How to stay warm

[blckgnx]

Just purchased a 2016 Forest River Rockwood 2304DS and almost froze last night. Temps are 27degree and furnace will not even get close to keeping us warm. Purchased a 1500watt Oil electric heater today, and that will not keep us warm either(we did turn the furnace OFF) after plugging in the electric Oil heater. Please! Any suggestions.

[Huntindog]

CavemanCharlie wrote:

Gdetrailer wrote:

hohenwald48 wrote:

gmw photos wrote:
True that. I didn't like the cheap outlets that came from the factory in my trailer. I replaced with leviton outlets and used the "screwed in place" terminal for the wire end.

By "cheap outlets" are you referring to the self contained outlets that most RV manufacturers use? Ones like these -

http://www.hubbell-wirecon.com/literature/InstallationGuide.pdf

I was just wondering if you have had some problem with these fully rated, UL listed and NEC approved electrical devices? I guess I'm wondering why you feel a need to replace them with outlets that require the installation of additional electrical boxes.

While they are UL/NEC "accepted" the means that they employ to make electrical contact with the wire is pretty darn shaky at best..

Known as a "vampire tap" the device "pierces" ans "pushes" aside some of the insulation and makes an ever so slight contact with said wire.

The contact points are extremely small AND there is no real firm "mechanical" means to ensure the contact STAYS constant during temperature changes which causes expansion and contraction of the metals.

What all this means is as you put a heavier load onto the outlet that very small electrical contact creates a higher than normal resistance. Resistance is the enemy here and with a higher resistance you get HEAT.. When you get heat the springiness of the material FADES making even more resistance..

Over time with repeated high current loads it will ultimately end with some outlet failure..

Even though those outlets HAVE passed UL/NEC, they ARE only rated for 15A.. I personally after looking at a few of those outlets would never consider loading them above 10A and that is being rather generous.. Those outlets were never envisioned with the idea of a 1500 watt (12.5A) heater plugged in for not only hrs but DAYS/weeks/months of continuous operation..

The RV (and some mobile home) manufacturers use these outlets not for "quality" but for SPEED of building.. RVs are not really well known for "top quality" builds or materials..

Some better RV manufacturers DO use BETTER quality home style outlets so your mileage may vary..

Somewhere around my leftover junk piles I do have one of these outlets from my first TT that I had to replace due to part of the BACK plastic breaking.. I should dig it out and take some real nice Macro photos to bring this point home..

Some good info. I will have to remove one someday and see what it is that I've got.

One thing to consider is that many walls in an RV are not thick enough for a standard outlet/box.. I believe that is why the RV version was developed... I have never had any trouble with mine.

[CavemanCharlie]

Gdetrailer wrote:

hohenwald48 wrote:

gmw photos wrote:
True that. I didn't like the cheap outlets that came from the factory in my trailer. I replaced with leviton outlets and used the "screwed in place" terminal for the wire end.

By "cheap outlets" are you referring to the self contained outlets that most RV manufacturers use? Ones like these -

http://www.hubbell-wirecon.com/literature/InstallationGuide.pdf

I was just wondering if you have had some problem with these fully rated, UL listed and NEC approved electrical devices? I guess I'm wondering why you feel a need to replace them with outlets that require the installation of additional electrical boxes.

While they are UL/NEC "accepted" the means that they employ to make electrical contact with the wire is pretty darn shaky at best..

Known as a "vampire tap" the device "pierces" ans "pushes" aside some of the insulation and makes an ever so slight contact with said wire.

The contact points are extremely small AND there is no real firm "mechanical" means to ensure the contact STAYS constant during temperature changes which causes expansion and contraction of the metals.

What all this means is as you put a heavier load onto the outlet that very small electrical contact creates a higher than normal resistance. Resistance is the enemy here and with a higher resistance you get HEAT.. When you get heat the springiness of the material FADES making even more resistance..

Over time with repeated high current loads it will ultimately end with some outlet failure..

Even though those outlets HAVE passed UL/NEC, they ARE only rated for 15A.. I personally after looking at a few of those outlets would never consider loading them above 10A and that is being rather generous.. Those outlets were never envisioned with the idea of a 1500 watt (12.5A) heater plugged in for not only hrs but DAYS/weeks/months of continuous operation..

