Tiffin Acquired by Thor for 300mil.

dougrainer wrote:

gemsworld wrote:

dougrainer wrote:
When Thor purchase Jayco, NOTHING was done to change their people or management. Doug

And your point is? You don't think Thor is going to tell management of acquired companies what to do and how to run the business? I've seen RVs made prior to Thor acquiring a company and the same RVs made after Thor's acquisition. The drop in quality was glaring.

1. I work for a Dealer that sells Airstream/Jayco and Tiffin. ALL have been purchased by Thor
2. I DEAL with all 3 companies almost daily and the Employees tell me not one thing was changed after Thor purchased them
3. I have known Bob Tiffin for 41 years. We have been a Tiffin dealer for 45 years. Doug

No one has ever accused Thor of upping the quality in the RV brands they acquire, just the opposite. I have a good friend who's been a master RV tech for decades and gets to the see the good, the bad and the ugly that most of us will never see, and he keeps me informed of what's happening in the industry. As a seasoned RV owner having purchased several new RVs throughout the years I know quality when I see it or when it's missing. As an RV enthusiast, I go to RV shows regularly and take a look at almost every single RV in display, from tiny teardrop trailers to million dollar plus diesel pushers. I have yet to be impressed with anything made by Thor.

I'd bet you'll see more and more independent manufacturers cashing on soon. If 2008 is any indication the smaller guys take the hardest hits during downturns and even those bought or backed by private equity groups take some hard hits. Alfa Leisure is a great example. Very strong heritage with the Crean family, sold to a private equity group and ultimately bit the dust in 2008. Tiffin was smart.

Option B is to squeeze the lemon harder on your own until there's nothing left, like Elvie Frey did with Sunnybrook. After building a great reputation for aluminum-framed and filon-sided RVs that were top quality, he brought out the Sunset Creek stick-and-tin brand to drive volume, and the quality sacrifices killed the whole company.

Lantley is right, either way it's no bueno for the consumer.

dougrainer wrote:

gemsworld wrote:

dougrainer wrote:
When Thor purchase Jayco, NOTHING was done to change their people or management. Doug

And your point is? You don't think Thor is going to tell management of acquired companies what to do and how to run the business? I've seen RVs made prior to Thor acquiring a company and the same RVs made after Thor's acquisition. The drop in quality was glaring.

1. I work for a Dealer that sells Airstream/Jayco and Tiffin. ALL have been purchased by Thor
2. I DEAL with all 3 companies almost daily and the Employees tell me not one thing was changed after Thor purchased them
3. I have known Bob Tiffin for 41 years. We have been a Tiffin dealer for 45 years. Doug

I'll give you my history. Jayco purchased Open Range. Thor purchased Jayco. When my 2012 Open Range unit had a major frame issue. Jayco, Thor, Jayco and Highland all denied responsibility.
Randy Graber the founder of Open Range lacked the authority to stand behind his product.
Had the buyouts never happened I am confident OR would have repaired my frame however under the Thor umbrella I was told the Open Range company doesn't exist anymore.
Tiffin owners beware the buyout allows Thor to assume the brand and all the goodwill that comes with it. However the are absolved of any liabilities and responsibility of the old (original) company.
In the end the consumer loses. Especially, if you purchased from the original company before the buyout!
At some point the new Thor Tiffin's begin to roll out and everyone pretends the original Tiffin company never existed. New Thor favorable policies will be put into place and the original Tiffin company fades away. Despite all the marketing jargon and claims that Tiffin will remain the same. There will be a new management hierarchy and Tiffin never be the same.
Unfortunately I've seen this show before, the re-runs don't get any better for the consumer.

gemsworld wrote:

dougrainer wrote:
When Thor purchase Jayco, NOTHING was done to change their people or management. Doug

And your point is? You don't think Thor is going to tell management of acquired companies what to do and how to run the business? I've seen RVs made prior to Thor acquiring a company and the same RVs made after Thor's acquisition. The drop in quality was glaring.

1. I work for a Dealer that sells Airstream/Jayco and Tiffin. ALL have been purchased by Thor
2. I DEAL with all 3 companies almost daily and the Employees tell me not one thing was changed after Thor purchased them
3. I have known Bob Tiffin for 41 years. We have been a Tiffin dealer for 45 years. Doug

Buy out the Quality competition, lower quality, increase price due to less competition. Been the idea since Free Trade was the scream about 1973.
How many auto brands have we lost?How many models have we lost?
Anyone seen a two tone anything of chrome?
Anyone noticed all the new cars are crossovers/SUVs that are near identical in size shape and character? Anyone walked up to someone else's car of a different brand and tired to get in?

Tiffin has had a great run. And a great reputation. From what I understand there have been cases where Mr. Tiffin himself responded to get a customer's problems fixed (I can just about imagine the color of the dealer service dept's underwear when the CEO and founder of the company that made the RV walks in and says "What seems to be the problem).

Alas Thor. Well.. They have a mixed reputation.

dougrainer wrote:
... Tiffin quality has gone down as Bob Tiffin, did not want to expand his work Force after the 2008 melt down. They are pushing out units as fast as they can with their existing work force and will pay the Dealers to fix problems they miss in Red Bay....

Unfortunate this was the case. The modern manufacturing discipline (since W. Edwards Deming) has realized that the primary function of quality control is not to fix the outgoing unit, but to fix the ongoing process.

I am continually amazed at the quality and openness to customization that Tiffin had for my 2007 coach. I am not the original owner. I have had several calls over the years with Tiffin technical folks and I have heard subtle references to the "Quality better before 2008" idea.

jorbill2or wrote:
Wow so they all fall to the big boy fall out. Kinda sad to see all the owner brands fall to the big corporate groups. I see they got Van Leigh also.
Guess Bob and family can finally retire.

I think the small operations are taking advantage of the COVID peak in RV sales to sell while financials are good. If they don't have a lot of cash reserves, they'll have a hard time surviving the inevitable market lull in 2022 when there's a glut of 2-3 year old used RV's on the market, cutting into the demand for new units. After things return to normal, many people who bought an RV for travel during COVID may lose their interest in having a $150K depreciating asset taking up half their driveway (or paying $200/month to park it)

Maybe the Thor designers will show Tiffin how to configure a floorplan that allows for TV viewing without neck twisting like an owl.