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Mar 01, 2012

Ford's answers to the NHTSA 6.7 Investigation

There was a request for a link to Ford's answer's to the NHTSA investigation posted on a previous thread, since closed. Here is the link:

Ford's NHTSA Answers to the 6.7 investigation

This PDF is over 20 pages long. There are some interesting statements contained in the documents. My favorite is the one where Ford says they buy the pump from Bosch as a "black box" and do no testing of the component. It is closely followed by the tantamount admission that the pump will not provide a long service life when exposed to the poor lubricity fuel found in the US. You will have to do the math using the sales versus failure tables for the US and Canadian trucks. Eye opening difference to say the least...

Regards

1,199 Replies

About Around The Campfire

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answers to the NHTSA 6.7 Investigation","id":"message:231771","revisionNum":1,"repliesCount":1199,"author":{"__ref":"User:user:222288"},"depth":0,"hasGivenKudo":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:231771"},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:231771"},"body":"There was a request for a link to Ford's answer's to the NHTSA investigation posted on a previous thread, since closed. Here is the link:

Ford's NHTSA Answers to the 6.7 investigation

This PDF is over 20 pages long. There are some interesting statements contained in the documents. My favorite is the one where Ford says they buy the pump from Bosch as a \"black box\" and do no testing of the component. It is closely followed by the tantamount admission that the pump will not provide a long service life when exposed to the poor lubricity fuel found in the US. You will have to do the math using the sales versus failure tables for the US and Canadian trucks. Eye opening difference to say the least...

Regards","body@stringLength":"899","rawBody":"There was a request for a link to Ford's answer's to the NHTSA investigation posted on a previous thread, since closed. Here is the link:

Ford's NHTSA Answers to the 6.7 investigation

This PDF is over 20 pages long. There are some interesting statements contained in the documents. My favorite is the one where Ford says they buy the pump from Bosch as a \"black box\" and do no testing of the component. It is closely followed by the tantamount admission that the pump will not provide a long service life when exposed to the poor lubricity fuel found in the US. You will have to do the math using the sales versus failure tables for the US and Canadian trucks. Eye opening difference to say the least...