The RV (and some mobile home) manufacturers use these outlets not for "quality" but for SPEED of building.. RVs are not really well known for "top quality" builds or materials..

Some better RV manufacturers DO use BETTER quality home style outlets so your mileage may vary..

Somewhere around my leftover junk piles I do have one of these outlets from my first TT that I had to replace due to part of the BACK plastic breaking.. I should dig it out and take some real nice Macro photos to bring this point home..

Some good info. I will have to remove one someday and see what it is that I've got.

[jaycocreek]

As an example of how the new box type infared heaters with a fan work, from Heaterlab.com.I own a SunHeat and it does a much better job of heating either my travel trailer or motorhome than any standard portable electric I have ever owned..I use mine in the house also.

One more great infrared heater by the LifeSmart brand. LifeSmart Power Plus is designed for heating rooms with up to 1500 square footage. This unit equips 6 quartz infrared elements. Each one is wrapped in a metal coil that acts as a heat exchanger. Having 6 elements it produces more heat.

[jaycocreek]

What ever..Tank-cylinder

The all new Original SUNHEAT USA1500 electric portable infrared heater is fully made in the USA. The USA1500 will heat up to 1,000 square feet and provide safe, soft, comfortable heat for any area.

[Gdetrailer]

jaycocreek wrote:

blckgnx wrote:
Just purchased a 2016 Forest River Rockwood 2304DS and almost froze last night. Temps are 27degree and furnace will not even get close to keeping us warm. Purchased a 1500watt Oil electric heater today, and that will not keep us warm either(we did turn the furnace OFF) after plugging in the electric Oil heater. Please! Any suggestions.

It looks like there are only two heat vents in the whole trailer,one in the living area and one in the bathroom..Not good for cold climates..

I camp way down in single digits or below zero and use a catalytic heater as an addition to the furnace and it's worthless ducts in my trailer..This keeps us toasty warm even below zero..

Infared heaters do a great job in RV's also..They seem to heat better than the standard portable heaters and I have tried them all.They blow alot more hot air than the little ones do.

Good luck in keeping warm and nice trailer!

REAL "infared" heaters do not have a fan, so don't be fooled by those expensive "boxes" where you can't see the infared surfaces, those are not true infared heaters..

This is a "box" that claims to be "infared", it isn't, it HAS a FAN..



THIS IS a real infared heater..



In the second example you will notice the complete lack of fan, the quartz tubes radiate infared energy 360 degrees and the reflective surface behind them helps to focus that energy out the front of the heater.

Real infared heaters do not heat the surrounding air, instead they heat objects like a person.. The huge downside to using ifared is the mere fact that it DOESN'T bend around you.. It ONLY heats the surface that is FACING the heater.. So one side of you is "toasted" to charcoal and the other three sides of you are nothing more than a arctic waste land of freezing..

Yeah, I have "been there, done that".. Many years ago, I worked in a small mom and pop repair shop where they used several different portable heaters to keep the place warm..

One was a oil filled heater and the other was a radiant infared electric heater..

The infared heater only heated the exposed skin and ANY dark object in front of it.. Not fun at all, had to keep moving the heater around the bend to try to stay "warm"..

[jessjosh61]

Lots of good information in this thread.

This is a little off the original topic, but It would also be smart to "be prepared" when camping in the cold. Bring cold weather sleeping bags and a bunch of chemical hand warmers. That way, if something happens to the energy supply (propane runs out, CG power goes down, etc.) you can get through the night without being miserable.

[jaycocreek]

blckgnx wrote:
Just purchased a 2016 Forest River Rockwood 2304DS and almost froze last night. Temps are 27degree and furnace will not even get close to keeping us warm. Purchased a 1500watt Oil electric heater today, and that will not keep us warm either(we did turn the furnace OFF) after plugging in the electric Oil heater. Please! Any suggestions.

It looks like there are only two heat vents in the whole trailer,one in the living area and one in the bathroom..Not good for cold climates..

I camp way down in single digits or below zero and use a catalytic heater as an addition to the furnace and it's worthless ducts in my trailer..This keeps us toasty warm even below zero..

Infared heaters do a great job in RV's also..They seem to heat better than the standard portable heaters and I have tried them all.They blow alot more hot air than the little ones do.

