Winch for TC

GeoBoy wrote:
The Lewis winch is neat, but you need a pretty substantial chain saw for it to get to its 8k potential. You will also make sure you have a gas can with 2 cycle fuel mix. Too much of a hassle for most of us.

I guess that all depends on if you camp in a campground or off road, like I do. Standard fare for me is a gallon can of pre-mix chainsaw fuel and bar oil and yes, it takes a substantial powerhead to attain 8K but you can get by with less and a snatch block (which doubles your pulling capacity).

Nice thing about a Lewis winch is you can store it anywhere (minus the powerhead)

I always carry not only fuel but an axe, tools, spare belts an air compressor and tire plugs too....and a bottle jack, forgot that.

I use my MS290 to run the winch when it's not cutting firewood.

I never look at recovery tools as a hassle. I look at them as a means to survive in the woods.

Thanks for all the info, I will let you know.

The Lewis winch is neat, but you need a pretty substantial chain saw for it to get to its 8k potential. You will also make sure you have a gas can with 2 cycle fuel mix. Too much of a hassle for most of us.

ll this complex talk about winches....My head is spinning....

Been carrying a Lewis Winch in the truck for years. It's powered by my chainsaw engine so the chainsaw does double duty, cuts wood for the campfire and runs the winch if necessary. No electrical power needed. Just your chainsaw powerhead. I have a receiver adapter, fits the front receiver and the back receiver.

Won't pull you up a waterfall but will get you out of a jam or a mud bog, skids logs and is just nice to have along, just in case.

I never leave home without it.

Wasn't cheap but good North American made quality stuff isn't.

Some excellent points from Jefe.

Jefe's notes give some indication of the escalation in budget that can occur when you decide to go down a path like this - I have been there myself. What starts out as "hey, look, I could get one of these for only $150" ends up, once you are committed, to being 10 times the amount that originally drew you in. I run a winch on my Jeep because I run 4x4 events and have to recover vehicles from deep pits. But I haven't fitted one to my truck because I know from having killed cheap winches through water, mud and dust that I would need to spend $1000 on winch, but then would need a heavy steel winch bumper fitted to my truck, and all the wiring and isolator switch, and probably a bigger battery / pair of batteries - maybe expensive AGM ones, then a bigger alternator, and the extra weight now means I need to up-rate the front suspension.

So you are right to ask a load of questions before making a decision - you really have to ask yourself "how much use will I get out of this"?

Steve.

I know more money spend SHOULD get you better toy, but I was using the $180 winch commercially for few years and still have it.
You see the angle of my ramps on the picture. Here I park in the gutter so it is not that steep.
On couple of occasions I had to load 9000 lb forklift on flat.
When the rear went up on the ramp, the bottom of the mast would lift front wheels off the ground. So I was dragging the forklift up the ramp, while dragging the mast on asphalt. NO PROBLEM.
Having dual batteries on Powerstroke, I never bother to run the engine while using the winch.
The only problem I had with it- one time I pulled all the cable out- the bolt holding the end come off and I had to rebolt it.
Don't assume all $180 winches will give you such service, but it did work for me.
Talking about danger - I spend my whole life doing pretty danger professions and am one of few who survived those jobs with all fingers.

Kayteg, all true but what about the service rating? Cheaper winches cannot be run for any length of time else they go into the 'one piece, no moving parts' mode which is what happened to a guy with a China Freight 12K winch at ExPo a couple years ago. He used it with a seemingly not heavy vehicle but used it too long at a time trying to free himself from the mud and it burned out. If you plan on using the winch a lot, a hydraulic winch might be preferable as they just get the oil hot and have a very long service time compared to a 12v electric.
The other thing to watch out for is the line speed. Typically, the higher the winch is rated, pound wise, the slower the drum turns. It's axiomatic that the way they get the rating is to gear down. If you use the snatch block, the line speed moves to an absolute crawl. This is also true of the amp draw. My little Warn 8274, which had the fastest line speed in the west, drew an incredible 300 amps at dead stall. That's a lot of heat. It actually took down the battery in my Jeep on a long complicated pull and a dead engine. With the TC, I keep all three group 27 batteries in series so the winch can draw on all of them if the 125 amp truck alternator cannot keep up. If you have a big electric, 12v winch, a good bet would be a truck with the 'service, rescue or ambulance' package with TWO alternators.
I've seen people, first hand, with no winch technique, use way under rated winches trying to pull things out of their range and it's always a good show. Just don't stand any where near the action. That snapping cable, if whipped enough can make a mess out of the human body. Many years ago, I read an article which included a picture of the hole in a jeep windshield where the hook, which had detached from the winchee, had come right through the window and decapitated the driver. Ugh!
jefe