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Here is the link: Ford's NHTSA Answers to the 6.7 investigation This PDF 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text-transform: none;\n\n &:hover {\n outline: 5px auto -webkit-focus-ring-color;\n outline-offset: -2px;\n }\n }\n }\n }\n }\n }\n}\n\n.footer-terms {\n display: flex;\n flex-direction: column;\n justify-content: center;\n align-items: center;\n padding: $theme-space-small 0;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n display: block;\n padding: 0;\n }\n\n > .row {\n padding-bottom: $theme-space-small;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n padding-bottom: $theme-space-base;\n }\n\n &.footer-terms-order-1 {\n order: 1;\n }\n\n &.footer-terms-order-2 {\n order: 2;\n }\n }\n}\n\n.footer-bottom {\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n padding-top: $theme-space-small;\n }\n\n .footer-bottom-list-center {\n display: flex;\n flex-direction: row;\n justify-content: center;\n align-items: center;\n flex-wrap: wrap;\n float: none;\n margin: 0 auto;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n display: block;\n }\n\n li {\n display: inline;\n padding: 0 $theme-space-base;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n border-right: 1px solid $goodsam-gray-700;\n padding: 0;\n\n &:first-child a {\n padding-left: 0;\n }\n\n &:last-child {\n border-right: 0;\n\n a {\n padding-right: 0;\n }\n }\n }\n\n a {\n display: inline-block;\n font-size: $theme-type-size-small;\n padding: $theme-space-small;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n display: inline;\n font-size: $theme-type-size-xsmall;\n padding: 0 12px 0 $theme-space-small;\n }\n }\n }\n }\n}\n\n.copyright {\n color: $goodsam-gray-footer;\n font-size: $theme-type-size-base;\n margin-bottom: 0;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n margin-bottom: $theme-space-small;\n }\n}\n\n#gsFooterSocial,\n.gsFooterSocial {\n background: $goodsam-gray-200;\n padding: 0 calc($theme-space-small + $theme-space-xsmall);\n .footerSocialItems,\n #footerSocialItems {\n text-align: center;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 767px) {\n text-align: left;\n }\n }\n\n .footerSocialItems ul,\n #footerSocialItems ul {\n list-style-type: none;\n margin: auto;\n padding-left: 0;\n\n li {\n display: inline;\n margin: 0 $theme-space-small;\n }\n }\n}\n","texts":{"custom.footer.col01.text.01":"Home","custom.footer.col01.url.01":"https://www.goodsam.com/","custom.footer.col01.text.02":"About Us","custom.footer.col01.url.02":"https://www.goodsam.com/about/","custom.footer.col01.text.03":"Contact Us","custom.footer.col01.url.03":"https://www.goodsam.com/contact","custom.footer.col01.text.04":"FAQ","custom.footer.col01.url.04":"https://www.goodsam.com/faq/","custom.footer.col01.text.05":"Site Map","custom.footer.col01.url.05":"https://www.goodsam.com/site-map.aspx","custom.footer.col02.text.01":"Code of Conduct","custom.footer.col02.url.01":"https://www.goodsam.com/code-of-conduct.aspx","custom.footer.col02.text.02":"Affiliate Program","custom.footer.col02.url.02":"https://www.goodsam.com/affiliate/","custom.footer.col02.text.03":"Become a Good Sam Campground","custom.footer.col02.url.03":"https://www.goodsamnetwork.com/","custom.footer.col02.text.04":"Good Sam Rewards Visa","custom.footer.col02.url.04":"https://www.goodsam.com/creditcard/","custom.footer.col02.text.05":"About Marcus Lemonis","custom.footer.col02.url.05":"https://www.goodsam.com/about-marcus-lemonis/","custom.footer.col03.text.01":"RV Sales","custom.footer.col03.url.01":"https://rv.campingworld.com/","custom.footer.col03.text.02":"RV Gear","custom.footer.col03.url.02":"https://www.campingworld.com/shop/","custom.footer.col03.text.03":"RV Maintenance & Repair","custom.footer.col03.url.03":"https://rv.campingworld.com/service/","custom.footer.col03.text.04":"Good Sam Membership & Services","custom.footer.col03.url.04":"https://www.goodsam.com/","custom.footer.col03.text.05":"Campground Solutions","custom.footer.col03.url.05":"https://campgroundsolutions.goodsam.com/","custom.footer.col04.text.01":"Helpful Articles and Tips","custom.footer.col04.url.01":"https://www.goodsam.com/article","custom.footer.col05.text.01":"Good Sam Apps","custom.footer.col05.url.01":"https://www.goodsam.com/rv-camping-apps/","custom.footer.col05.text.02":"Take Good Sam apps on your next RV Trip!","custom.footer.col05.url.02":"https://www.goodsam.com/rv-camping-apps/","custom.footer.col06.text.01":"Customer Service Phone Number:","custom.footer.col06.phone.number":"866-205-7451","custom.footer.col06.text.02":"Club contact number 866-205-7451","custom.footer.col06.url.02":"tel:866-205-7451","custom.footer.row01.logo.text":"Good Sam Home","custom.footer.row01.text.01":"Blog","custom.footer.row01.url.01":"http://blog.goodsam.com/","custom.footer.row01.text.02":"Careers","custom.footer.row01.url.02":"https://www.campingworldcareers.com/","custom.footer.row01.text.03":"Contact Us","custom.footer.row01.text.toggle":"Click to expand","custom.footer.row01.text.04":"Good Sam","custom.footer.row01.url.04":"https://www.goodsam.com/contact/","custom.footer.row01.text.05":"Camping World","custom.footer.row01.url.05":"https://www.campingworld.com/contact/","custom.footer.row01.text.06":"RV Sales","custom.footer.row01.url.06":"https://rv.campingworld.com/contact","custom.footer.row02.text.01":"Privacy Policy","custom.footer.row02.url.01":"https://www.goodsam.com/privacy-policy.aspx","custom.footer.row02.text.02":"California Privacy Rights","custom.footer.row02.url.02":"https://www.goodsam.com/privacy-policy.aspx#calinevada","custom.footer.row02.text.03":"Investor