Ford suspension

[Bird_chaser]

I'm researching new tow vehicles (Chevy and Ford), I currently tow with a 2001 Silverado 3500 DRW, 6.0l with a 4l80e. My trailer has a pin weight of 2140 with a trailer weight of 10,460, this is loaded for a two week trip including 1/3 full water tank. I'm not concerned about towing, I'm concerned about the sag or squatting I hear about in the Fords. I'm concidering a Ford F-350 or a Chevy 3500 both DRW. I don't want to drop $50-60k and have to upgrade the suspension. I would like to hear from Ford guys about their experience. Thank you!

[itguy08]

Cummins12V98 wrote:

When I bought my 98 12V 2500 with the Cummins I felt exactly as you. I knew for sure the truck would fall apart around the engine. That proved to be completely false. The truck now has about 400K and is in awesome condition. My Son now has it. My 11 RAM LongHorn Dually I owned for 3.5 years and 65K was flawless and my 15 with rear air I expect to be the same.

Even Yugo made some good ones. Look on eBay - they are out there. Doesn't mean that as a whole they are all that good. Case in point - the wife has an Escape with the CD4E transmission, not one of Fords better units. 158k on it now and the original unit. I'm not that naive to think they are all that good. There are plenty that never made 100k.

If you're flipping trucks at 3 years and 65k I'd expect few issues. Those that track quality and dependability as a whole put Chrysler at the bottom. You don't get that way by building great vehicles.

[ksss]

Bedlam wrote:
My Ford Super Cab had a flat load floor when I flipped up the seats and I kept a kennel behind the front seats. My current Ram Crew Cab has storage under the seats that makes the floor uneven with the seat flipped up (some trim models have a storage area cover making a taller load floor) - I now have the kennel riding higher up on the seat instead of the floor.

I suggest you look at a few different truck cabs since there is also a variation between the extended and crew cabs. Some are optioned with additional audio gear or storage under the seats which may not work for you.

This is the one thing I wish GM would fix. My 06 3500 CC had the seats that will lay flat, excellent for dogs and maximizing the useable space. My 2012 had the rear seats that fold up as does my 2015 and while the entry height is lower, the space is not as usable for dogs. My 125 pound Akita has enough room in the new GM HD, but the seats that lay flat is a better system in my view.

[Cummins12V98]

dodge guy wrote:
Wow! This went sideways fast!

They always do!

[dodge_guy]

Wow! This went sideways fast!

[45Ricochet]

FishOnOne wrote:

I also read that Ford even stopped watering the plants to cut back on spending.

When did they relocate to California :W

[Cummins12V98]

itguy08 wrote:
I would venture to guess the ONLY reason they choose Ram is because of the Cummins. They can pull into any 24/7 truck stop and get it worked on. Not so much for the Duramax and Power Stroke. That is HUGE when you need to make time and money.

I'd even say the Cummins is the ONLY thing keeping Ram in the game. It's probably the major (if not the only) reason to buy the Ram.

When I bought my 98 12V 2500 with the Cummins I felt exactly as you. I knew for sure the truck would fall apart around the engine. That proved to be completely false. The truck now has about 400K and is in awesome condition. My Son now has it. My 11 RAM LongHorn Dually I owned for 3.5 years and 65K was flawless and my 15 with rear air I expect to be the same.

[Cummins12V98]

spud1957 wrote:
"You know I am correct that the "independent" RV haulers and HotShotters choose RAM's more than Ford or GM."

I don't think anyone can claim this statement true unless they can back it with hardcore facts. I'm not saying you are wrong or right. You just have to back it up.

I can say anything on the the forum as true and not back it up with real data.

In all honesty, I would like to think you are correct, as my next truck will either be a Ford or Ram.

It only takes driving along the freeways to see there is a pattern. Same goes for the full timers campgrounds.

[itguy08]

I would venture to guess the ONLY reason they choose Ram is because of the Cummins. They can pull into any 24/7 truck stop and get it worked on. Not so much for the Duramax and Power Stroke. That is HUGE when you need to make time and money.

I'd even say the Cummins is the ONLY thing keeping Ram in the game. It's probably the major (if not the only) reason to buy the Ram.

[spud1957]

"You know I am correct that the "independent" RV haulers and HotShotters choose RAM's more than Ford or GM."

I don't think anyone can claim this statement true unless they can back it with hardcore facts. I'm not saying you are wrong or right. You just have to back it up.

I can say anything on the the forum as true and not back it up with real data.

In all honesty, I would like to think you are correct, as my next truck will either be a Ford or Ram.

