Transmission oil change due to time?

et2 wrote:
It most certainly is a baseline. As matter of fact there are different scenarios "based on driving habits" and operational conditions.

Throwing a bunch of stuff on the walls and hope it sticks, doesn't help me to understand what purpose it has in what's being discussed. It isn't rocket science. Personally I've always followed the owners manual fluids recommendations even after warranty expiration. Never had any issues. I venture to say they're pretty dang safe.

Payoffs, negotiations, etc, as you want us to believe doesn't make any sense in helping people make a educated decision based on the fact there is published criteria by the original manufacture that answers all those questions.

I didn't throw a bunch of stuff, just gave you a bunch of facts. The point is simple, your baseline is flawed. An engineer said how many miles, a purchasing guy said once per year. It all comes down to your last point. To make an educated decision you need facts and information. Sometimes you get them by asking.
You didn't know why people don't just follow the manufacturers manual, the answer is exactly what you said, because we want to know better, and a lot of times people in the forum has information, so I asked. So if we ask you complain, if we explain you complain.
Let me be clear. Changing fluids means risk and additional wear. It was demonstrated over and over by several companies. If the trans fluid can last 150K, I don't buy the "time" component that easy.
Do yourself a favor, no manual from ANY manufacturer is gospel. Do you need to follow it for warranty? Great. Do you want to follow it because it makes you feel good? Awesome. Just accept that some of us believe that someone may know better. Not better than the designed, just better than the petty bean counter or attorney writing the manual.

It most certainly is a baseline. As matter of fact there are different scenarios "based on driving habits" and operational conditions.

Throwing a bunch of stuff on the walls and hope it sticks, doesn't help me to understand what purpose it has in what's being discussed. It isn't rocket science. Personally I've always followed the owners manual fluids recommendations even after warranty expiration. Never had any issues. I venture to say they're pretty dang safe.

Payoffs, negotiations, etc, as you want us to believe doesn't make any sense in helping people make a educated decision based on the fact there is published criteria by the original manufacture that answers all those questions.

et2 wrote:
It's called a baseline. It's put their by the manufacture based off criteria their engineers determined. I have no reason to question it. Particularly since my rig is new. I will follow the recommendation by what's called out by the manufacture.

Sure if you're rolling in cash, or just don't trust the manual, or you have more experience than the guys who've done designed the transmission, do what you want.

However when asked ... the manual would be my place for reference compared to what some guy said on the Internet.

Is not a baseline. Ford decided to come up with a tire size that there was only 1 manufacturer when they did the redesigned of the F series in the early 2000s. Do you know how much was Ford paying for tires? $0.
The Japanese invented the 0W20 bracket in oil justifying it would save gas, when in reality, for the first 3 years, there was only 1 manufacturer that could do 0w20. Do you know how much Toyota was paying for oil? $0
Much closer to us, the goverment set laws to increase MPG to 40 by 2020. Strangely enough, at the same time, they reduced the emission of sulfur to 15ppm, effectivelly increasing diesel consumption by 10% slowly as diesel engines with particle filtration get in service. Ever wonder why? There is no proof that a reduction of sulfur from 150 to 15ppm has any effect in the environment. Easy, Oil industry said they would need a way to make up their losses due to the 40mpg regulation.
You follow the manual because is new or have a warranty, I agree 100%.
If you had read my post, I don't pretend to know more than the designers, I know how deals are made when manuals are written.
An example, do you really think that the Transynd is that much better than the other trans fluid as to charge 3 times as much? It is made by Castrol for god sakes. Don't drink the koolaid just because the manual tells you, that is my only point.

It's called a baseline. It's put their by the manufacture based off criteria their engineers determined. I have no reason to question it. Particularly since my rig is new. I will follow the recommendation by what's called out by the manufacture.

Sure if you're rolling in cash, or just don't trust the manual, or you have more experience than the guys who've done designed the transmission, do what you want.

However when asked ... the manual would be my place for reference compared to what some guy said on the Internet.

JimR 1 wrote:

map40 wrote:

et2 wrote:
I'm always wondering why people don't just follow the instructions in the owners manual. Even if you don't have one they can be gotten on the web by searching.

Simply because some of us know better.
You wonder if I believe I know better than the group of engineers that designed the best transmission in the world? I don’t. I just know better than the clown who writes the manual.
Once when we were discussing what oil to use for the V10 engine of the Viper I spent some time with the developers of Mobil 1. One of them told me “oil weight, brand, conventional or synthetic, all can be mixed” I thought he was just talking out of his a** until another one of them told me he was the most knowledgeable guy in engine oil in their company. I asked him later to explain and he told me that oil weight mathematically averages. Dino or synthetic can mix because they are both oils, and that changing the oil every 3000 miles was the worst idea ever as it will produce more wear than running the same oil 6000 miles.
I later asked around the company and found out that mileage and time maintenance intervals are decided by engineering, purchasing AND marketing. So does tire size and brand.
Keep that in mind the next time you read the maintenance manual...

Map40

I have to agree with you more or less on your post here

i.e. the meritor rear end folks want me to change the differential oil every year with conventional oil and three years with synthetic. With the little miles I drive I think that is over kill but as a risk management tool I have an extended warranty, Good Sam ESP, that requires the manufactures maintenance schedule to be followed.