Relations","custom.footer.row02.url.03":"http://investor.campingworld.com","custom.footer.row02.text.04":"Terms of Use","custom.footer.row02.url.04":"https://www.goodsam.com/terms.aspx","custom.footer.row02.text.05":"Accessibility Commitment","custom.footer.row02.url.05":"https://www.goodsam.com/accessibility-commitment.aspx","custom.footer.row02.text.06":"Team Member Assistance","custom.footer.row02.url.06":"https://www.goodsam.com/helping-hand","custom.footer.social.facebook.text":"Facebook","custom.footer.social.facebook.url":"https://www.facebook.com/GoodSam","custom.footer.social.twitter.text":"Twitter","custom.footer.social.twitter.url":"https://twitter.com/GoodSam","custom.footer.social.youtube.text":"YouTube","custom.footer.social.youtube.url":"https://www.youtube.com/user/goodsamrvers","custom.footer.social.instagram.text":"Instagram","custom.footer.social.instagram.url":"https://www.instagram.com/goodsam/?hl=en","custom.footer.social.pinterest.text":"Pinterest","custom.footer.social.pinterest.url":"https://www.pinterest.com/goodsam/","custom-community-footer-copyright.text":"© {0} Good Sam Enterprises, LLC. All rights reserved."},"defaults":{"config":{"applicablePages":[],"description":"","fetchedContent":null,"__typename":"ComponentConfiguration"},"props":[],"__typename":"ComponentProperties"},"components":[{"id":"custom.widget.CustomFooter","form":null,"config":null,"props":[],"__typename":"Component"}],"grouping":"CUSTOM","__typename":"ComponentTemplate"},"properties":{"config":{"applicablePages":[],"description":"","fetchedContent":null,"__typename":"ComponentConfiguration"},"props":[],"__typename":"ComponentProperties"},"form":null,"__typename":"Component","localOverride":false},"globalCss":{"css":".custom_widget_CustomFooter_footer-wrapper_hp49n_21 {\n background: #474442;\n\n a {\n color: #dfdfdf;\n font-weight: 100;\n\n &:focus,\n &:hover {\n color: #dfdfdf;\n }\n }\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_sr-only_hp49n_34 {\n position: absolute;\n width: 0.0625rem;\n height: 0.0625rem;\n margin: -0.0625rem;\n padding: 0;\n overflow: hidden;\n clip: rect(0, 0, 0, 0);\n border: 0;\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_footer_hp49n_21 {\n line-height: 1.25rem;\n /* margin-left: auto;\n\tmargin-right: auto;\n\tpadding-left: $bootstrap-padding;\n\tpadding-right: $bootstrap-padding; */\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_container_hp49n_52 {\n margin-left: auto;\n margin-right: auto;\n max-width: 73.125rem;\n padding-left: 0.9375rem;\n padding-right: 0.9375rem;\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_row_hp49n_60 {\n /* HOTFIX - PSDS-32115 - Remove negative margins to fix mobile display */\n\n &::after {\n clear: both;\n }\n\n &::after,\n &::before {\n content: ' ';\n display: table;\n }\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col_hp49n_74 {\n float: left;\n min-height: 0.0625rem;\n padding-left: 0.9375rem;\n padding-right: 0.9375rem;\n position: relative;\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-xs-10_hp49n_82,\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-sm-10_hp49n_83 {\n width: 83.33333333%;\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-xs-12_hp49n_87,\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-sm-4_hp49n_88,\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-sm-12_hp49n_89,\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-md-2_hp49n_90,\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-md-8_hp49n_91,\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-md-10_hp49n_92,\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-md-12_hp49n_93,\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-lg-2_hp49n_94,\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-lg-8_hp49n_95,\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-lg-12_hp49n_96 {\n width: 100%;\n}\n@media screen and (min-width: 767px) {\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-md-2_hp49n_90 {\n width: 16.66666667%;\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-md-8_hp49n_91 {\n width: 66.66666667%;\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-md-10_hp49n_92 {\n width: 83.33333333%;\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-md-12_hp49n_93 {\n width: 100%;\n }\n}\n@media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-lg-2_hp49n_94 {\n width: 16.66666667%;\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-lg-4_hp49n_123 {\n /* faking it; should be 33.33333333% */\n width: 25%;\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-lg-8_hp49n_95 {\n /* faking it; should be 66.66666667% */\n width: 75%;\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-lg-10_hp49n_133 {\n width: 83.33333333%;\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_col-lg-12_hp49n_96 {\n width: 100%;\n }\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_pull-left_hp49n_142 {\n float: left;\n width: 100%;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 767px) {\n float: none;\n width: auto;\n }\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n float: left;\n }\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_pad-bottom-20_hp49n_156 {\n padding-bottom: 1.25rem;\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_pad-top-20_hp49n_160 {\n padding-top: 1.25rem;\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_pad-top-30_hp49n_164 {\n padding-top: calc(0.9375rem * 2);\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_pad-top-40_hp49n_168 {\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n padding-top: 2.5rem;\n }\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_margin-left-20_hp49n_174 {\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n