Good luck in keeping warm and nice trailer!

[Heavy_Metal_Doc]

Our first winter trip with our TT taught me the heater works fine all the way down to temps in the teens.....but at 7* with a little breeze, it can't keep up and will run steadily trying to keep up....that was a cold night with every blanket we had on us and I think my last look at the thermostat said it was 41* inside. Took over one full can 20Lb of propane for one night.

[Gdetrailer]

hohenwald48 wrote:

gmw photos wrote:
True that. I didn't like the cheap outlets that came from the factory in my trailer. I replaced with leviton outlets and used the "screwed in place" terminal for the wire end.

By "cheap outlets" are you referring to the self contained outlets that most RV manufacturers use? Ones like these -

http://www.hubbell-wirecon.com/literature/InstallationGuide.pdf

I was just wondering if you have had some problem with these fully rated, UL listed and NEC approved electrical devices? I guess I'm wondering why you feel a need to replace them with outlets that require the installation of additional electrical boxes.

While they are UL/NEC "accepted" the means that they employ to make electrical contact with the wire is pretty darn shaky at best..

Known as a "vampire tap" the device "pierces" ans "pushes" aside some of the insulation and makes an ever so slight contact with said wire.

The contact points are extremely small AND there is no real firm "mechanical" means to ensure the contact STAYS constant during temperature changes which causes expansion and contraction of the metals.

What all this means is as you put a heavier load onto the outlet that very small electrical contact creates a higher than normal resistance. Resistance is the enemy here and with a higher resistance you get HEAT.. When you get heat the springiness of the material FADES making even more resistance..

Over time with repeated high current loads it will ultimately end with some outlet failure..

Even though those outlets HAVE passed UL/NEC, they ARE only rated for 15A.. I personally after looking at a few of those outlets would never consider loading them above 10A and that is being rather generous.. Those outlets were never envisioned with the idea of a 1500 watt (12.5A) heater plugged in for not only hrs but DAYS/weeks/months of continuous operation..

The RV (and some mobile home) manufacturers use these outlets not for "quality" but for SPEED of building.. RVs are not really well known for "top quality" builds or materials..

Some better RV manufacturers DO use BETTER quality home style outlets so your mileage may vary..

Somewhere around my leftover junk piles I do have one of these outlets from my first TT that I had to replace due to part of the BACK plastic breaking.. I should dig it out and take some real nice Macro photos to bring this point home..

[nevadanick]

-12 in my KZ TT and was comfortable. Furnace ran 20min then off for 10 then 20 on, well you get the picture.

[Mike_Up]

blckgnx wrote:
Just purchased a 2016 Forest River Rockwood 2304DS and almost froze last night. Temps are 27degree and furnace will not even get close to keeping us warm. Purchased a 1500watt Oil electric heater today, and that will not keep us warm either(we did turn the furnace OFF) after plugging in the electric Oil heater. Please! Any suggestions.

Wow, that makes no sense. I've camped in the 20s here in Northern Indiana with the Pop Ups and Travel Trailers, and never been cold. Even the bunk ends were comfortable without a chill.

Sounds like your furnace is ****. You might want to take it in to have it fixed. The Pop Ups were warm but boy did they burn through the propane with no insulation. I could go through a 20# tank in a day and a half.

** EDIT** Just read all the replies, didn't have time earlier. Looks like you found a furnace problem. Good luck.

[enblethen]

It is not the receptacle that is the problem, it is the poor workmanship.

[Terryallan]

try following the duct trail back to the furnace. It may be that you will need to take a few cabinets loose to find the path. Not really all that hard. If you do, then you can hook the hose back up.

[gmw_photos]

deleted

[hohenwald48]

gmw photos wrote:
True that. I didn't like the cheap outlets that came from the factory in my trailer. I replaced with leviton outlets and used the "screwed in place" terminal for the wire end.

By "cheap outlets" are you referring to the self contained outlets that most RV manufacturers use? Ones like these -

http://www.hubbell-wirecon.com/literature/InstallationGuide.pdf

I was just wondering if you have had some problem with these fully rated, UL listed and NEC approved electrical devices? I guess I'm wondering why you feel a need to replace them with outlets that require the installation of additional electrical boxes.