V10 Motor Oil

Rodz wrote:

427435 wrote:
The engineers have a lot of things to consider (as do the marketing and lawyer types). Using 5w-20 oil in an engine will help MPG a bit. Meeting CAFE standards is a very big deal for the engineers and for Ford in general. If an engine can "get along" with a thinner oil for a reasonable time, they will move to it rather than use an oil that will extend the life of an engine to 100,000+ miles at the expense of MPG ratings.

Besides the recommended oils in Europe, Ford also specs a 5w-50 oil for their supercharged Mustang GT, here in the USA, where life might be a problem with a "light" oil.

Again, even 5w-20 oil is several hundred to several thousand cSt "thicker" at startup temps than a 5w-40 or 5w-50 oil is at operating temps. How many of you have seized a bearing during startup?? And if the first number is a 5w, you are fine for startup. The second number only relates to the much, much thinner "thickness" at operating temps. A higher number there will provide more bearing protection when your right foot is on the floor board climbing a long mountain grade, in a hot ambient, pulling a toad.

You are free, of course, to use whatever you want. My time spent in engine labs and vehicle engineering leads me to use something better than a 5w-20 oil in an engine that sees heavy loads.

Good imformative post. "427435"???? Is that what I think it is?

Yup. My first new car in 1967.

Gonzo42 wrote:
Everybody has an opinion on motor oils, so naturally, so have I.
Beyond that, I firmly believe one should break in a new engine in dino oil only. I even go so far as to change at 50 miles, 100 miles, 300 miles and 1000 miles. The purpose of this is to remove all metals accumulated in the oil during the break-in period. After that change per the manufacturer's specified intervals (or less). Once you get to the 5000 mile mark I believe in changing over to synthetic oil for the rest of the engine's life.

And the oil filter is there to do WHAT?
My V-10 uses a quart in 2k mi. on 5-20 and none at all with 5-30 at 86k mi.. I change oil & filter once a year if it's 5k mi. or 15k mi. Engine runs perfectly & strong on 5-30 so why use a thinner oil?

conceptumator wrote:
Maybe this will clarify. I asked the same question on the V10 to my mechanic and race car friend and his explanation makes a lot of sense. The oil type is determined based on the manufacturing tolerances in each engine. As tolerances get smaller, the oil needs a different viscosity. Using any weight other than recommended is a gamble.

Sigh.

Again, tolerances and clearances are two different things. The MINIMUM clearance of a bearing doesn't change with reduced tolerances. It stays the SAME. On the other hand, if machining tolerances are cut in half, the MAXIMUM CLEARANCE of a bearing in a production engine will be cut in half-----BUT THE MINIMUM CLEARANCE WILL STAY THE SAME.

The reduction of the MAXIMUM CLEARANCE allows the engineers (and CAFE managers) to use a thinner oil at operating temps-------which slightly helps mpg.

The viscosity of a 5w-anything oil will all be similar at startup-------and 100 to 1000 times thicker than at operating temp. That is a 5w-50 oil will be much, much thinner at operating temp than a 5w-20 oil is at startup-------and they both will be a similar thickness (viscosity) at startup. If the bearings don't seize at startup with a 5w-20 oil, they won't seize (or wear), at either startup or at operating temps, with a 5w-40 oil.

Maybe this will clarify. I asked the same question on the V10 to my mechanic and race car friend and his explanation makes a lot of sense. The oil type is determined based on the manufacturing tolerances in each engine. As tolerances get smaller, the oil needs a different viscosity. Using any weight other than recommended is a gamble.

dodge guy, I believe the V10 motor was changed in '03 or '04 with I think 3 valves per cylinder to up the HP to the currant 362 from 315 and torque up to 457#'s.

dodge guy wrote:

Bill Hamilton wrote:

427435 wrote:

Desert Captain wrote:
Do not use anything but 5W20 in a V-10. Ford has been crystal clear on this issue from day one.

:C

No they haven't. The recommended oil for my 2000 V10 was 5w-30.

I've always used at least a 5w-40 in mine as well as a lot of miles with 15w-50 (Mobil 1). 50,0000 miles later things are running as fine as when I bought it.

X2 My first v10 circa 2001 was 5w-30. My understanding is nothing was done to change the motor. Ford just changed the recommendation to improve milage.

Yep, so much for millions of dollars in research!

Well.....you're a Dodge guy, we expect that from you.....lol

427435 wrote:
The engineers have a lot of things to consider (as do the marketing and lawyer types). Using 5w-20 oil in an engine will help MPG a bit. Meeting CAFE standards is a very big deal for the engineers and for Ford in general. If an engine can "get along" with a thinner oil for a reasonable time, they will move to it rather than use an oil that will extend the life of an engine to 100,000+ miles at the expense of MPG ratings.

Besides the recommended oils in Europe, Ford also specs a 5w-50 oil for their supercharged Mustang GT, here in the USA, where life might be a problem with a "light" oil.

Again, even 5w-20 oil is several hundred to several thousand cSt "thicker" at startup temps than a 5w-40 or 5w-50 oil is at operating temps. How many of you have seized a bearing during startup?? And if the first number is a 5w, you are fine for startup. The second number only relates to the much, much thinner "thickness" at operating temps. A higher number there will provide more bearing protection when your right foot is on the floor board climbing a long mountain grade, in a hot ambient, pulling a toad.

You are free, of course, to use whatever you want. My time spent in engine labs and vehicle engineering leads me to use something better than a 5w-20 oil in an engine that sees heavy loads.

Good imformative post. "427435"???? Is that what I think it is?

The engineers have a lot of things to consider (as do the marketing and lawyer types). Using 5w-20 oil in an engine will help MPG a bit. Meeting CAFE standards is a very big deal for the engineers and for Ford in general. If an engine can "get along" with a thinner oil for a reasonable time, they will move to it rather than use an oil that will extend the life of an engine to 100,000+ miles at the expense of MPG ratings.

Besides the recommended oils in Europe, Ford also specs a 5w-50 oil for their supercharged Mustang GT, here in the USA, where life might be a problem with a "light" oil.

Again, even 5w-20 oil is several hundred to several thousand cSt "thicker" at startup temps than a 5w-40 or 5w-50 oil is at operating temps. How many of you have seized a bearing during startup?? And if the first number is a 5w, you are fine for startup. The second number only relates to the much, much thinner "thickness" at operating temps. A higher number there will provide more bearing protection when your right foot is on the floor board climbing a long mountain grade, in a hot ambient, pulling a toad.

You are free, of course, to use whatever you want. My time spent in engine labs and vehicle engineering leads me to use something better than a 5w-20 oil in an engine that sees heavy loads.

dodge guy wrote:
You`ve completely missed the point. Ford at one point said 5W30 only, then said years later 5W20 only. so much for manuf. testing for hundreds of thousands of miles. it`s been proven time and again that engineers are not the last word in much of anything!

Who knows, maybe a few years down the road Ford will go back and say to use only 5W30 in their motors.

Exactly. It seems every few years when they bring in a new batch of engineers, the new guys have different ideas.

You`ve completely missed the point. Ford at one point said 5W30 only, then said years later 5W20 only. so much for manuf. testing for hundreds of thousands of miles. it`s been proven time and again that engineers are not the last word in much of anything!

Who knows, maybe a few years down the road Ford will go back and say to use only 5W30 in their motors.