margin-left: 1.25rem;\n }\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_margin-top-20_hp49n_180 {\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n margin-top: 1.25rem;\n }\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_text-center_hp49n_186 {\n text-align: center;\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_text-right_hp49n_190 {\n text-align: right;\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_text-smaller_hp49n_194,\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_text-small_hp49n_194 {\n font-size: 0.75rem;\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_text-large_hp49n_199 {\n font-size: 1.25rem;\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_footer-contact_hp49n_203 {\n p {\n display: flex;\n flex-direction: row;\n justify-content: center;\n align-items: center;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n display: block;\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_text-small_hp49n_194 {\n @media screen and (max-width: 991px) {\n font-size: 1rem;\n }\n }\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_icon-gs-app_hp49n_221 {\n margin-right: 1.25rem;\n max-width: 2.375rem;\n padding-right: 0.125rem;\n padding-top: 0.125rem;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n margin-left: 8.75rem;\n margin-right: 0;\n }\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_gsi-icon-phone_hp49n_233 {\n margin-bottom: -0.125rem;\n margin-right: 0.625rem;\n max-height: 1.25rem;\n width: 1.25rem;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n margin-right: 0;\n }\n }\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_footer-link_hp49n_245 {\n a,\n button {\n color: #dfdfdf;\n padding: 0 0.75rem 0 0.625rem;\n }\n\n li:last-child a {\n padding-right: 0;\n }\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_footer-top-links_hp49n_257 {\n padding-left: 0;\n list-style: none;\n display: flex;\n flex-direction: row;\n justify-content: center;\n align-items: center;\n flex-wrap: wrap;\n margin-bottom: 0.625rem;\n font-size: 1rem;\n\n @media screen and (max-width: 480px) {\n flex-direction: column;\n }\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n display: block;\n }\n\n li {\n margin-bottom: 1.25rem;\n padding: 0 1.25rem;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n padding: 0;\n }\n }\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_footer-top_hp49n_257 {\n border-bottom: 2px solid #c7c7c7;\n display: block;\n margin: auto;\n padding-top: 0.625rem;\n text-align: center;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n text-align: left;\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_footer-logo_hp49n_297 {\n max-height: 3.75rem;\n max-width: 8.75rem;\n padding: 0.625rem;\n padding-left: 0;\n padding-top: 0;\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_footer-list_hp49n_305 {\n display: flex;\n justify-content: center;\n align-items: center;\n list-style: none;\n margin-bottom: 0;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n display: block;\n float: right;\n }\n\n li {\n display: inline-block;\n padding: 0.625rem 0.3125rem;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n border-right: 1px solid #666;\n float: left;\n padding: 0;\n\n &:last-child {\n border-right: 0;\n }\n }\n\n a,\n button {\n font-size: 0.75rem;\n text-transform: uppercase;\n\n @media screen and (max-width: 768px) {\n display: block;\n padding: 0.625rem;\n }\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n font-size: 0.875rem;\n }\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_dropup_hp49n_346 {\n background-clip: padding-box;\n border: none;\n font-size: 0.875rem;\n list-style: none;\n padding-left: 0.3125rem;\n position: relative;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n float: left;\n }\n\n &:hover {\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_dropdown-menu_hp49n_359 {\n display: block;\n }\n }\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_footer-dropup-toggle_hp49n_365 {\n background: none;\n border: 0;\n padding: 0;\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_fa-angle-up_hp49n_370 {\n /* @include li-icon ($fa-var-angle-up, $pseudo: before, $size: $theme-type-size-base, $color: $goodsam-gray-footer);\n padding-left: $theme-space-xsmall;\n padding-right: $theme-space-xsmall; */\n }\n }\n\n .custom_widget_CustomFooter_dropdown-menu_hp49n_359 {\n background-color: #fff;\n border-radius: 0.25rem;\n bottom: 100%;\n margin: 0.125rem 0 0;\n min-width: 10rem;\n padding: 0.3125rem 0;\n position: absolute;\n right: 0;\n\n li {\n border-right: 0;\n float: none;\n text-align: left;\n\n @media screen and (max-width: 768px) {\n display: block;\n }\n\n a {\n color: #474442;\n display: block;\n text-transform: none;\n\n &:hover {\n outline: 5px auto -webkit-focus-ring-color;\n outline-offset: -2px;\n }\n }\n }\n }\n }\n }\n}\n.custom_widget_CustomFooter_footer-terms_hp49n_412 {\n display: flex;\n flex-direction: column;\n justify-content: center;\n align-items: center;\n padding: 0.625rem 0;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n display: block;\n padding: 0;\n }\n\n > .custom_widget_CustomFooter_row_hp49n_60 {\n padding-bottom: 0.625rem;\n\n @media screen and (min-width: 992px) {\n padding-bottom: 1.25rem;\n }\n\n &.custom_widget_CustomFooter_footer-terms-order-1_hp49n_431 {\n 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Investigation","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:232930"},"body":"New discussion taking place at The Diesel Stop about the 6.7...Kinda funny...the discussion takes on the appearance that this is a recent development. It includes some comments about the new dieselsite product...

