An Approach to RV Defects

Would be nice if getting good quality was that easy - After 20+ years in the Quality Business I'm convinced that just basing things on $ is not the right answer. RVs are difficult since they are more one at a time issue than an assembly line process like cars. Have looked at only one TT assembly line but it was enough to convince me that what's needed is a good corperate commitment to customer satisfaction, better training of the whole workorce (all levels management on down) and more inspection of key operations(not try to inspect quality in but major things need two sets of eyes). It has been demonstrated that just paying employees more is not the answer. I'm on my 5th RV and I really havn't found too much corellation between cost and fewer defects from factory. Big difference in my mind is more dollars get you a better grade of materials but not necessarily improve fit, finish and function.

cekkk wrote:
...Manufacturers could profit by offering an "option" that would cover the extra cost of workers taking time to do it right....

No manufacturer would do this because it would mean admitting that their normal quality is poor.

Cloud Dancer wrote:
IMO substandard RV products are offerred because we can't afford to pay for the good stuff. My 2003 Newmar Dutch Star is a perfect example.
I would've NEVER bought it, except that I could NOT afford what I really wanted.
That's the way it's been most of my life. That's the reason I buy lotto tickets.
BTW I fixed and modified many things in my Dutch Star. There's no way I would have a RV if I couldn't do my own mainenance AND repairs.
Thanks to all who have helped me, here on the RV.NET forums.

Like many other things the price you pay does not reflect on workmanship. Gone is the saying...you get what you pay for.

We looked at many RV's, everything from Pop ups to Class A. There were defects in everything we looked at. People don't care, not all but enough to make a difference to overall quality.

We stopped at a dealer and looked at a TT that was up there in $. We pointed out a few things that needed attention. The salesman/owner while practically shoving us out the door said...that's. The way things are made, take it or leave it.

We the consumer have to make our opinion count in the manufacturers pocket. We have to demand quality. It would not happen overnight but we either complain or put up with it.

QC could be as easy as giving the workforce the proper training, the proper tools, and the required time to do quality work…

Any company that wants quality can have it, anytime they choose to make quality a priority… quality cost but cost doesn’t equal quality…

quality doesn’t have to cost a lot sometimes just a commitment to do the best you can with what you have can make huge strides to a better product…

What consumer in their right mind, or even in their left mind, would ever ask for the: I'd like to add the 6 grand 'do it right the first time' option to my build-to-order RV?

ford truck guy wrote:

cekkk wrote:

ford truck guy wrote:
Would you take that option if your surgeon was offering it ? I would not use him if he offered it! Do it right the first time... that's not that hard

Point on. If you can afford it, you find and pay for a surgeon who who wasn't at the bottom of his class. So, yes, the best charge, or "offer" it now.

As for doing it right the first time, I completely agree. That's the way it should work. But that takes us back to the monastery problem, doesn't it.

Maybe this is too scary, but innovation often is.

The sad thing really is.... That we are having this conversation... IF ALL workers took pride in their work it would be a non issue... Up charge for a better or sturdier model.. I'm ok with that... up charge to have something double or triple checked, should not have to pay for that

That's not what's happening. I ending up staying for 10 days, at Newmar, when I went to pick up (and rejected) my Dutch Star.
I do NOT care how much pride you have, and how much you might want to do the work "right", if it takes 8 hours to do it right, and they only give you 3 hours to do it, and they insist you do it THEIR way, and you need the job,..........THAT'S what's happening.
IMO there's only ONE way to receive better/higher quality,...PAY FOR IT. It's easy for me to find the quality I prefer, I know exactly what to buy,.....I just don't have that kind of money.
I'm convinced that RV manufacturers simply produce different models/sizes/qualities base on what buyers will pay.

BTW I also was a production manager for a manufacturing facility (part owner as well).

sljkansas wrote:
QC/QA is my profession. What you need first is people that give a S#$%t about what they do. Second you need inspectors that know their product from one end to another, and isn't afraid to call attention to a problem and have the person that did the job fix it before it moved to the next step. Once the person doing the job is shown that they are accountable for their work, they will improve or be out of a job. Quality work needs to start at the top and followed to the end product.

This is so true. Quality work should start from the top. Too many times upper management and CEO's dont care, they just want the profits so THEY can make the big bucks!!. It would be nice if some would leave the golf clubs home, come to work and get involved.

Is this how a fire department should put out fires?

With all due respect, the comment about paying a premium to insure a quality product is one of the silliest things I've heard in a long time.

We won't see an increase in quality until there is some real competition in the marketplace.

One only needs to look at the auto industry today to see how the domestic automakers can produce world-class vehicles at competitive prices. It took 20 years of having their butts kicked in by foreign rivals but they finally got the message: In order to survive in a competitive marketplace you must provide a superior product at a competitive price or you're not going to be around for long.

wny_pat wrote:
Is this how a fire department should put out fires?

In the 1800's it was similar. You had to pay for fire insurance and have a cast iron plaque mounted on the front of the house as proof, or the fire department would not fight the fire, and let the structure burn!