Warn and Superwinch make 20A single-phase AC models capable of 3000 lbs. I have not seen more powerful ones until you get into two-phase AC hoists.

Using the winch can turn into whole science.
Just for comparison, the picture below shows what I was doing with 8,000 lb winch and it was El Cheapo winch from HF.
The winch pulling power change drastically when cable changes the row on the drum.
What can be 12,000 lb on starting rolling the cable, can become 5000 lb when you already have 2 layers of cable on the drum and doing 3rd one.
Than you have cable block, that not only will double pulling power, but unwinding cable from the drum, will give you higher pulling power from the winch as well.
Car winches are coming with amp-sucking motors for speed as in 4WD application you are dealing with tens of ft of cable and you don't want to wait 10 minutes for cable to spool in.
Industrial 120V winches are design with different principals and they can't draw more than 20 amp as this is the electrical code they have to obey.

We need to clear the air a bit here.
Some winch basics for the truck part of a truck camper:
1. The commonly held formula for applying a winch to a rig (of any kind) is,
the winch pull rating should have at least 1-1/2 times the weight of the rig. So my 10K pound truck camper needs at least a 15K pound pull winch, and that's what we've got.
Remember that the larger the winch capacity, the higher the rating of the bearings, cable, roller fairlead and winch plate are.
2. The winch attachment hardware should be appropriate to the winch rating. I found short of a new winch bumper with correct rating, my Warn 15K had only one option; the Warn carrier.
3. Many commercially available winch carriers, especially those that plug into a receiver hitch are maxed out above 8K pounds, which automatically cuts them out of the equasion for a truck camper. The only way I would use one of these, and I have, is if you include a snatch block, extra length of cable with safety clipped hooks, a tree saver, and a Cat Choker and do only straight line pulls, which are rare.
4. Using my pickup without the camper to winch something heavier than the truck has always been problematic unless I 'dead man' the truck, which is to say; tie the truck to something heavier lest it slide along toward the heavier object you are trying to winch.
5. Is there such a thing as too much winch? Not for a truck camper. It's the weight (from 10K to 14K pounds) that will stop 2 or 3 jeeps with winches in unison to budge your TC. Most people do not need a winch because they never get that far off of pavement. Many of you are jeepers types who have been winch users and have broad knowledge and experience of how and when to use is it with a wary eye on what will stop your rig before you need it. I've had 6 or 7 winches of all kinds, and maybe 500 pulls of one kind or another and actually wore out my old Warn 8K using it more that 300 times until the bronze spur gear had no teeth left. Knowing what i know about winching, if I did not have a winch, I would be much more cautious on the routes I take without the winch backup and the technique to use it.
6. The limiting factor on having a winch that moves from front receiver to rear receiver is the weight. How heavy a winch can you lift? My Warn 15K weighs 150 pounds. I'm not up for lifting that. Also, there's the matter of power cables. No. 2-4 cable is heavy and expensive. You must have long cables to make it to the rear.
Here's my current winch set up with a welded on front receiver hitch, 26K pound 'D' rings and added cromoly tubing and a radiator saver:

Here's ctraveler2's Chinese winch on his custom built carrier. It' not going break. Note the holes for the 'D' rings and brackets attached directly to the Ford frame horns.