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MilesandSmiles's avatar
MilesandSmiles
Explorer
Sep 19, 2015

Math for determining CCC

Today at the Hershey show I looked at a Winnebago Forza 38R that my wife and I are both impressed with. I've been trying to figure out how much cargo we can carry, and the numbers just seem too low. Am I figuring this right?

GCWR 33,000 lbs
GVWR 27,910 lbs

---> Cargo + Tow Vehicle maximum weight 5090 lbs

We would be towing a VW Jetta which weighs about 2200 lbs with a full tank of diesel and nothing else in it.

So, 5090 - 2200 = 2890 pounds left for cargo and fluids

At 8lbs/gallon a full fuel tank would weigh 720 pounds. Have both holding tanks filled half-way adds another 264 pounds. Half a tank of fresh water adds 336 pounds. So, all told, we'd be carrying 1320 pounds of fluids after filling up with diesel with all other tanks 1/2 full (not an unreasonable assumption?)

This seems to leave only 1570 pounds for cargo and passengers! Lets say that my wife, three teenagers, and I weigh a total of 625 pounds. Yes, we really do.

Does this really mean that we could only carry 925 pounds of cargo? That seems like a paltry amount.

Is my math right? Is 925 pounds of cargo a lot, or really not that much? My head is spinning.
Class A
  • msmith1199's avatar
    msmith1199
    Explorer II
    Sep 19, 2015
    GCWR is the Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating. That is the max gross of the motorhome and the toad. GVWR is the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating. That's the max weight of the motorhome alone. Neither of these numbers gives you the cargo weight capacity as you have to know how much the motorhome actually weighs first. These are max numbers, not the actual weight of the motorhome.
  • msmith1199's avatar
    msmith1199
    Explorer II
    Sep 19, 2015
    I don't see on Winnebago's webpage where they list an empty weight of the RV. I don't recall seeing that number on any motorhome as they are probably variable. There is a lot of wood in a motorhome so identical motorhomes could have different weights. I have never weighed mine, but it's probably a good idea to do so. And just because the GVWR is 27,910, doesn't mean the axles are going to fall off if you load a thousand pounds or so over that.
  • MilesandSmiles's avatar
    MilesandSmiles
    Explorer
    Sep 19, 2015
    msmith1199 wrote:
    GCWR is the Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating. That is the max gross of the motorhome and the toad. GVWR is the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating. That's the max weight of the motorhome alone. Neither of these numbers gives you the cargo weight capacity as you have to know how much the motorhome actually weighs first. These are max numbers, not the actual weight of the motorhome.


    Thanks! That helps. After two days looking at RVs and going to seminars my head is spinning. Now that I think about it again your answer is obvious.
  • creeper's avatar
    creeper
    Explorer
    Sep 19, 2015
    I think you're about 1000 lbs light on the jetta. My wife's jetta is 3200lbs with a fuel tank of full. My 2006 Jetta was just about the same at 3200lbs. My fiberglass kit car weighs about 2200lbs and it's really light.
  • mowermech's avatar
    mowermech
    Explorer
    Sep 19, 2015
    IMO, CCC is GVWR minus the actual weight of the coach when ready to travel (full fuel, full propane, full fresh water tank, and batteries installed)
    everything else is cargo. food, dishes, pots and pans, clothing, camp stove, grill, jack pads, antenna masts, antennas, coax cables, ham radios, folding chairs, fishing equipment, hunting equipment, people, dogs, cats, etc. that is all cargo.
  • creeper's avatar
    creeper
    Explorer
    Sep 19, 2015
    GVWR is something that needs to be considered separately from GCWR.

    You don't want to be over your GVWR at any point, even though you might be under the GCWR.

    GVWR is based on suspension components, tires and axle ratings.

    Theoretically I could load my Coach to exceed my GVWR and be under my GGWR.

