Dear All,I have not been active in the forums for some years, but a recent experience brings me back to the pet forum. We just finished a 2 week trip through some Arizona, Colorado and Utah national parks we have not yet visited. In particular we camped in Fruita CG in Capitol Reef NP. Truly wonderful - BUT, they have a no dog left alone rule. We have been camping in RV's for 15 years all the time with our dogs, and not only has this not been a problem; it has truly never occurred to me. In fact 3 months ago we camped in Watchman for a week with no problems. This trip we happened to have our daughter with us, so one of the 3 of us could take turns not hiking and staying with the dogs. Most of the time now, my wife and I are alone - we simply could not have done anything like hiking or taking our Jeep into the back country. Have the rules changed, or are they only now being enforced. I would hate to think that we can only stay in commercial campgrounds when we go to national parks, which are our main destinations. Have any of the other RVers who frequent NP's had a problem recently?Steve

One croppy owner forces draconian rules.You leave your nice little doggy who is oh so loveable and while your gone it barks its fool head off. Ranger comes and if there is no rule then there is little he/she can do BUT with a rule then all is peaceful. My next door neighbor at a commercial CG recently had two little dogs like that. They were gone 8 hours and I had to go to the CG owner. No rule against it so nothing was done.It is a great rule

darsben wrote:One croppy owner forces draconian rules.You leave your nice little doggy who is oh so loveable and while your gone it barks its fool head off. Ranger comes and if there is no rule then there is little he/she can do BUT with a rule then all is peaceful. My next door neighbor at a commercial CG recently had two little dogs like that. They were gone 8 hours and I had to go to the CG owner. No rule against it so nothing was done.It is a great ruleOur dogs are well behaved, and we are serious hikers. If this is simply the state of affairs, we will no longer be able to map in NP CG's. One of the reason we got into RVing 15 years ago was to be able to travel with our dogs. I can see by the response, that at least one person likes the rule. I know many people go to such CGs and then sit at their RVs most of the day. We do not. The dogs are alone while we work, and they are quite used to it. Oh well. Curious if there are any other thoughts on this issue.

steveandjil wrote:darsben wrote:One croppy owner forces draconian rules.You leave your nice little doggy who is oh so loveable and while your gone it barks its fool head off. Ranger comes and if there is no rule then there is little he/she can do BUT with a rule then all is peaceful. My next door neighbor at a commercial CG recently had two little dogs like that. They were gone 8 hours and I had to go to the CG owner. No rule against it so nothing was done.It is a great ruleOur dogs are well behaved, and we are serious hikers. If this is simply the state of affairs, we will no longer be able to map in NP CG's. One of the reason we got into RVing 15 years ago was to be able to travel with our dogs. I can see by the response, that at least one person likes the rule. I know many people go to such CGs and then sit at their RVs most of the day. We do not. The dogs are alone while we work, and they are quite used to it. Oh well. Curious if there are any other thoughts on this issue.Many Commercial CGs have had that 'rule' for long time.Can't think of a CG we stayed in over the course of 7 yrs full time travel that didn't have that rule except for some 'city parks' or fairgrounds.Did we break that 'rule'....YESEarly on dog was left alone for several hours (same as when we worked) but as she aged during our travels we only left her alone for shorter and shorter periods. Hey---I have to go more frequent as I aged too!

We've seen that rule in many private campgrounds as well, not just National Parks...If you leave them in your RV and the power fails, they could die..barking is another problem. Even though people say they don't, often they do...of course, you're not there so you wouldn't know for sure unless you had a GoPro hooked up or a recorder....Dennis

From the Capital Reef NP website:"Pets must be restrained at all times on a leash 6 feet (1.8 m) or less in length. There are no kennels in the park and pets may not be left unattended in the campground."The last part of that is open to interpretation. I think most campers take it to mean unattended while outside the RV, "in the campground". Never the less, if your dog(s) are chronic barkers, don't leave them alone, inside or out. With technology today, it is very easy to determine if they are barking while you are away.

dogs in national park campgrounds | Good Sam Community

Crowe
Explorer
Aug 03, 2015
Mr./Ms. Crowe, this is a very well reasoned, concisely presented, logical response. Exactly the kind of thing we don't need on these forums.

LOL! It's actually Mrs. but you call me Lori! Sorry, I'll try to be more radical and emotional next time! :B
doc_brown
Explorer
Aug 03, 2015
Yep its a problem for us dog owners who want to leave the dog home while you are out for several hours. I solved that issue by getting a barkless dog, Basenji. He was fine with hanging in the coach for up to 5 hours (never left him longer than that) because he got 5-6 30 minute walks each day. My current neighbor has two dogs that bark all day long, owners are always gone 6-8 hours.
dturm
Moderator
Aug 03, 2015
How I wish I could agree with you on this one! Not all campgrounds enforce and it's not just barking. An unattended dog outside presents a potential safety hazard not only to others but to himself.

Totally agree with you on the attended outside - I didn't do a good job expressing myself :)

It just being left inside an RV unattended part. If the barking is the problem, there is a rule for that. The fact that the rule is not enforced is irrelevant, if they don't enforce rules: specifically the no barking, they won't enforce the no dog left unattended (most of the time they won't even know).
westernrvparkow
Explorer
Aug 03, 2015
Crowe wrote:
that means you either do not travel with your dogs or you drive presumably long distances to national parks then sit in a campground. My family are fairly active outdoors people, and this would simply not be worth the effort to us. In addition, I wonder - for those who rv with dogs, do you never get in a toad to tow vehicle and go out to dinner?

