Few more ??? and then I'll leave you all alone. I promise.

[MargaretB]

Our heads are spinning from all the research we're doing, and we're planning to hit four big dealers tomorrow. Before we go, I have a couple of questions.

1. Several people have mentioned wanting a front this or rear that. So far, we have no preference, so we're wondering what difference it makes, other than aesthetic. Does it matter if the bed is at the front or the rear? Where the door is?

2. We've worked out some of the codes but keep finding others.
F = front
R = rear
K = kitchen
Q = queen
B = bunk
S = slide
DS = double slide
That's as far as we've gotten. What do H and O mean? M? Any others I've forgotten?

[MargaretB]

that's why we learned to bring a 30' tape measure when we went shopping!

[n7bsn]

Heap64 wrote:
I have heard that sometimes the model number sticks with a floor-plan that has been around for years and just got stretched out over the years. It sure is confusing. Make sure to check the overall length in the specifications.

Northwoods (Arctic Fox) made the 27-5L in three versions
1990's thru 2001, single slide, actually 27 ft long
2001 thru mid 2011, two slides (bedroom on curb side) actually 28 ft long
2012 on, two slides (both on street) actually 30 ft long

[MargaretB]

I am so used to being able to "Like" people's posts on Facebook that I find myself looking for a similar button here, to acknowledge and thank everyone who so generously shares their experience and expertise. All this information is useful to us, even when it's contradictory.

[Still_Searchin_]

If this is your first rig, I'd consider buying a used TT in the size & floor plan that you like and that your tow vehicle can handle (recomend no more than 85% of your rig's tow rating). Actual experience in any rig will help you decide what features you want for your next rig, and most folks that continue to enjoy the RVing lifestyle will change rigs over time as they learn what works best for them. We've enjoyed every TT we've owned, and our current one is our 3rd and I don't want to get any bigger, but really like what we now have.

[MargaretB]

I'm also claustrophobic, so open and airy is important to me. In fact, we've been looking at models with no divider between the bed and the room, other than a curtain. I would have been happy with that, but my husband wanted the bed separate.

[doxiluvr]

I preferred the front kitchen rather than a middle kitchen as it seemed to me that the ones we were in. it just seemed like you were looking at the kitchen all the time, plus I gained a few feet of extra counter space with the front kitchen and a big window. I liked the rear bedroom as in ours it had a slide out and 2 nice big windows. I have claustrophobia and I was just more comfortable in it as I could see out good and walk around the bed also. Our living-dining area also has a nice big slideout with at least 5 windows, plus the door to see out of. But everyone is different. I would like a bigger bathroom, but I figure we aren't in there all that much, so had to compromise. What is important to some, is not to others. Since it is usually just us 2 and a small dog, we are comfortable.

[BubbaChris]

MargaretB wrote:
That ought to be illegal! The length implied by the model number is misleading enough because it doesn't include the tongue length, so we now carry a long tape measure with us to measure from the back of the box to the end of the hitch. As we browse what the internet has to offer, we've automatically eliminated anything with a model number higher than 24. So now you're saying that that may not mean even the box length, huh? I could have gone all day without hearing that.

It was both good and bad for us. We were shopping for a 19-22' box length target. Turns out our 22FBS has a 26' box. We only looked at it because of the implied smaller size. But once we saw it in person it was the perfect floorplan for us and our dogs.

The bigger trailer meant I also ended up buying a different TV that same month. So it was a very expensive upgrade. 😉

Regarding your Sequoia's towing capacity. You might be better off looking at the yellow payload sticker inside the driver's door and working backwards from that number. Payload will include passengers and cargo inside the TV and the tongue weight of the TT. Figure a max tongue weight to be 15% of the TT's max weight.

I second the motion to look at the Lance TT's. The 1985 model was in my top 3 when we were shopping.

[MargaretB]

Slate CM wrote:
MargaretB, I am still somewhat new to RVs, but not to Toyota. I have a 2008 Tundra which is basically the same as your Sequoia but with a pick up body. With the tow package you should have a Tow/Haul button on the dash. Also a trans temp gauge, oil coolers and lower gears designed for towing.

I think you will be fine in the weight range you are looking for. My TT is 5600 dry, although Springdale tells me that includes batteries and empty propane tanks. I have no trouble pulling it. You will get up around 3000-3500 rpm on longer hills. But that motor makes peak torque in that range.

Seems like the rear kitchen models have more counter space, that's what we settled on. Good to hear that you have narrowed it down to just a few requirements. We were having trouble deciding on layouts, features, etc. The salesman said it's tough to find the unicorn, the one that is absolutely perfect.

Yes, we have those features that came with the tow package. According to the manual n the glove box we can tow between 9000# and 9500#, but we're not going anywhere near that number. We'd like to top out at no more than 6500#, and less if possible.