I posted my Broken drum story over there when it happened...the thread lasted about an hour and was deleted...I am surprised this one has lasted 3 pages...I posted...any bets on how long it lasts...

Good bye Ford thread at TDS

Regards","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2012-12-01T06:59:38.000-08:00","lastPublishTime":"2012-12-01T06:59:38.000-08:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":516},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:AroundTheCampfire/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board/message:231771/message:232930","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"639","rawBody":"New discussion taking place at The Diesel Stop about the 6.7...Kinda funny...the discussion takes on the appearance that this is a recent development. It includes some comments about the new dieselsite product...

I posted my Broken drum story over there when it happened...the thread lasted about an hour and was deleted...I am surprised this one has lasted 3 pages...I posted...any bets on how long it lasts...

Good bye Ford thread at TDS

Regards","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:232930_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"User:user:237915":{"__typename":"User","id":"user:237915","uid":237915,"login":"BenK","biography":null,"registrationData":{"__typename":"RegistrationData","status":null,"registrationTime":"2002-04-18T11:36:55.000-07:00"},"deleted":false,"email":"","avatar":{"__typename":"UserAvatar","url":"https://community.goodsam.com/t5/s/feyqc97479/m_assets/avatars/default/avatar-9.svg?time=1737155183000"},"rank":{"__ref":"Rank:rank:42"},"entityType":"USER","eventPath":"community:feyqc97479/user:237915"},"ModerationData:moderation_data:232929":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:232929","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:232929":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:237915"},"id":"message:232929","revisionNum":1,"uid":232929,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:231771"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:231771"},"subject":"Re: Ford's answers to the NHTSA 6.7 Investigation","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:232929"},"body":"Sounds like 'dry start', just like ICE's

Film strength of the lube very important on dry starts

Is this conformation of #1 ?

#1, poor choice to use diesel as the lube
#2, poor cam/crank cavity design
#3, poor piston to crank/cam design and should be positively captured
#4, poor cavity/routing/valving/etc that creates cavitation potentials

Via SmartPhone...excuse the fat finger typos!","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2012-11-30T22:23:10.000-08:00","lastPublishTime":"2012-11-30T22:23:10.000-08:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":516},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:AroundTheCampfire/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board/message:231771/message:232929","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"501","rawBody":"Sounds like 'dry start', just like ICE's

Film strength of the lube very important on dry starts

Is this conformation of #1 ?

#1, poor choice to use diesel as the lube
#2, poor cam/crank cavity design
#3, poor piston to crank/cam design and should be positively captured
#4, poor cavity/routing/valving/etc that creates cavitation potentials

Via SmartPhone...excuse the fat finger typos!","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:232929_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"User:user:310534":{"__typename":"User","id":"user:310534","uid":310534,"login":"NewsW","biography":null,"registrationData":{"__typename":"RegistrationData","status":null,"registrationTime":"2012-02-06T11:06:20.000-08:00"},"deleted":false,"email":"","avatar":{"__typename":"UserAvatar","url":"https://community.goodsam.com/t5/s/feyqc97479/m_assets/avatars/default/avatar-6.svg?time=1737155183000"},"rank":{"__ref":"Rank:rank:42"},"entityType":"USER","eventPath":"community:feyqc97479/user:310534"},"ModerationData:moderation_data:232928":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:232928","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:232928":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:310534"},"id":"message:232928","revisionNum":1,"uid":232928,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:231771"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:231771"},"subject":"Re: Ford's answers to the NHTSA 6.7 Investigation","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:232928"},"body":"A post over at TDI pointed out this factoid:

The brand new 2013 Porsche Cayenne Diesel (with CP4)...

Cannot do stop-start (to save fuel).. because...

Porsche wrote:
“It’s a matter of lubricating the high-pressure fuel pumps,” he adds. “They’re delicate.”

Thomas Herold, manager of ?Special Operations R&D

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2013-porsche-cayenne-diesel-first-drive-review

Nice to know the dainty and delicate HPFPs used in the Porsche diesel.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2012-11-30T17:50:17.000-08:00","lastPublishTime":"2012-11-30T17:50:17.000-08:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":516},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:AroundTheCampfire/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board/message:231771/message:232928","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"571","rawBody":"A post over at TDI pointed out this factoid:

The brand new 2013 Porsche Cayenne Diesel (with CP4)...

Cannot do stop-start (to save fuel).. because...

Porsche wrote:
“It’s a matter of lubricating the high-pressure fuel pumps,” he adds. “They’re delicate.”

