Freon for old TT AC

[matthewijenkins]

Hi. I have an old 70s TT. The ACblows cold, but not ice cold. I'm worried it won't be enough for our June Florida trip. My RV repair guy told me it was going to be tough to find more Freon since it's been outawed. I don't know anything about this. Not sure what I should do. replacing is too expensive right now. Anyone know about this?

[CavemanCharlie]

Gdetrailer wrote:

kaydeejay wrote:
Your RV repir guy is correct PLUS RV A/C units were never built to be serviced so you would be paying him to solder in the fill valves.
That, plus the "Gray" market price of R12 at over $100/lb (if he can find any) may well run you close to the price of a new unit.

R12 is not all that hard to find AND it does not cost $100/lb..

I see it once and a while on Craigslist for $100-$150 PER THIRTY POUND CONTAINER.. That is THREE DOLLARS AND THIRTY THREE CENTS/LB to FIVE DOLLARS/LB ASKING PRICE.. I would bet that if you find a seller you could make an offer and they would take it.. Pretty much most of the "market" for R12 is in the wrecking yards now days and never going to need refilled.

1996 or so pretty much every vehicle manufactured that year and after uses R134a so we are talking 20 PLUS year old vehicles and those numbers are dwindling that are still on the road.

R12 was used pretty much exclusively in autos, some home fridges but not really in home A/C units (those used R22). Old dehumidifiers often used R500 and many refrigerators also..

Not to mention most any LICENSED A/C TECH should have a refrigerant recovery system which they will RECOVER AND FILTER the refrigerant to REUSE..

HERE is just one example of a place that ACTIVELY BUYS AND SELLS R12 and other refrigerants..

Although with RV systems, I would really suggest that you simply spend the money for a new unit.. The old ones were never designed or meant to be serviced and refilled.. You could spend money to have a tap put on and refrigerant loaded then find out the compressor is bad a day later..

I'm not sure about that last part. My old AC unit from 1993 works a lot better then the 2004 AC unit that my brother has on his 5th wheel. I looked at his to see if we could make it work better and it's just a really, really, really, poor design. Not every new one is better.

[Gdetrailer]

kaydeejay wrote:
Your RV repir guy is correct PLUS RV A/C units were never built to be serviced so you would be paying him to solder in the fill valves.
That, plus the "Gray" market price of R12 at over $100/lb (if he can find any) may well run you close to the price of a new unit.

R12 is not all that hard to find AND it does not cost $100/lb..

I see it once and a while on Craigslist for $100-$150 PER THIRTY POUND CONTAINER.. That is THREE DOLLARS AND THIRTY THREE CENTS/LB to FIVE DOLLARS/LB ASKING PRICE.. I would bet that if you find a seller you could make an offer and they would take it.. Pretty much most of the "market" for R12 is in the wrecking yards now days and never going to need refilled.

1996 or so pretty much every vehicle manufactured that year and after uses R134a so we are talking 20 PLUS year old vehicles and those numbers are dwindling that are still on the road.

R12 was used pretty much exclusively in autos, some home fridges but not really in home A/C units (those used R22). Old dehumidifiers often used R500 and many refrigerators also..

Not to mention most any LICENSED A/C TECH should have a refrigerant recovery system which they will RECOVER AND FILTER the refrigerant to REUSE..

HERE is just one example of a place that ACTIVELY BUYS AND SELLS R12 and other refrigerants..

Although with RV systems, I would really suggest that you simply spend the money for a new unit.. The old ones were never designed or meant to be serviced and refilled.. You could spend money to have a tap put on and refrigerant loaded then find out the compressor is bad a day later..

[matthewijenkins]

So who makes the best tech guy? An RV place, or appliance repair, or...? Using a portable is our fall back solution.

[Toddupton]

409 is a drop in replacement for 12 the oil will be fine in it. MO99 is the replacement for 22 but I do not like 99 the pressures are way off and does cause problems. Any good tech can pull out the gas and braze in service valves vac it out and charge it back up in 30 minutes.

[CavemanCharlie]

RoyB wrote:
Perhaps you can carry along a small 5K window unit and use it to suppliment your other A/C unit. Just sit it on a table top with the back end stick thru a window and close things off with cardboard strips. You might have to plug this into the camp ground 20A Service receptacle using an extension cord...

Try it out at home first in the driveway...

Roy Ken

They have portable AC units now too that set in the floor and use flexible tubes to blow the hot air out a window. But, I don't know the cost.

[RoyB]

Perhaps you can carry along a small 5K window unit and use it to suppliment your other A/C unit. Just sit it on a table top with the back end stick thru a window and close things off with cardboard strips. You might have to plug this into the camp ground 20A Service receptacle using an extension cord...

Try it out at home first in the driveway...

Roy Ken

[westend]

My understanding is that r-409, r-135 (?), is not compatible with R-22 or R-12. Isn't it something about the oil? I have half a bottle of R-22 in the shed. My older S&B AC can use it.

[kaydeejay]

Golden_HVAC wrote:
I have NEVER heard of a travel trailer with R-12 in it.

All rooftop units before 2005 had R-22 in them, and the change over to R-410A took some time, but now that is all you can buy in a 'new' package air conditioner that comes factory charged.
Fred.

Hi Fred, thanks for clarifying that and confirming that a repair "technician" tried to take me for a ride back around 2002 when I had a 1984 Prowler with A/C problems. What I posted earlier was what he told me!! I passed on his services as it just didn't sit right back then.

[Toddupton]

It is actually an easy job to top the off. The issues is if you have to top them off you have a leak. The refrigerant does not just disappear. If the unit is from the 70's and does have r-12 in it there are still options to recharge it. 409a is a drop in replacement for r-12 and is not too expensive.

[Golden_HVAC]

kaydeejay wrote:
Your RV repir guy is correct PLUS RV A/C units were never built to be serviced so you would be paying him to solder in the fill valves.
That, plus the "Gray" market price of R12 at over $100/lb (if he can find any) may well run you close to the price of a new unit.

I have NEVER heard of a travel trailer with R-12 in it.

All rooftop units before 2005 had R-22 in them, and the change over to R-410A took some time, but now that is all you can buy in a 'new' package air conditioner that comes factory charged.

I can still buy R-22. It is expensive compared to 1989 prices (about $35 for a 30 pound container) - last time I checked it was close to $300 or $355.

You do have to weld on a freon port, those cost about $12, and the ones that I install require sanding the copper tubing, then weld the fitting on with a torch and solder that melts at 1200F. After checking it for leaks, then install the freon schrader valve, and it will puncture the tubing, allowing you to add or remove freon from that point on. It will not leak either.

So yes it 'can' be repaired, but the cost might be more than $200 to have someone weld on a fitting, recharge it with $10 worth of freon. They only hold about 1 pound, so the freon cost is not that significant. But leak check and welding can be. And last time I billed for R-22 it was $28 a pound sales price. It probably only needs about 1/4 pound - 1/2 pound.

Look for a appliance or refrigerator repair place, and call and see if they can install the valve and recharge it for you. .

Good luck,

Fred.

[kaydeejay]

Your RV repir guy is correct PLUS RV A/C units were never built to be serviced so you would be paying him to solder in the fill valves.
That, plus the "Gray" market price of R12 at over $100/lb (if he can find any) may well run you close to the price of a new unit.