Mercedes Benz fuel challenges

kendall69 wrote:

avanti wrote:

eric1514 wrote:


Little bit of "Topic Creep" going on here. Nobody denies MB builds an excellent van. The issue is whether they will repair it on their dime when you fuel it with US mandated fuel that doesn't meet their spec.

Yeah. Sorry.

I'll deny MB build an excellent van all day long. How about a leaking room on a 2007 high roof van that has been "fixed" twice and still leaks. Good thing I'm in the Desert, it only rains once every few years. Try reading a little on the net and read about all the rust and bad paint issues. Then read about all the emission problems. Don't take my word doe it - read for yourself.
Sprinter problems

Oh and for all the Sprinter fan boys...try idling your Sprinter and see how long it is before your entire engine clogs up with soot.
Only manufacturer that I know of that tells you NOT TO IDLE your engine.

WHAT - don't idle your engine? Tell that to the people in Alaska when it's 40 below or people waiting for their child to come out of school in the desert when it's 120 plus outside.

So ya - YEA Mercedes for building a vehicle you can't idle,great for RV's when you want to charge your house batteries in a RV. Sorry you need to pack up and drive around for an hour while your batteries charge.
Good job there Mercedes. Great engineering there.

reminds me of years back when I was listening to a program, Gauss's Garage I think was the guys name, and a Mercedes question/complaint came in. He was very complimentary about how much precision was built into their vehicles, but added if any problem ever occurred that you should just take out your check book and sign a blank check cause it would be difficult and expensive to fix.
bumpy

avanti wrote:

eric1514 wrote:


Little bit of "Topic Creep" going on here. Nobody denies MB builds an excellent van. The issue is whether they will repair it on their dime when you fuel it with US mandated fuel that doesn't meet their spec.

Yeah. Sorry.

I'll deny MB build an excellent van all day long. How about a leaking room on a 2007 high roof van that has been "fixed" twice and still leaks. Good thing I'm in the Desert, it only rains once every few years. Try reading a little on the net and read about all the rust and bad paint issues. Then read about all the emission problems. Don't take my word doe it - read for yourself.
Sprinter problems

Oh and for all the Sprinter fan boys...try idling your Sprinter and see how long it is before your entire engine clogs up with soot.
Only manufacturer that I know of that tells you NOT TO IDLE your engine.

WHAT - don't idle your engine? Tell that to the people in Alaska when it's 40 below or people waiting for their child to come out of school in the desert when it's 120 plus outside.

So ya - YEA Mercedes for building a vehicle you can't idle,great for RV's when you want to charge your house batteries in a RV. Sorry you need to pack up and drive around for an hour while your batteries charge.
Good job there Mercedes. Great engineering there.

DAWg134 wrote:
I would hope that a bit of common sense would apply to the biodiesel situation. In the link provided by Booster in an earlier post, Mercedes Benz has done a great job of documenting specific concerns they have regarding the different bio formulations, so it's not simply a matter of them hedging their bets against the unknown.

I would assess the warranty impact as follows:

a) You bring in your Sprinter for an alternator failure... MB should replace it under warranty at no cost to you, regardless of what is in your fuel tank.

b) Your oil pump fails under warranty and your crankcase is "clean as a whistle", MB should repair it at no cost.

c) Your oil pump fails under warranty and your crankcase is choked with sludge and there's biodiesel in your tank.... you're on your own for repairs.

Common sense would be good.
Beyond that, your cases (a) and (b) are essentially assured under Magnuson–Moss. A manufacturer (at least in the US) cannot arbitrarily void a warranty just because the owner did or did not do anything particular. They need to establish that the the action in question actually caused or contributed to the failure. Case (c) is more subtle For example, there might be a lubrication-related failure that occurs right after an oil change. This may or may not have been caused by oil dilution due to B20 use, and there would be no obvious way to tell, other than the possible presence of B20 in the tank.

The fact is that such situations tend to be decided not by common sense but by theoretically irrelevant factors such as whether you are the original owner or whether the oil changes have been done at the dealer or not.

I do agree that this situation is no more fair to MB than it is to the owners. But it would be nice if they took an actual clear position on the matter one way or another. Their current ambiguous statements are evidence of wanting to have it both ways (i.e., not discourage sales in the affected areas, but not wanting to take responsibility, either).

I would hope that a bit of common sense would apply to the biodiesel situation. In the link provided by Booster in an earlier post, Mercedes Benz has done a great job of documenting specific concerns they have regarding the different bio formulations, so it's not simply a matter of them hedging their bets against the unknown.

I would assess the warranty impact as follows:

a) You bring in your Sprinter for an alternator failure... MB should replace it under warranty at no cost to you, regardless of what is in your fuel tank.

b) Your oil pump fails under warranty and your crankcase is "clean as a whistle", MB should repair it at no cost.

c) Your oil pump fails under warranty and your crankcase is choked with sludge and there's biodiesel in your tank.... you're on your own for repairs.

Perhaps it doesn't seem fair that you could be held liable for repairs due to use of a fuel that you were essentially forced to use, but neither does it seem reasonable to hold MB responsible for something that is similarly beyond their control as well. Moreover, I can't help but think that issues such as sludging, coking, and filter clogs are not unique to MB - it seems likely that other manufacturers of diesel engines using DEF controls would also be experiencing similar problems with their products.

eric1514 wrote:

Little bit of "Topic Creep" going on here.

Yeah. Sorry.

avanti wrote:
Well, I just sold our 2005 (soon to acquire a 2014) Sprinter. I *can* count the number of times I had it to the dealer. Watch me do it:
"One."
and that was for an early-on sort out of some minor issues.

You can find horror stories about any vehicle. I'm not saying that the Sprinter is the easiest-to-own vehicle in the world (that would probably be a Toyota Corolla). But for what it is, it is an amazing vehicle.

Little bit of "Topic Creep" going on here. Nobody denies MB builds an excellent van. The issue is whether they will repair it on their dime when you fuel it with US mandated fuel that doesn't meet their spec.

kendall69 wrote:
I can't count the times I needed to drive 100 miles ea. way for simple service and 100 miles back, wasting hours and hours of time.

Well, I just sold our 2005 (soon to acquire a 2014) Sprinter. I *can* count the number of times I had it to the dealer. Watch me do it:
"One."
and that was for an early-on sort out of some minor issues.

You can find horror stories about any vehicle. I'm not saying that the Sprinter is the easiest-to-own vehicle in the world (that would probably be a Toyota Corolla). But for what it is, it is an amazing vehicle.

Ten years and 120K miles on our 2005/2004 chassis LTV and none of the horror stories on these forums have been an issue. Yes, I avoid diesel fuel with high bio-diesel content but that has not been a problem with extensive travel all over the North American continent. Would make the same choice again if I was in the market. The MB turbo diesel is a workhorse with some racehorse characteristics.

You have 3 service possibilities, Mercedes, Freightliner, and Dodge. You can always plan a trip, then research for places who work on them along your route. I had some recall work done at the local M-B dealer and had them fix a transmission leak. $35 part $180 labor. But in 10 years, other than normal things (oil changes, filters) it's the first thing needed to be fixed.

Don't forget, Freightliner Sprinter dealers can work on them too. Usually at a reduced price compared to the MB dealers