Thomas Herold, manager of ?Special Operations R&D

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2013-porsche-cayenne-diesel-first-drive-review

Nice to know the dainty and delicate HPFPs used in the Porsche diesel.","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:232928_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"User:user:61356":{"__typename":"User","id":"user:61356","uid":61356,"login":"TriumphGuy","biography":null,"registrationData":{"__typename":"RegistrationData","status":null,"registrationTime":"2004-11-02T15:54:54.000-08:00"},"deleted":false,"email":"","avatar":{"__typename":"UserAvatar","url":"https://community.goodsam.com/t5/s/feyqc97479/m_assets/avatars/default/avatar-1.svg?time=1737155183000"},"rank":{"__ref":"Rank:rank:42"},"entityType":"USER","eventPath":"community:feyqc97479/user:61356"},"ModerationData:moderation_data:232927":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:232927","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:232927":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:61356"},"id":"message:232927","revisionNum":1,"uid":232927,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:231771"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:231771"},"subject":"Re: Ford's answers to the NHTSA 6.7 Investigation","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:232927"},"body":"

NewsW wrote:

You are not seeing the discount because refiners are making good money shipping finished product (diesel) to Europe, playing the spread between Brent and West Texas Intermediate.

If the Iranian embargo is not there, Brent price would have equalized with West Texas by now.

I keep making the mistake of not thinking globally. Just because US has supply and refining capacity it doesn't necessarily translate into our fuel prices changing (for the better anyway)...","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2012-11-30T16:28:46.000-08:00","lastPublishTime":"2012-11-30T16:28:46.000-08:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":516},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:AroundTheCampfire/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board/message:231771/message:232927","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"541","rawBody":"

NewsW wrote:

You are not seeing the discount because refiners are making good money shipping finished product (diesel) to Europe, playing the spread between Brent and West Texas Intermediate.

If the Iranian embargo is not there, Brent price would have equalized with West Texas by now.

I keep making the mistake of not thinking globally. Just because US has supply and refining capacity it doesn't necessarily translate into our fuel prices changing (for the better anyway)...","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:232927_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"ModerationData:moderation_data:232926":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:232926","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:232926":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:310534"},"id":"message:232926","revisionNum":1,"uid":232926,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:231771"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:231771"},"subject":"Re: Ford's answers to the NHTSA 6.7 Investigation","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:232926"},"body":"Lets think chemistry for a bit... I am not a chemist, but here is what comes to mind:

2 Fe2O3 + 3 C ? 4 Fe + 3 CO2

exothermic...

Or:

3 Fe2O3 + H2 ? 2 Fe3O4 + H2O

Fe3O4 is an abrasive.

Mohs Hardness @20°C 5.5 to 6.5

Hmmmm...

Slice right through aluminum at Moh 2.5-3 at 20C","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2012-11-30T12:28:18.000-08:00","lastPublishTime":"2012-11-30T12:28:18.000-08:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":374},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:AroundTheCampfire/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board/message:231771/message:232926","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"379","rawBody":"Lets think chemistry for a bit... I am not a chemist, but here is what comes to mind:

2 Fe2O3 + 3 C ? 4 Fe + 3 CO2

exothermic...

Or:

3 Fe2O3 + H2 ? 2 Fe3O4 + H2O

Fe3O4 is an abrasive.

Mohs Hardness @20°C 5.5 to 6.5

Hmmmm...

Slice right through aluminum at Moh 2.5-3 at 20C","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:232926_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"ModerationData:moderation_data:232925":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:232925","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:232925":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:237915"},"id":"message:232925","revisionNum":1,"uid":232925,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:231771"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:231771"},"subject":"Re: Ford's answers to the NHTSA 6.7 Investigation","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:232925"},"body":"Agree, but again why does the cam/follower/etc become an issue, as they are in
the upstream (atmosphere, or low pressure) of the higher pressures?

Again, we need to know the makeup of the debris from failed systems.

Betcha cam/follower/piston material and of that, DLC...

Agree that bio-diesel is another issue and will have their own problems
at these pressures, but the failures to date seem to involve the cam
cavity components (debris)

Edit...hey, maybe two 'main' problems that has Bosch looking at just
one...that then masks the real 'first' in a sequence of failure...

I still think diesel as a lubricant is insane for this application...was
going to say stupid, but Marty might slap me for that... :B","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2012-11-30T11:59:31.000-08:00","lastPublishTime":"2012-11-30T11:59:31.000-08:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":327},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:AroundTheCampfire/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board/message:231771/message:232925","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"790","rawBody":"Agree, but again why does the cam/follower/etc become an issue, as they are in
the upstream (atmosphere, or low pressure) of the higher pressures?

Again, we need to know the makeup of the debris from failed systems.

Betcha cam/follower/piston material and of that, DLC...

Agree that bio-diesel is another issue and will have their own problems
at these pressures, but the failures to date seem to involve the cam
cavity components (debris)

Edit...hey, maybe two 'main' problems that has Bosch looking at just
one...that then masks the real 'first' in a sequence of failure...

