Forum Discussion

bmwdriver2019's avatar
Feb 15, 2023

class A safety

good morning all
im pretty new to rving and learning as much as i can , im a retired bmw tech with 20 years under my belt . and proud of it, so i know pretty much the auto business
my fiancée and i on my retirement purchased a 2014 winnebgao vista 35f from our camping world , they were totally awesome, the motorhome only had about 6k miles , we purchased it in Jan of 2020, then covid hit
on our first venture out or as my fiancee called it a " shake down " cruise , and it was , up to 50 mph it was smooth sailing ,above 50 , it was like driving in a tornado , back of the speed , smooth as silk, after speaking with many people who have the same exact motorhome as we ,i come to find out that a rear track bar and front steering dampener is needed to correct this issue, and one person stated, i can bet it will fix your problems , for they had the same issue as many other people did , well, we had the items installed and it was smooth up to 65 mph , we would not drive normally faster than 55/60 mph for safetys sake , this is NOT a bmw ,lollol, nor handle like one
my issue is how foes ford and winnebago and others get away with concerns for safety on the f53 chassis as they do , the f53 chassis is a cookie cutter chassis where one size fits all, and from hearing and reading what people do to correct the safety issue of the f53 chassis dilemmas , where people have the white knuckle affect as if they were flying in a plane for the first time , im very curious of how the NHTSA would feel on non corrected safety and handling issues of the class a motorhome ??/ as not being a person who cares for ford in any way , but we bought the motorhome for the winnebago name , defiantly not ford , for i do feel they do as little as possible in pretty much all they do
having many friends who are seasoned rvers and alot more experience than i and some actually been a cdl truck driver in the past actually prefered the gm work horse chassis liked it entirely better for the way it handled, it did not have the safety and handling issues of the f53 chassis does, why this is allowed and nobody questions it as it do ,,,,,,, it affects numerous rv makers chassis , and the basic body doesnt matter who made it , its the chassis improvements that change the handling ,its nothing to the body , i do believe there surely needs to a higher standard than whats there , and since ford right now has a monopoly on class A chassis they are doing as they do with as little as possible which is par for the course with them , i do believe IF GM was manufacturing class A rv chassis , to a degree it would be to a higher standard than what is there now
  • As Doug & Dodge Guy suggested. Start with the toe in. I spent my younger years in the front end business and toe in is a major player in driveability. I suggest 5/32" as a good compromise between driveability and tire wear.
    I purchased my F53 in Tucson, AZ. and it was a struggle getting it back to K.C., MO. The toe in was Zero. I set it to 5/32" and it was drivable with one hand.

    Richard
  • My 2012 we bought used in 2019. It had all the suspension stuff don’t prior to us buying it. Hellwig front and rear sway bars, front and rear sumo springs, front and rear Koni FSD shocks. And a Blue Ox True Center steering stabilizer and tires that were 2 years old. All of this and the ride home from the dealer was exhausting. After extensive research I checked the front toe and it was tied out by 3/8 of an inch which explained why it was back and forth in the lane. They had it aligned when they bought the tires but they didn’t do it correctly! I set the toe to 3/16 toe in and it made it drive like a 22k lb sports car. You could one hand it at 70 if you wanted.
    So definitely get the alignment checked at a reputable shop that will actually do the alignment properly and not fudge the numbers to make it look like it was done.
  • bmwdriver2019,

    I think Doug pretty much nailed it with his response. If I may, I'd like to add a bit more.

    First, I have to say I had a chuckle when I read your username. Have you ever driven a high center of gravity vehicle before? LOL You're right. The motorhome is NOT a BMW, but perhaps you're so used to that snappy handling of a sport sedan, the difference was excpetionally unnerving. A full size van doesn't handle like a luxury sedan, either. One has to understand the type of vehicle they're driving. An RV is not only longer and therefore susceptible to bow-wave pushes from trucks and such, but also has a very high center of gravity which impacts handling.

    Remember, Ford makes the chassis and when it leaves Ford, that's all it is. It's up the RV Manufacturer to put the house on it. The same chassis might be the base for possibly dozens of various floorplans. Each floorplan might load that chassis differently, depending upon where water/waste tanks are located, appliances, the number and size of slideouts, the number of AC's on the roof, etc. There are a lot of variables in the equation. Not to mention that in some cases, manufacturers do a very poor job of distributing the weight side to side or front to back, and have even been known to sell models which exceed the axle weight ratings set by the manufacturer. Or, sell a rig where it's dry weight is just under that of the specs, so as soon as you put people, food and some water in it, you're over loaded. Remember that more weight behind the rear axle lifts weight off the front axle, and that can affect handling. That's not Ford's fault, it's that of the RV manufacturers.

    Along with what Doug said, I'd recommend that you get your rig weighed. Have it fully loaded to travel with food, fuels, water, people & stuff. Best time to do it is when you're heading out on your next trip, right after you fill the tanks (fuel & water). Four corner weights are best, but even front and rear axle weights are a good start. From those weights, make sure your tires are inflated to the proper pressure for the load they are carrying on each axle. Dealerships & tire stores tend to inflate tires to the maximum pressure on the sidewall of the tire. I think for the vast majority of RVs, that results in tires that are over-inflated for the weight they are carrying which can result in a harsh ride and harder to control vehicle. So, if you haven't done that yet, find some truck scales nearby and have it weighed.

    Then, as Doug mentioned, have it aligned.

    If it still has some issues, there are things you can do and devices you can add/upgrade which can give some additional help. There are numerous posts on this forum which address that.

    I really don't see what you described as being a safety issue on the level at which NHTSA should get involved. As I mentioned above, Ford has no idea how the chassis will ultimately be used by the RV manufacturer. How could they be made to be responsible? Now if there were a lot of accidents and deaths involving the F53 chassis that were attributed to a poor suspension design, that would be different. But I don't believe there are. Or, if the issue was brake calipers locking up and fuel rail clips leaking gasoline (which WERE an issue for Workhorse), then those items need to be addressed by the manufacturer. And they were. But holding Ford responsible for less than ideal handling on a vehicle which probably isn't set up properly (meaning to Ford's specs) to begin with? Kinda unfair to do that.

    By the way, my rig is on one of those "Workhorse" chassis's. We've had it since it was new. It handled pretty well, better than I expected it to, and I was a newbie to the RV world when we bought it. But after the first year or two, I did opt to upgrade to better shock absorbers for better control. They definitely helped and it was worth the expense at the time. Back in the 2000's, Ford and Workhorse had to continually make improvements to gain buyer support. The competition there was to everyone's advantage. That said, the Workhorse Chassis generally cost anywhere from $2-$4,000 (memory is a bit foggy there, but I think that was about it) more than a comparable Ford unit, and the majority of people and dealerships opted for the Ford chassis. This was for buyers who either didn't understand the difference, didn't care, or just wanted to spend the extra dollars.

    Ok, much longer than I intended. Hopefully this helps put some perspective on things for you. I can say that the more you drive the rig, the more comfortable you get doing so.

    Good Luck and let us know how you make out with any improvements.

    ~Rick
  • I have been an RV tech for 44 years. 25 as a Master RV Technician. Ford Class A chassis have ALWAYS had handling problems. It usually boils down to a simple fix. GET IT ALIGNED BY A QUALIFIED ALIGNMENT FACILITY. Balanced Tires and CORRECT Alignment fixes Ford handling issues. The Steering dampner does NOT fix handling issues on Ford Chassis. BUT, once the alignment is done, a Steering stabilizer is a good thing to have. IF not aligned correctly, a Steering system cannot fix mis alignment issues. It can actually aggravate the issues. Doug