I visit Acadia on a regular basis. When we had the Endura, the dogs went with us because the Bar Harbor KOA doesn't (or at least didn't) have any such rules. We didn't stay in the park because we wanted full amenities. We did have a toad and took them as often as possible but there are times when it's just not feasible. We, too, are very outdoorsy and the boys would go to the "doggie hotel" as it was one less stress to deal with. Fortunately we have a top-notch kennel facility that we've boarded at for years. I understand the desire to take pets on vacation but everyone has to be realistic that this may require some concessions.

I don't camp in National Parks-most are just too far for me to drive to. However I still feel that "no unattended dogs" means just that. But a quick phone call will clear up any question. My hunch is that rules are phrased in such a manner so that some will just not take their dog or go elsewhere.

The no dogs left unattended (even inside an RV) rule is redundant and unnecessary in my opinion. Every campground has a no barking rule and if an animal is guilty the owners can be asked to leave.

How I wish I could agree with you on this one! Not all campgrounds enforce and it's not just barking. An unattended dog outside presents a potential safety hazard not only to others but to himself.

Before I continue, please remember that I, too, am a dog lover. However, I'm starting to see the trend that the "rights" of dog owners should supersede the "rights" of the non-dog owning public. You can march down to the next campground that has better rules but I can guarantee you that there is someone else doing the exact thing-in the opposite direction. Due to health reasons I couldn't camp where fires were allowed for a while, so we camped where they weren't allowed. I witnessed people leaving because they couldn't have one. You can stomp your feet, complain and go elsewhere, but I'm not sure it's having the impact you might think. And it only takes one that thinks the rules don't apply to them (and I've seen it MANY times on this forum) to ruin it for everyone else.
Mr./Ms. Crowe, this is a very well reasoned, concisely presented, logical response. Exactly the kind of thing we don't need on these forums.
SteveAE
Explorer
Aug 03, 2015
Steve,

Because of the "dog rules" (mainly not allowed on trails), we just avoid the National Park scene completely and hike, backpack, ski, snowshoe, raft and canoe with our dog on BLM, Forest and State lands. There is plenty of such land out there (at least in the West) and almost all of it is open to dogs.

Have fun with your pup.
Deb_and_Ed_M
Explorer II
Aug 03, 2015
Re Nat'l Parks: We take the dogs along on our daily jaunts. We tend to visit parks during the cooler months, so that leaving the dogs behind in the car while we take a short walk to see a sight, isn't life-threatening.... or, if a longer hike is required, one of us stays with the dogs.

My experience has been that most places that don't want a dog left behind in an RV - are VERY explicit about that (or they simply don't accept dogs). Otherwise, "don't leave a dog unattended" usually means outdoors (and I have seen that plenty of times). But it never hurts to ask specifically.
GMandJM
Explorer
Aug 03, 2015
We have encountered the dogs-in-a-camper-barking constantly a few times. I always feel sorry for the dogs.

More often I've seen/heard dogs barking when the owners are sitting right there with them.
DOTLDaddy
Nomad
Aug 03, 2015
dturm wrote:
...

That being said, in the decades we've been camping I can count on one hand the number of times we've heard dogs constantly barking...
That has been our experience as well, with the emphasis on "constantly". I do not count times when you are walking by another RV, and the dog(s) bark at you from inside.

I can only remember one time in over 20 years that non-stop barking got ridiculous. But, that's a whole nother story.:R
Dog_Folks
Explorer
Aug 03, 2015
Like the "No campers over ten years old" rule, it is there IN CASE they need it to control non stop barking.

With well behaved dogs, that stay quiet inside the camper, it will not normally be enforced.

That has been my experience traveling with dogs.
Crowe
Explorer
Aug 03, 2015
that means you either do not travel with your dogs or you drive presumably long distances to national parks then sit in a campground. My family are fairly active outdoors people, and this would simply not be worth the effort to us. In addition, I wonder - for those who rv with dogs, do you never get in a toad to tow vehicle and go out to dinner?

I visit Acadia on a regular basis. When we had the Endura, the dogs went with us because the Bar Harbor KOA doesn't (or at least didn't) have any such rules. We didn't stay in the park because we wanted full amenities. We did have a toad and took them as often as possible but there are times when it's just not feasible. We, too, are very outdoorsy and the boys would go to the "doggie hotel" as it was one less stress to deal with. Fortunately we have a top-notch kennel facility that we've boarded at for years. I understand the desire to take pets on vacation but everyone has to be realistic that this may require some concessions.

I don't camp in National Parks-most are just too far for me to drive to. However I still feel that "no unattended dogs" means just that. But a quick phone call will clear up any question. My hunch is that rules are phrased in such a manner so that some will just not take their dog or go elsewhere.

The no dogs left unattended (even inside an RV) rule is redundant and unnecessary in my opinion. Every campground has a no barking rule and if an animal is guilty the owners can be asked to leave.

How I wish I could agree with you on this one! Not all campgrounds enforce and it's not just barking. An unattended dog outside presents a potential safety hazard not only to others but to himself.

Before I continue, please remember that I, too, am a dog lover. However, I'm starting to see the trend that the "rights" of dog owners should supersede the "rights" of the non-dog owning public. You can march down to the next campground that has better rules but I can guarantee you that there is someone else doing the exact thing-in the opposite direction. Due to health reasons I couldn't camp where fires were allowed for a while, so we camped where they weren't allowed. I witnessed people leaving because they couldn't have one. You can stomp your feet, complain and go elsewhere, but I'm not sure it's having the impact you might think. And it only takes one that thinks the rules don't apply to them (and I've seen it MANY times on this forum) to ruin it for everyone else.