I still think diesel as a lubricant is insane for this application...was
going to say stupid, but Marty might slap me for that... :B","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:232925_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"ModerationData:moderation_data:232924":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:232924","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:232924":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:310534"},"id":"message:232924","revisionNum":1,"uid":232924,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:231771"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:231771"},"subject":"Re: Ford's answers to the NHTSA 6.7 Investigation","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:232924"},"body":"Water was not a problem until we saw the higher pressures.

All of a sudden, we got water making its way into the system, forming rust particle that are then all subject to 2,000 bar, possibly making the mixture break down again and become reactive.

It may not be water per se that is the problem, but the reactive byproducts, or in the case of the photo on dieselsite's thread, metabolites from biofuel that have degraded.

We are really heading into unknown territory with the high pressures and biofuels all at once.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2012-11-30T11:57:02.000-08:00","lastPublishTime":"2012-11-30T11:57:02.000-08:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":328},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:AroundTheCampfire/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board/message:231771/message:232924","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"550","rawBody":"Water was not a problem until we saw the higher pressures.

All of a sudden, we got water making its way into the system, forming rust particle that are then all subject to 2,000 bar, possibly making the mixture break down again and become reactive.

It may not be water per se that is the problem, but the reactive byproducts, or in the case of the photo on dieselsite's thread, metabolites from biofuel that have degraded.

We are really heading into unknown territory with the high pressures and biofuels all at once.","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:232924_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"ModerationData:moderation_data:232923":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:232923","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:232923":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:237915"},"id":"message:232923","revisionNum":1,"uid":232923,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:231771"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:231771"},"subject":"Re: Ford's answers to the NHTSA 6.7 Investigation","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:232923"},"body":"Rick's current/new thread should be here and it's link http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/26558921.cfm

Because I think it is addressing H2O out of context, or am off base...

Must ask some questions of you folks

What does H2O mess up in the diesel injection system? I know enough about diesel
from before this current Bosch system. Knew that H2O was not good for the
parts in the injection system because they were not plated with corrosion protection.
That the injectors ate it as does or would my GMT400 7.4L's injection system
if H2O or enough H2O got into my gasoline system

Known issue with the Bosch pump, but am after a divide and conquer position

Does anyone know if the injectors or anything down stream from the HPFP fails
due to H2O? or should say fail catastrophically as noted in this discussion?

Goes back to the bad decision by Bosch to use diesel as the lubrication for
their cam/follower/etc.

That the mechanical injection system of several folks in my city (many MB's and one
Volvo) has no problems with Bio-Diesel. They have been running that stuff for
years and know so because there was a huge bugaboo about a family run business
asking for a permit for bio-diesel on their property (used to be and still is
a mechanic's garage.

I still think that addressing H2O is only a band-aide...the root cause is diesel
as a lubricant and the pump cam/follower/etc is also a poor design by not
capturing the piston to the follower

To address that root cause is to remove diesel as the lubricant and re-plumb
pressurized engine oil as a replacement for the cam/follower/etc lubricant.

Then re-plumb the diesel to the HPFP's fuel intake to by-pass the cam cavity.

If H2O is the true problem, then the system should continue to have these types
of failures

If diesel as a lubricant, then the pressurized engine oil should solve or eliminate
these failures...should qualify that, as that is to assume that the cam/follower
is acceptable in design for the PSI's or BAR's involved

What am I missing and am off base here?","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2012-11-30T11:52:26.000-08:00","lastPublishTime":"2012-11-30T11:52:26.000-08:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":327},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:AroundTheCampfire/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board/message:231771/message:232923","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"2386","rawBody":"Rick's current/new thread should be here and it's link http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/26558921.cfm

Because I think it is addressing H2O out of context, or am off base...

Must ask some questions of you folks

What does H2O mess up in the diesel injection system? I know enough about diesel
from before this current Bosch system. Knew that H2O was not good for the
parts in the injection system because they were not plated with corrosion protection.
That the injectors ate it as does or would my GMT400 7.4L's injection system
if H2O or enough H2O got into my gasoline system

Known issue with the Bosch pump, but am after a divide and conquer position

Does anyone know if the injectors or anything down stream from the HPFP fails
due to H2O? or should say fail catastrophically as noted in this discussion?

Goes back to the bad decision by Bosch to use diesel as the lubrication for
their cam/follower/etc.

That the mechanical injection system of several folks in my city (many MB's and one
Volvo) has no problems with Bio-Diesel. They have been running that stuff for
years and know so because there was a huge bugaboo about a family run business
asking for a permit for bio-diesel on their property (used to be and still is
a mechanic's garage.

I still think that addressing H2O is only a band-aide...the root cause is diesel
as a lubricant and the pump cam/follower/etc is also a poor design by not
capturing the piston to the follower

To address that root cause is to remove diesel as the lubricant and re-plumb
pressurized engine oil as a replacement for the cam/follower/etc lubricant.

