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dtouhey's avatar
dtouhey
Explorer
Jul 08, 2014

Generator circuit breaker trips when AC kicks on

I have a 2006 Hurricane running an Onan 4000 Microquiet at 3600 RPM's. Each time the AC kicks on the breaker on the generator trips.

I have had the generator serviced and tested at least twice. (Filters replaced, brushes checked, and run under a load). The governor was sticking at one point. That has been fixed.

The generator runs fine in any combination of loads including the fan on the AC unit. But even when all other loads are removed and it is just the AC compressor, it trips the breaker. ( it does not always trip instantly but usually when the thermostat calls for the compressor to kick on it will trip eventually. Generally sooner rather than later.)

I read another forum entry from a person who had a similar problem. He suggested replacing the thermostat. I did, with a brand new one. Still no luck.

Has anyone out there had a similar problem? What did you do to fix it? Any help is greatly appreciated!

6 Replies

  • j-d's avatar
    j-d
    Explorer II
    I looked at more of 5-2-1's website, viewed the "installation video" which shows the wiring diagram. The audio wasn't clear but he says something about "117" early in the narration. I could not tell if he's saying that residential A/C (probably about a 3-ton by the look) drew 117A on startup before installing the device, OR if he saw 117-Volts AC. He might see that from one leg of the 240VAC service to neutral, but across the wiring that 117 should have been 234. Anyhow, when they start the unit up with the device installed, their clamp-on ammeter shows around 19A and drops to 14A immediately. They're marveling at the improvement, but they're using this exact meter that I searched out and found on Amazon.
    It's a $12 tool, direct "drop ship" probably direct from China, but from the specs it is clearly NOT a Peak Inrush-Reading Meter. It has a "Data Hold Button" but the numbers it holds won't be peak inrush.
    I'm not saying this device is no good. What I AM saying is the video doesn't prove it. It may well be equivalent to the Relay type of Start Device. If so it's a little better than SUPCO SPP6e. Which would I choose? The one Chris Bryant endorses. Hopefully he'll be by and have a remark.
  • j-d's avatar
    j-d
    Explorer II
    What SIZE is your rooftop A/C unit? I agree that a 4kW genset should run it, but I want to add that our 15000-btu Coleman is a load on startup, even with its factory-installed start kit.
    Have you verified that the 30A breaker on the side of your genny's control assembly box is good? If so...
    I'd say start by checking to see if your A/C has any kind of start assist on it now. To run at all, it needs two capacitors. One about 7.5uF for the Fan and another around 45.0uF for Compressor. They may be separate (two 2-terminal capacitors) or combined (one 3-terminal cap). If there's more than that connected (to the 45uF portion) then there's a Start Kit (an additional Capacitor plus some kind of control device. Control might be part of or wired to the cap).
    There's a pecking order in compressor start kits:
    1. None
    2. PTCR 2-wire (Positive Temperature Coefficient Resistor) - This is also called Time Based. PTCR heats up in an engineered amount of time, disconnecting the capacitor.
    3. Electronic 2-wire - Best example is the SUPCO SPP6e which is very popular here on RV.net. It claims to sense the actual startup status of the compressor and drop the start cap out of circuit at the optimal time.
    4. Start Relay - This is what our Coleman Mach 15 has, from the factory. According to Chris Bryant, our resident RV Tech contributor, it performs its job a shade better than the SPP6e that he usually recommends.
    5. Dometic specialized Hard Start Kit - I have only read about it but it usually comes up in a marine A/C context. I read an article about running marine A/C with a Honda eu2000 and this was the kit that did best.
    (6???) The kit shown above looks good. I don't know where this 3-wire electronic unit would fit in. I looked at their webpage and read the FAQ's. Sometimes the subtle slams on competing products are valid, sometimes they're hype. They say that if a 2-wire assist fails, it'll take the compressor out but their 3-wire unit will not. I know neither if that's true nor how often if ever it happens. But I do believe that "failed shorted" can happen to virtually any electrical/electronic device. Both kits are available on Amazon and that might be a good place to start with ratings. I've had appliance repair shops complain that SUPCO stuff doesn't last very long and somebody mentioned that in a review of the 5-2-1 kit noted above. I put a SUPCO on a residential fridge/freezer 10 years ago and it's still running. So is that 5-2-1 review FACT or HYPE?
    JOSE is a recent addition to the RV.net team and has turned out to be an impact player. Although I haven't heard of partial failure in an A/C cap, they do fail with age. So perhaps replacement AND a start kit is the way to go here. All this stuff can land on your doorstep from Amazon and others, cost less than $100 total. Less than a service callout or the first hour at a shop...
    There are some DVOM's that can read Capacitance. I'm blessed to have one of those, but there are others combined with an Ammeter that do it as well.
    Speaking of AMP's, the note above is absolutely correct. Measure the Amperage Draws. That's really where it's at, BUT not all Ammeters can read the startup spike in AMP's and get it right. There's a thread here on RV.net about Meters and there were a few around $60 that can read Capacitance, Frequency, and Inrush Amps. Some have AMP capability only for AC current. Getting all of the above in one that'll do DC AMP's, let alone Inrush DC Amps, could result in two meters instead of one and/or more expensive meters.
    Again, be careful of people's comments. A 5-2-1 review said the device cut "Locked Rotor Amps from 60 to 20." A compressor that is LOCKED has NOT started! If he had an instrument that could catch Peak Inrush Amps and saw 60A before the device was installed and 20A after, that'd be another matter. Most meters, like my Harbor Freight cheapie, can read two of the numbers listed on the compressor's rating plate. Running Amps is one. And God Forbid, Locked Rotor AMPS (LRA) is the other. I say God Forbid because that means the compressor has NOT started. Maybe it's stuck internally, but they'll read LRA with a failed Run Capacitor.
    A/C is so critical that I carry some tools, meters and parts. I can read Volts, Capacitance, and Run or Locked Amps. I can replace the Start and Run Caps and replace the Start Device (Relay and Capacitor in the case of our Coleman) with SPP6e.
    Capacitors are easy to replace and cheap to "test by substitution" with a new one. Just do this first:
    1. Disconnect AC Power, then
    2. Short across the cap's terminals to be sure it isn't charged
  • Do this the right way. Apparently changing parts (the thermostat) is not getting the desire results.

    Use an amp meter and see what the actual load is. If below the rated capacity of the breaker (more than likely) then change the breaker. The can and do get weak and fail when they afe.

    If amp load is above the rated capacity of the breaker, look for a failing compressor in you air conditioner. Air filters clean? Evaporator and condenser coils clean? Fan() working?
  • I had ac issues that included tripping the breaker.

    If you need a hard start, that means your caps are failing. Replace them AND add a hard start. It can only help.

    Jose
  • You turned off ALL circuit breakers in the main service panel, except the one for the a/C

    No power to the converter, the water heater and the fridge ?

    It trips only when the compressor cycles?
    Or
    Eventually trips while the compressor is already running?
  • You may have to add a hard start capacitor kit to your A/C. If it is having a hard time getting started, the breaker will trip before it gets going. Something like this:

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