[RedRocket204]

MargaretB wrote:
If he's correct and the TV has been modified, he thinks it's good for +9000#, but we're not taking any chances because we don't know how to know for sure.

We have a 2010 Sequoia Ltd that is supposed to be able to tow 9100#. First, there is no way that vehicle will safely tow 9100#. Second, take a look at the ratings on the exact same model Sequoia for 2011. You will notice the ratings changed A LOT but the vehicle really did not change anything substantial...except for the tow rating. Dun-dun-dah.

Toyota adopted the new SAE method for rating in 2011 and found the Sequoia did not come anywhere close to the previous year's rating. 2011 for the same model dropped to 7000#. That is a 2100# delta.

However, forget the ratings for a moment. Our trailer, at the time, loaded weighed in at 8200#. I drove that trailer down the OR coast into northern CA...so up and down some mountainous roads. It was not the best feeling and boarder line, white knuckle at times. That is a reason we now own both a 2010 Sequoia and 2011 1-ton truck. The truck now pulls our TT but no, I did not need 1-ton and could have easily got away with 3/4-ton.

I feel a 6000# TT, with WDH/sway control, would be a fine match for the 2010 Sequoia. Absolute personal experience trumps all speculative "experience".

[WandaLust2]

MargaretB wrote:
I've learned to carry a 30' steel tape in my purse. Every salesman tells us something different.

If the salesperson's mouth is moving they're either wrong or lying. 😉

[Slate_CM]

MargaretB, I am still somewhat new to RVs, but not to Toyota. I have a 2008 Tundra which is basically the same as your Sequoia but with a pick up body. With the tow package you should have a Tow/Haul button on the dash. Also a trans temp gauge, oil coolers and lower gears designed for towing.

I think you will be fine in the weight range you are looking for. My TT is 5600 dry, although Springdale tells me that includes batteries and empty propane tanks. I have no trouble pulling it. You will get up around 3000-3500 rpm on longer hills. But that motor makes peak torque in that range.

Seems like the rear kitchen models have more counter space, that's what we settled on. Good to hear that you have narrowed it down to just a few requirements. We were having trouble deciding on layouts, features, etc. The salesman said it's tough to find the unicorn, the one that is absolutely perfect.

[PAThwacker]

I do not have to worry about payload constraints: 2351lbs.

[crcr]

avoidcrowds wrote:
You reap what you sow. If you go in with the attitude the salesman is a lying scumbag, you will get treated with distrust. Take what they say with a grain of salt, but don't assume that if their lips are moving, they are lying.

Some salesmen lie. Many tell the truth, as they believe it to be. Most know the specs of the trailer. Fewer understand towing capacity, payload, GCVW, etc. Some know weights very well. Don't discount everything said, just be sure that, if you don't understand it, ask them to explain. If they stumble and stammer, they don't know what they are talking about with regard to that topic. Note your question, and have someone else answer it.

The salesman is your source of information while you are looking at the unit. Don't buy based on what the salesman tells you, but compare what he tells you with what your other research has revealed.

To paint all salesmen with the same brush is doing yourself a disservice. Some don't know what they are talking about. Others do lie, just to make a sale. The majority, though, know that they need to feature the TT in its best light, so they can feed their family. What is wrong with that? Should none of us be trusted to do our own job honestly, since we have the job so we can feed our family? Come on, cut them some slack, unless you don't trust the individual. You can always request a different salesman, if you don't like the one you started with.

I don't go into a dealership thinking the sales person is a lying scumbag. But on the other hand, my experience has been that when I am shopping for an RV or a car or truck, I always have done research before I go to a dealer. And I have never yet run across a sales person who knows more about what they are selling than I know having done just a modicum of research. That's not any testament to my thoroughness nor my intelligence, just to my experience that sales people seldom know much about what they are selling. A sad but true fact, tho I understand there can be exceptions.

So my attitude based on long experience is that I'm not looking for any information from the sales guy, as in general I don't trust it and don't need it. I can get my own information independently.

[westend]

MargaretB wrote:
I"m thinking abour a simple addition formula for determining the max we should look for. Is this it?

dry weight
+ hitch weight
+ cargo/payload max
= gross weight "allowed"
x .80
= safe max weight of what we buy

Payload capacity of vehicle (1370 lb. when properly equipped)
-passenger weight
-WDH weight
-cargo weight
-fuel weight (not all mfgs include a full tank)
_______
Total weight of all above (there is a placard on the vehicle's driver side door jamb that lists the payload weight)

The tongue weight of any trailer should not exceed the total of the exercise above. For example: 1370, -150 passenger, -80 WDH, -50 cargo, -200 fuel = 890 = maximum tongue weight.

Weight of trailer fully loaded for camping (including propane, battery, awning and/or accessories) X 13% (typical tongue weight distribution) = 6800. If you wanted to stick to that 80% rule, 80% of 6800 = 5440 lbs.