JimR

That is different, you have a good reason

Charlie D. wrote:

JimR 1 wrote:
I do mine every three years using Transynd Transmission Fluid and as of two days ago the cost of materials, 5 gallons of fluid and filters, was $311.36, the filters were about $72.00 the rest was the fluid. This was from Detroit Diesel in Fresno Calif.

JimR

ps for Alfa related questions this web site is specific to that brand alfaseeya

The gentleman who developed Transynd says a full one time drain and refill-torque converter, lines etc-OR drain the pan, circulate, drain again, replace the filter and refill is all that is needed for a full change over and no future changes are needed. Oil analysis should be done on about an annual basis to check for contamination from water or glycol but it's a low probability on both. Change if water gets to over 0.2%.

When you say no future oil changes are needed, where is that source??

My source Allison says the oil needs changing on a regular schedule.

Filters every 36 months
Fluid every 48 months

I do it every 36 months both filter and fluid.

JimR

map40 wrote:

et2 wrote:
I'm always wondering why people don't just follow the instructions in the owners manual. Even if you don't have one they can be gotten on the web by searching.

Simply because some of us know better.
You wonder if I believe I know better than the group of engineers that designed the best transmission in the world? I don’t. I just know better than the clown who writes the manual.
Once when we were discussing what oil to use for the V10 engine of the Viper I spent some time with the developers of Mobil 1. One of them told me “oil weight, brand, conventional or synthetic, all can be mixed” I thought he was just talking out of his a** until another one of them told me he was the most knowledgeable guy in engine oil in their company. I asked him later to explain and he told me that oil weight mathematically averages. Dino or synthetic can mix because they are both oils, and that changing the oil every 3000 miles was the worst idea ever as it will produce more wear than running the same oil 6000 miles.
I later asked around the company and found out that mileage and time maintenance intervals are decided by engineering, purchasing AND marketing. So does tire size and brand.
Keep that in mind the next time you read the maintenance manual...

Map40

I have to agree with you more or less on your post here

i.e. the meritor rear end folks want me to change the differential oil every year with conventional oil and three years with synthetic. With the little miles I drive I think that is over kill but as a risk management tool I have an extended warranty, Good Sam ESP, that requires the manufactures maintenance schedule to be followed.

JimR

twodownzero wrote:

JimR 1 wrote:

twodownzero wrote:
If the trans pan has a drain plug, I would drain and refill the pan every time you change the oil.

There is no reason to do that and it would be very costly. Allison has a maintenance and change schedule and that is what should be used. My changes are based on time and not milage and at a cost of 310 for parts and about and hour of labor that is a cost of about $435.00 parts and labor.

Jim

If you think spending $435 at every factory interval is superior to spending $50 every oil change, I wouldn't argue against that.

I also never change fluids due to time and not mileage. My experience with oil analysis has shown that running the fluids way past the time interval has shown no adverse amount of wear and it would be a complete waste of oils to change them after a year when the oil is still protecting the engine.

I am not suggesting that you should second guess the engineers who designed the product, but if you have data to back up why you'd do that as I do, you may think it's cost effective to do as I do.

Ram also recommends no service of diffs ever on my truck for standard service and 15k mile intervals for severe service; there's a long way to split the difference between those two.

I do not understand where you get $50.00 cost on a fluid change for a MH3000 transmission???

Also I do not do the oil analysis nor do I have a prejudice against oil analyst.

I have an extended warranty on MH and per that warranty I need to follow the manufactures schedule of maintenance the warranty has no options that I know of for oil analysis. Not sure whether Allison is OK with an oil analysis but they probably use it when a question pops up with a warranty claim.

Jim

et2 wrote:
I'm always wondering why people don't just follow the instructions in the owners manual. Even if you don't have one they can be gotten on the web by searching.

Simply because some of us know better.
You wonder if I believe I know better than the group of engineers that designed the best transmission in the world? I don’t. I just know better than the clown who writes the manual.
Once when we were discussing what oil to use for the V10 engine of the Viper I spent some time with the developers of Mobil 1. One of them told me “oil weight, brand, conventional or synthetic, all can be mixed” I thought he was just talking out of his a** until another one of them told me he was the most knowledgeable guy in engine oil in their company. I asked him later to explain and he told me that oil weight mathematically averages. Dino or synthetic can mix because they are both oils, and that changing the oil every 3000 miles was the worst idea ever as it will produce more wear than running the same oil 6000 miles.
I later asked around the company and found out that mileage and time maintenance intervals are decided by engineering, purchasing AND marketing. So does tire size and brand.
Keep that in mind the next time you read the maintenance manual...

JimR 1 wrote:
I do mine every three years using Transynd Transmission Fluid and as of two days ago the cost of materials, 5 gallons of fluid and filters, was $311.36, the filters were about $72.00 the rest was the fluid. This was from Detroit Diesel in Fresno Calif.

JimR

ps for Alfa related questions this web site is specific to that brand alfaseeya

The gentleman who developed Transynd says a full one time drain and refill-torque converter, lines etc-OR drain the pan, circulate, drain again, replace the filter and refill is all that is needed for a full change over and no future changes are needed. Oil analysis should be done on about an annual basis to check for contamination from water or glycol but it's a low probability on both. Change if water gets to over 0.2%.