Hemi 6.4 Ram vs Ford 6.2 (gas)

I too am very interested in this subject. Owning a diesel with dpf emission control stuff out of warranty like I do is just a risk I'd rather not have. Seems like a lot of people like their new gassers and my fiver weight is a little less than 12,000, which is well below some of the gas tow ratings.

If you look at last years pickup truck ultimate 3/4 ton challenge on the Ike Gauntlet, you will see that the Ram 6.4 with 4.1 lost to the Chevy with 6.0 and 4.1, as well as the Ford with 6.2 and 3.73 rear end. Why?? The first and second gears of the Ram are 3.23 and 1.84, while the Chevy's are 4.03 and 2.36, and the Ford's are 3.97 and 2.31. The Ram came in last and went up a long section at under 30 mph with the rpms limited by the Ram engineers to prevent damage. The Chevy and Ford trucks have lower transmission gearing in first and second even though they both have less torque and the Ford only had a 3.73 axle.

I live in flat Louisiana and this would rarely apply to me, but I do love to go to Colorado. All these engines are gasping for air at the end of the Ike Gauntlet at over 11,000 feet and have lost about 30% of their power due to elevation. It's an extreme test. In less extreme conditions I think all 3 would do fine. I would just have to get used to 4,000 rpms instead of the 1,600 or so I now hear with the Cummins.

I am hoping at least one of the 3 put an 8 speed transmission in a 2500/250. That would probably push me to gas again. I have had a 7.3 Ford and 6.7 Cummins and I love the way diesels tow. The emissions stuff has just made them less reliable and more costly to maintain, with big potential repair cost that don't fit my retirement budget well. I hope this helps some. Good luck with your decision.

Thank you for your comments. I have been restling with the decision gas or diesel for months and I move very slowly because like you I am retired and can't afford a $12,000 plus repair bill. I tow perhaps 5 months per year, but much of that time would be parked in sites in California or Mesa etc... plus will travel in Canada. The 5th I am looking at is dry weight 8500 lbs...... 32 ft 7"

Feel free to shoot more comments my way.

Pulling 10K with a fifth wheel certainly makes a gas engine a viable option. If your looking to keep somewhat of a cap on expenses, the gas engines are cheaper to work on and not as particular as the new diesels are. The towing experience will not be as effortless and you wont likely pass many fuel stations. However when you factor in the cost of diesel verse gas in most places, the differences are not as far off as it might first appear. Something to remember when you complain about 7-8 mpg with the gasser verse the 10-11 with a diesel (towing). I pull half again as much with my gas HD and it works, I slay a few dinosaurs but I didn't spend the 8-9K for the Dmax either, that buys a lot gas. Lastly I just traded a '12 for a '15 with 60K on it (bought new) and it cost me .18 cents a mile in depreciation. It worked well enough for me that I bought another HD gas. Granted the HD gas truck is not my sole TV, but at 15K or less it works well.

I would say that I don't think problems with the new diesels are anywhere near epidemic, chances are better than not you would wont have any serious problems. However given your retired status, I can see why it is a risk you don't want to take.

What are you towing with now? I did not see the TV in your profile. Most of those that are not happy towing 10K with a gas rig are those coming from a diesel. It's hard to go back to less power.

I'm about 2,000 lbs heavier in the fifth wheel. I know a gas would do it fine, but I'm just used to the more relaxing diesel rpms. I just don't know if the relaxed towing is now worth the risk of the far more expensive repairs. Good luck.

I have commented in your CP3 and CP4 diesel thread below, so I can now see you are still on the gas/diesel fence also. There is no right or wrong decision, just the one that will most likely work best for you.

Good luck and let me know how it turns out for you.

kzspree320 wrote:
I too am very interested in this subject. Owning a diesel with dpf emission control stuff out of warranty like I do is just a risk I'd rather not have. Seems like a lot of people like their new gassers and my fiver weight is a little less than 12,000, which is well below some of the gas tow ratings.

If you look at last years pickup truck ultimate 3/4 ton challenge on the Ike Gauntlet, you will see that the Ram 6.4 with 4.1 lost to the Chevy with 6.0 and 4.1, as well as the Ford with 6.2 and 3.73 rear end. Why?? The first and second gears of the Ram are 3.23 and 1.84, while the Chevy's are 4.03 and 2.36, and the Ford's are 3.97 and 2.31. The Ram came in last and went up a long section at under 30 mph with the rpms limited by the Ram engineers to prevent damage. The Chevy and Ford trucks have lower transmission gearing in first and second even though they both have less torque and the Ford only had a 3.73 axle.

