carrying up front

avvidclif1 wrote:

jus2shy wrote:

avvidclif1 wrote:

jus2shy wrote:
Just a quick note. You're putting 300 to 400 lbs on the front of your truck. However, your fulcrum is your front axle. So even though you're putting 300 lbs on the front of the truck, you are also going to pull a few hundred pounds from the rear as well. So you may be putting an additional 500 or 700 lbs on the front axle of your truck. It'll help spread more pin-weight to the front axle and give your rear axle a little relieve, but you already have a heavy engine on the front tires. Also note that you will have yourself and anything between the tires putting some weight on the front axle as well. Check how much overhead you have.

California Physics???????

That 500 to 700 is inclusive of the scooters weight. Regardless, you are going to have a teeter totter effect. So you do pull weight above the scooters towards the front. The same principle allows a weight distribution hitch to put weight on the front axle, using the rear axle as the fulcrum.

The fulcrum on a weight distributing hitch is the hitch itself, not the rear axle, think about it. The rear of the truck goes up and the front down, it doesn't pivot on the rear axle.

Yeah, I figured that out after I posted and thought about it for the night. I think a better example is just a regular ball hitch with no weight distribution, then your rear axle is a fulcrum and you're taking weight off of the front of the vehicle. Therefore you're adding the tongue weight plus some of the weight carried by the front axle to the rear axle.

Bah, here's a quick calculation. I don't know the wheelbase of the OP's truck, but say he has 10' between the tires, and from the front axle to where the scooter will sit forward of his truck, he has about 4'. Let's also assume the scooter weights 400 lbs for simplicity's sake.

The scooter will be putting down a force of about 1600 lbft from where it sits in front of the truck. The other side would be putting down the same amount of force to keep the "teeter-totter" level. So since the front axle is the fulcrum in the OP's case, the rear axle would stand to lose about 160 lbs of weight because of leverage being taken into account. But the overall mass exerted onto the front axle would actually be about 800 lbs. As for every reaction, there's an equal and opposite reaction. Simple teeter totter equation: Mass1 x distance1 = Mass2 x distance2.

I know it's bad to use imperial units, as most physics is done in metric but I figure these units are easier to relate to. Also, it's been a while since I've thought about leverage and statics and stuff.

jus2shy wrote:

avvidclif1 wrote:

jus2shy wrote:
Just a quick note. You're putting 300 to 400 lbs on the front of your truck. However, your fulcrum is your front axle. So even though you're putting 300 lbs on the front of the truck, you are also going to pull a few hundred pounds from the rear as well. So you may be putting an additional 500 or 700 lbs on the front axle of your truck. It'll help spread more pin-weight to the front axle and give your rear axle a little relieve, but you already have a heavy engine on the front tires. Also note that you will have yourself and anything between the tires putting some weight on the front axle as well. Check how much overhead you have.

California Physics???????

That 500 to 700 is inclusive of the scooters weight. Regardless, you are going to have a teeter totter effect. So you do pull weight above the scooters towards the front. The same principle allows a weight distribution hitch to put weight on the front axle, using the rear axle as the fulcrum.

The fulcrum on a weight distributing hitch is the hitch itself, not the rear axle, think about it. The rear of the truck goes up and the front down, it doesn't pivot on the rear axle.

As noted, the OP is probably over the trucks GVWR to start with. The OP needs to head down to the scales and weigh his truck and trailer. Most diesel pickups are very near the front axle GVWR without hanging an additional 300# plus on the front.

The scooter may well over load the front axle. Then you have the issue of blocking the radiator and also the lights and turn signals on the front.

Ken

avvidclif1 wrote:

jus2shy wrote:
Just a quick note. You're putting 300 to 400 lbs on the front of your truck. However, your fulcrum is your front axle. So even though you're putting 300 lbs on the front of the truck, you are also going to pull a few hundred pounds from the rear as well. So you may be putting an additional 500 or 700 lbs on the front axle of your truck. It'll help spread more pin-weight to the front axle and give your rear axle a little relieve, but you already have a heavy engine on the front tires. Also note that you will have yourself and anything between the tires putting some weight on the front axle as well. Check how much overhead you have.

California Physics???????

That 500 to 700 is inclusive of the scooters weight. Regardless, you are going to have a teeter totter effect. So you do pull weight above the scooters towards the front. The same principle allows a weight distribution hitch to put weight on the front axle, using the rear axle as the fulcrum.

jus2shy wrote:
Just a quick note. You're putting 300 to 400 lbs on the front of your truck. However, your fulcrum is your front axle. So even though you're putting 300 lbs on the front of the truck, you are also going to pull a few hundred pounds from the rear as well. So you may be putting an additional 500 or 700 lbs on the front axle of your truck. It'll help spread more pin-weight to the front axle and give your rear axle a little relieve, but you already have a heavy engine on the front tires. Also note that you will have yourself and anything between the tires putting some weight on the front axle as well. Check how much overhead you have.

California Physics???????

Just a quick note. You're putting 300 to 400 lbs on the front of your truck. However, your fulcrum is your front axle. So even though you're putting 300 lbs on the front of the truck, you are also going to pull a few hundred pounds from the rear as well. So you may be putting an additional 500 or 700 lbs on the front axle of your truck. It'll help spread more pin-weight to the front axle and give your rear axle a little relieve, but you already have a heavy engine on the front tires. Also note that you will have yourself and anything between the tires putting some weight on the front axle as well. Check how much overhead you have.

Just did 9,000 miles with 2 bicycles on front of 2004 GMC 2500 HD. Had too replace front wheel bearings and some other suspension parts when we got home ! Not sure if extra weight contributed or just time for new parts on a 10 year old truck !!

A scooter isn't a solid wall and it doesn't sit tight up against the radiator, so, I think too much is made of that concern. I carry a basket up front quite often.

I have had 2 F250s pulling 5th wheels. Both were overloaded and required air bags. Adding more will not help. I dont think enough air would be restricted to hurt. Some of the grill guards used here with ranchers will restrict more then probably what you would put there. Overall weight is the problem.

I also have a 13 250, with heavy duty service suspension. My yellow sticker payload is 3,232.

I could handle a 12,000# loaded weight FW, plus hitch, gear, and passengers.

I would have no room left for a front hitch, plus weight of carrier, and a 3-4 hundred # scooter.

I also don't see the need for sarcasm, but since the OP asked what do you think, I would say you will likely be over loaded, and could cause cooling problems.

Jerry