Then re-plumb the diesel to the HPFP's fuel intake to by-pass the cam cavity.

If H2O is the true problem, then the system should continue to have these types
of failures

If diesel as a lubricant, then the pressurized engine oil should solve or eliminate
these failures...should qualify that, as that is to assume that the cam/follower
is acceptable in design for the PSI's or BAR's involved

What am I missing and am off base here?","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":2,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:232923_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"ModerationData:moderation_data:232922":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:232922","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:232922":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:310534"},"id":"message:232922","revisionNum":1,"uid":232922,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:231771"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:231771"},"subject":"Re: Ford's answers to the NHTSA 6.7 Investigation","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:232922"},"body":"If you have energy stock, be sure you watch the point and figure chart and unload it before the next downturn.

I am seeing early signs of a downturn right now.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"162","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2012-11-29T13:08:40.000-08:00","lastPublishTime":"2012-11-29T13:08:40.000-08:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":327},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:AroundTheCampfire/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board/message:231771/message:232922","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"170","rawBody":"If you have energy stock, be sure you watch the point and figure chart and unload it before the next downturn.

I am seeing early signs of a downturn right now.","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:232922_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"User:user:137140":{"__typename":"User","id":"user:137140","uid":137140,"login":"NinerBikes","biography":null,"registrationData":{"__typename":"RegistrationData","status":null,"registrationTime":"2012-03-14T15:52:06.000-07:00"},"deleted":false,"email":"","avatar":{"__typename":"UserAvatar","url":"https://community.goodsam.com/t5/s/feyqc97479/m_assets/avatars/default/avatar-11.svg?time=1737155183000"},"rank":{"__ref":"Rank:rank:42"},"entityType":"USER","eventPath":"community:feyqc97479/user:137140"},"ModerationData:moderation_data:232921":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:232921","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:232921":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:137140"},"id":"message:232921","revisionNum":1,"uid":232921,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:231771"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:231771"},"subject":"Re: Ford's answers to the NHTSA 6.7 Investigation","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:232921"},"body":"Anything to keep the supply short and the price up on diesel fuel. I'm sitting here in Kansas City, MO, and diesel is as much here as back home in Los Angeles. :m , which hurts when going through it trailering with my V6 Touareg with a head wind going west and a measly 13 MPG as a result. Glad I have plenty on energy stock in my portfolio.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2012-11-29T10:30:52.000-08:00","lastPublishTime":"2012-11-29T10:30:52.000-08:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":327},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:AroundTheCampfire/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:AroundTheCampfireforum-board/message:231771/message:232921","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"342","rawBody":"Anything to keep the supply short and the price up on diesel fuel. I'm sitting here in Kansas City, MO, and diesel is as much here as back home in Los Angeles. :m , which hurts when going through it trailering with my V6 Touareg with a head wind going west and a measly 13 MPG as a result. Glad I have plenty on energy stock in my portfolio.","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:232921_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/community/NavbarDropdownToggle-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/community/NavbarDropdownToggle-1741694506000","value":{"ariaLabelClosed":"Press the down arrow to open the menu"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/EscalatedMessageBanner-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/EscalatedMessageBanner-1741694506000","value":{"escalationMessage":"Escalated to Salesforce by {username} on {date}","viewDetails":"View Details","modalTitle":"Case Details","escalatedBy":"Escalated by: ","escalatedOn":"Escalated on: ","caseNumber":"Case Number: ","status":"Status: ","lastUpdateDate":"Last Update: ","automaticEscalation":"automatic escalation","anonymous":"Anonymous"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/users/UserLink-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/users/UserLink-1741694506000","value":{"authorName":"View Profile: {author}","anonymous":"Anonymous"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-shared/client/components/users/UserRank-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-shared/client/components/users/UserRank-1741694506000","value":{"rankName":"{rankName}","userRank":"Author rank {rankName}"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/MessageTime-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/MessageTime-1741694506000","value":{"postTime":"Published: {time}","lastPublishTime":"Last Update: {time}","conversation.lastPostingActivityTime":"Last posting activity time: {time}","conversation.lastPostTime":"Last post time: {time}","moderationData.rejectTime":"Rejected time: {time}"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/MessageSolvedBadge-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/MessageSolvedBadge-1741694506000","value":{"solved":"Solved"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/MessageSubject-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/MessageSubject-1741694506000","value":{"noSubject":"(no subject)"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/MessageBody-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/MessageBody-1741694506000","value":{"showMessageBody":"Show More","mentionsErrorTitle":"{mentionsType, select, board {Board} user {User} message {Message} other {}} No Longer Available","mentionsErrorMessage":"The {mentionsType} you are trying to view has been removed from the community.","videoProcessing":"Video is being processed. 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