I live in flat Louisiana and this would rarely apply to me, but I do love to go to Colorado. All these engines are gasping for air at the end of the Ike Gauntlet at over 11,000 feet and have lost about 30% of their power due to elevation. It's an extreme test. In less extreme conditions I think all 3 would do fine. I would just have to get used to 4,000 rpms instead of the 1,600 or so I now hear with the Cummins.

I am hoping at least one of the 3 put an 8 speed transmission in a 2500/250. That would probably push me to gas again. I have had a 7.3 Ford and 6.7 Cummins and I love the way diesels tow. The emissions stuff has just made them less reliable and more costly to maintain, with big potential repair cost that don't fit my retirement budget well. I hope this helps some. Good luck with your decision.

There is an odd side to this thing about the Ram's 6.4 not wanting to pull the higher RPM's in first and second; Actual owners have reported having no such problems.
I for one would like to here from more people that actually own them.

However, from my own standpoint I find the whole thing very plausible since they've been doing the same power limiting programming in first and second to Cummins powered RAM's for more than 10 years.

Sorry, forgot to mention I am coming out of a 2011 Tundra 1/2 ton with a 4950 lb 25ft Travel Trailer. Going into 32 ft 5th and whatever truck I can get my mind around. I move slow because I don't want to be doing this all again in another 2 yrs or so.

I agree that Ram 6.4 owners have not reported the problems encountered during the Ike Gauntlet challenges. It may be that they have not challenged their truck this harshely yet. For those interested in more information on this here are links to two tests:
http://special-reports.pickuptrucks.com/2014/08/ultimate-three-quarter-ton-hd-challenge-eisenhower-pass.html

http://www.tfltruck.com/2014/10/2014-ram-2500-hd-6-4l-hemi-vs-6-0l-chevy-ike-gauntlet-hd/

I am also a member of the Dodge Diesel Cummins Forum. It has a subforum for newer gas trucks. It seems that a few people have made the change from a CTD to a 6.4 hemi and are happy. Likewise there are at least two that made the change from CTD to 6.4 hemi, were unhappy with the towing experience, and have already bought a new CTD. I had a Durango years ago that had a 5.7 hemi that went over 100K trouble free miles. I was hoping the 6.4 hemi would be great.

I hope ib516 will add to this discussion since he went from a CTD to a 6.4 hemi and seems pleased last I read.

I think any of the 3 would work 90% of the time if I can just readjust to the higher rpms required by gas. None will tow as well as a new diesel, but they are about $8k less and you don't rish a huge diesel repair bill when the warranty ends. I am doing nothing this year and hoping for the 8 speed which could narrow the gap to hopefully arrive in one of next years trucks.

Who the heck pulls 6-7% grades wide open or trying on purpose to maintain the speed limit? The majority of guys towing won't beat their trucks like TFL guys do. Heck their treating it like a rental. Even with my Cummins and only towing 9000lbs I don't do work the******out of it to maintain the speed limit when climbing passes. I let it do what feels natural when climbing. Just my guess but the average guy would not complain towing Ike with any of the big 3 gasser 3/4 ton trucks.

goducks10 wrote:
Who the heck pulls 6-7% grades wide open or trying on purpose to maintain the speed limit? The majority of guys towing won't beat their trucks like TFL guys do. Heck their treating it like a rental. Even with my Cummins and only towing 9000lbs I don't do work the******out of it to maintain the speed limit when climbing passes. I let it do what feels natural when climbing. Just my guess but the average guy would not complain towing Ike with any of the big 3 gasser 3/4 ton trucks.

I like your way of thinking. Imagine the engine required in an OTR 18-wheeler in order to climb a 5 mile long 6-7% grade 65mph just so the driver "can". I can easily run with the big rigs towing our 8500~lb 5th wheel with our lowly 310hp 5.4L F250 keeping it under 4500rpm. Even my 250hp Cummins kept up with the big rigs towing our previous 10,400 lb 5th wheel. That's plenty of power for towing the vacation house for me. Any of the new gas rigs are good for their tow ratings.