[Cummins12V98]

FishOnOne wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:
350 VS 3500 Dually's that is what I want to see. I know the margin is big for RAM with the independent RV haulers and hot shotters.

In addition to your reading comprehension problem it appears you also have a memory problem! Just a hint... The numbers don't match your story. 🙂 But only the kool aid drinkers believe you anyways!

BTW... I live near a Camping World and a Holiday World (two very big RV dealers) and I see who's towing campers in and out of these facilities every day. You might be surprised. :W

In addition I was shocked that I actually saw 2 Hell Cat Challengers this week.

"In addition to your reading comprehension problem"

I don't personally slam you, I may disagree on most things you write but I don't personally berate you.

So lets keep it civil and keep on disagreeing.

You know I am correct that the "independent" RV haulers and HotShotters choose RAM's more than Ford or GM.

And I know you are probably correct that the Fleet owners buy more Fords.

I would not be surprised since I know RAM then GM not far behind and Ford way back. Used to be just the opposite a few years back with GM and Ford. But the guys that depend on their trucks every day became tired of all the problems with the 6.0 and 6.4 and went to either RAM or GM. Over time the numbers may change.

[itguy08]

Cummins12V98 wrote:
350 VS 3500 Dually's that is what I want to see. I know the margin is big for RAM with the independent RV haulers and hot shotters.

PS: Chrysler's Margins are razor thin. That's why Sergio wants someone to buy/merge the POS known as Chrysler. It's been all over the financial papers this week.

This one has a link to his Powerpoint presentation begging for a merger: FCA Sale/Merger

More Merger talk

FCA Profit Margins

Interesting quote on incentives from the FCA Profit Margins article:

FCA's spending on "incentives" -- those cash-back or cheap-financing deals we see in ads, has long been among the industry's highest. That's changing, Palmer says, starting this month.

IOW - they have to discount their stuff the most for someone to buy it! Will be interesting to see how that affects their sales. When you are the lowest cost, lowest quality option it's very hard to move upmarket and takes a LONG time. Just ask Hyundai - it's taking them a long time to shake their sketchy image. Unlike Chrysler, they have the quality to back that up.

Why FCA needs a Merger

They have had how many owners now (4 or 5) and none can make it work.

How many times must we bail Chrysler out before we send them the way of Nash, Studebaker, Duisenberg, Oldsmobile, etc?

[FishOnOne]

Cummins12V98 wrote:
350 VS 3500 Dually's that is what I want to see. I know the margin is big for RAM with the independent RV haulers and hot shotters.

In addition to your reading comprehension problem it appears you also have a memory problem! Just a hint... The numbers don't match your story. 🙂 But only the kool aid drinkers believe you anyways!

BTW... I live near a Camping World and a Holiday World (two very big RV dealers) and I see who's towing campers in and out of these facilities every day. You might be surprised. :W

In addition I was shocked that I actually saw 2 Hell Cat Challengers this week.

[Cummins12V98]

350 VS 3500 Dually's that is what I want to see. I know the margin is big for RAM with the independent RV haulers and hot shotters.

[FishOnOne]

itguy08 wrote:

45Ricochet wrote:

Spin it however you want, bottom line is Ford got cash also.

They took DOE money for hybrids or electric cars. As did a few others (Nissan and someone else, IIRC). Ford did it the "American Way" - bet the farm and mortgaged it all to make it work. Everything was mortgaged, down to the Ford name. Read up on it.

The fact is that Iacocca was begging the government for $$ in the 80's to "Save Chrysler". Then they needed it again in 2008. When will it stop? They need to go the way of the Dodo Bird.

Even Sergio realizes what a POS they are and is begging for a merger to keep FCA afloat. Apparently they are not making money as they have the highest amount of $$ on the hood of all the manufacturers.

FWIW - the Ford family still has lots of control and would probably rather shut it down than loose that control.

I also read that Ford even stopped watering the plants to cut back on spending.

[itguy08]

45Ricochet wrote:

Spin it however you want, bottom line is Ford got cash also.

They took DOE money for hybrids or electric cars. As did a few others (Nissan and someone else, IIRC). Ford did it the "American Way" - bet the farm and mortgaged it all to make it work. Everything was mortgaged, down to the Ford name. Read up on it.

The fact is that Iacocca was begging the government for $$ in the 80's to "Save Chrysler". Then they needed it again in 2008. When will it stop? They need to go the way of the Dodo Bird.

Even Sergio realizes what a POS they are and is begging for a merger to keep FCA afloat. Apparently they are not making money as they have the highest amount of $$ on the hood of all the manufacturers.

FWIW - the Ford family still has lots of control and would probably rather shut it down than loose that control.