vehicle: 1996 Ford F-250 4X4 Diesel Supercab, Auto, 4.10, 75HP chip.
Trailer: 2004 Holiday Rambler Presidential 30' 5th Wheel

Total mileage towed for 2004: 5280 miles to date.
Average MPG towing for 2004: 12.4 MPG

Truck has 91000 miles and except for routine maintenance (I'm a fanatic about maintenance) and an upgraded tranny and torque converter, it's been "Old Reliable" or as we've nicknamed her; "The White Shadow". The truck is used only for towing. We routinely tow between Chatanooga, Tn. and Nashville, Tn. climbing Monteagle's 7% grade in 4th gear (overdrive) at 65MPH, EGT 900 degrees, Trans. Temp 195 degrees, 150 ft. lbs of boost. No soot, no smell. When "The White Shadow" finally blows up, we'll salute her, bury her on the road, and replace it with another diesel.

[crickeydog]

x

[RJDake]

if all of you would put in you BEST, no flaming reasons for going gas vs diesel, pro and con,

Marty,

My interest in Diesel vs Gas (as driver) is the torque. But that isn't the whole story. The efficiency of a diesel is pretty significant (check the BTU performance on the sites below) and lends itself to many modifications, including the ability to use Biodiesel (fuel from soybeans and that yucky leftover stuff your french fries have given up on).

I think it is imperative that we begin thinking beyond petroleum and even though ethanol may work with gasoline, you will probably get a better "bang for the buck" with biodiesel!

The threads have made me get out and start researching ... here are a few sites (including the engine manufacturers):
http://www.dieselforum.org/index.html
http://www.dieselpub.com/
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/diesel.htm
http://www.dieselnet.com/
http://www.detroitdiesel.com/
http://www.duramaxdiesel.com/
http://www.cummins.com/cmi/content.jsp?siteId=1&langId=1033&menuId=6&overviewId=0&menuIndex=0
http://www.cat.com/cda/layout?m=8703&x=7
http://www.bath.ac.uk/~ccsshb/12cyl/

Happy hunting everyone!
RJ

[OLD_EASY]

I don't know any one who likes the smell of diesel fuel and the fumes from diesels,how many times do you go into stations that handle diesel fuel and have to walk threw a mess some has made filling there diesel tank, I drove diesels and repaired them for over 35 years, now that I retired I wouldn,t own one, they are the fair weather machine, when it gets really nasty They fail, they break down in the winter more than any other time, they can break the average person trying to buy fuel, you don,t dare shut them off when it gets 10 degrees or less or they won,t start, I know you aren't going that far north, but s___ hapens beyond our control. I would like some of you hi mpg get that milage in very cold weather, and you guys with the trucks pulling trailers get used to the dark stuff (exhaust smoke ) getting into your campers, if you think about it you can smell it, after 5 or 6 years the DP start to turn dark and smell bad.I hope you never get a fuel leak, then it really gets bad, you don't know what it's like to blow a turbo, if you don,t get it turned off you start burning oil as it pumps into your exhaust and you can't limp it very far or you will ruin your bearings in you engine then you really got problems, I don't want to scare you but these are just a few, I could write for a week about the problems that the diesels have and the problems you will have, this time of year be sure and ck your antifreeze and while your are at be sure and change your water filters and if it don't have one be sure to put that water additive to your radiator the companys that make diesels don't stress this but if you don't use it the antfreeze will eat a hole threw your piston liners in time,it's called electrolisis (spelled wrong)any way they will rust and make small holes in the pistons and antifreeze will get in your oil and if you keep going ruin your engine, it has happened to a lot of diesels, I 'm going to quit for tonite, I'll tell you some of the worse points tomorow.

[hindle_az]

I'm new to Diesel's and towing. I had an F150 4.2V6 and purchased a 20ft Interstate cargo trailer to tow dirt bikes. I towed a bit with my 150 and decided I wanted something stout that wouldn't be phased by the trailer. So I looked at 2500 series pickups. I did test drive a new F150 with the 5.4 Triton but that was a joke compared to the diesels I test drove. Plus I heard of the gas mileage advantage and I figured even with the higher prices it would still be a money saver if I did any amount of highway driving with the trailer.

I ended up purchasing a GMC 2500HD with the duramax Diesel. I've taken two trips with the truck. A 1700 mile trip without the trailer and a 400 mile trip with the trailer. Here is what the truck did on the 1700 mile trip wihtout the trailer. The price per Gallon is an average. The prices locally where I filled up are around 2.25 a gallon but North of my home prices were 10 to 20 cents cheaper. Go figure. As for gas I based that on local mid grade prices. Some of you may run the cheaper stuff or the high octane varies from engine requirements and personal preferences.

Diesel - 1700Miles / 20MPG * 2.10 = $178.5
Gas - 1700Miles / 18MPG * 1.95 = $184.16


Below are results from a more local trip with my trailer. I based the MPG on a friend who has the 8.1 Gasser version of the 2500HD. He says 6 - 7 @ 75 MPH. I added another MPG on top of that.

400Miles / 13MPG * 2.20 Price Per Gallon Diesel = $67.69
400Miles / 8MPG * 1.93 Price Per Gallon Gas = $96.5

It's easy to see that there isn't much of a gain with current diesel prices unless you are towing. However, if you do any amount of towing Diesel is the way to go without a doubt if you have the means. Some folk may already have a gasser that has the power and torque to tow a large trailer and it may not make sense for them to trade up. Where you do loose with a Diesel is city driving. In the city I get about 17MPG and that isn't any better then my previous gasser but I'm paying 30 cents a gallon more locally. So if your going to get a truck that will also dub as a daily driver in the city it's not as clear cut as if the vehicle was mainly being used to tow in city or highway.

That is just my 2 cents.