    You must also consider your towing method. Towing 4 down and you're not adding much to your GVWR. If you're using a tow dolly you're adding to your GVWR.

    To figure your CCC you need the unladen weight of the coach. Your math is wrong because you're using the GVWR as the weight of the coach. My Winnebago loaded for travel is 23K and that's on a 40ft Coach that has a GVWR of 26K.

    Ask to have it weighed before purchasing.I suspect your unladen weight will be around 23-24k lbs.

    With 900+ lbs left over after using incorrect numbers you'll be fine. You'll probably easily have 3-4 thousand pounds of real world CCC. Which you'll find out when you get the unladen weight.
  • pulsar's avatar
    pulsar
    Explorer
    Sep 19, 2015
    Although CCC is no longer used, here is how it was defined by RVIA in 2000.

    (Other definitions are given for clarity.)

    • GVWR: Gross Vehicle Weight Rating

    • UVW: Unloaded Vehicle Weight (1996 RVIA Definition)
      Unloaded Vehicle Weight (UVW) is the weight of a vehicle as manufactured at the factory. It includes full engine and generator fuel tanks and fluids, if applicable. It does not include cargo, water, propane, or dealer-installed accessories. Be aware that some manufacturers weigh each unit to determine UVW, while others provide only the average or estimated weight for each model.

      Note: Some dealers include the weight of all factory installed options; other include the weight of commonly ordered factory installed options.

    • SCWR:
      Sleeping Capacity Weight Rating (2000 RVIA Definition)
      The manufacturers designated number of sleeping positions multiplied by 154 pounds (70 kilograms)

    • CCC:
      Cargo Carrying Capacity (2000 RVIA Definition)
      Equal to GVWR minus each of the following: UVW, full fresh potable water weight (including water heater), full LP gas weight and SCWR.

    • NCC:
      Net Carrying Capacity
      Equal to GVWR - UVW


    The federal government (NHTSA) developed its own standard, Occupant and Cargo Carrying Capacity or OCCC, which is a very different number. CCC is in addition to water and passengers; water and passengers are part of the OCCC number.

    A label is required (by the Feds) to be affixed to the coach with the following information:

    "The Combined weight of occupants and cargo should never exceed
    xxx lbs or xxx Kgms
    Seat belt equipped seating is X

    CAUTION
    A full load of water equals xxx Lbs or XXX Kgms of cargo 1 gal =8.3lbs and the tongue
    weight of a towed trailer counts as cargo."

    The label should be black type on a yellow background.

    In our coach the label is affixed to the wall just to the left of the driver and is beside the VIN number label.

    Note: for trailers, the NHSTA defined a CCC, different from that defined by RVIA. It is the same as OCCC except the number does not include the weight of passengers.

    Tom
  • wa8yxm's avatar
    wa8yxm
    Explorer III
    Sep 19, 2015
    CCC - Max GVW minus Actual weight of RV. Curb weight with full tanks)

    IE: if your RV has a max GVW of 22000 pounds and the tank full weight is 21000 you can carry 1000 pounds. Including yourself.

    CGVW has no impact on this if you tow 4 down.. If you trailer tan it does and can eat up to half that CCC in the above. (tong weight).
  • msmith1199's avatar
    msmith1199
    Explorer II
    Sep 19, 2015
    wa8yxm wrote:
    CCC - Max GVW minus Actual weight of RV. Curb weight with full tanks)

    IE: if your RV has a max GVW of 22000 pounds and the tank full weight is 21000 you can carry 1000 pounds. Including yourself.

    CGVW has no impact on this if you tow 4 down.. If you trailer tan it does and can eat up to half that CCC in the above. (tong weight).


    So if I town four down I can tow a 45 foot Prevost behind my 35 foot DP? GCWR in fact does count for four down towing also since it's near identical to towing a trailer, except less a few hundred pounds tongue weight. Towing four down does no affect the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating, or the axle weights as it does not change those. But it does apply to the combined weight rating.

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