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Fosters's avatar
Fosters
Explorer
Jan 06, 2017

NOW..........NO HOT WATER AT ALL!!!

Re: Suburban WH type

2nd owner to my 5th that has dual HW heating and not a single piece of repair history before I bought it in June 2016. Anyhow, I got hot water both by LP and elect with no problem till now, Jan 2017.

I prefer to use Electric mostly, and suddenly no hot water. Switched to LP and firing hot water, no problem. But I had to of course, find out why the elect was not working any longer. I am a DIY'r as best as I can. So with Dr. Google and youtube I tried to self teach myself on the use of a multi meter. I found the resistance only @ .10 for the heating element, which online mechanics tell me "that it is good". Anything higher then like .20 they say is bad.

So next is the thermostats, and visually both look. Meaning no obvious burnt outs or disconnects in either of the 4 fasteners. And I am aware, that the lt blue 2 on the LF are elect and the pink 2 on the
RT are gas. What should the resistance be on the thermos?

So I went ahead (before the meter check) and bought a replacement heater element and anode rod as well. I replaced the anode rod and glad I did (for assuming the original was still installed, now 8 years later and very well sacrificed for the job intended!). But I could not get the heating element out as I do not have a 1 1/2" socket. But again, the meter test indicates that is not the problem anyhow. But I want to check "how eaten up" it is anyway (have the replace part as well)?

What am I missing?

And get this, and salt in the wound, I put everything back together and NOW I CAN'T EVEN GET HOT WATER WITH THE LP SOURCE!!! Forget about the electric for a 2nd. The LP gas channels thru the pipe all the way to the what is it called "thermocoupler" (the part with the 2 prong arms that hang over the pipe) and ignites it right? Well, she flames up for 5 secs and shuts down. Then, repeats 2 more times (as I have also read, a total of 3 times try). So why won't the LP gas stay lit and heat up the water tank? And yes, full tank of LP and full strength of LP flow.

Please help, for now I have no HOT Water either LP or Electric!
Thanks in Advance and I hope I can answer questions to repair the problem or problems.
  • Fosters's avatar
    Fosters
    Explorer
    Jan 06, 2017
    Suburban Model is # SW12DE btw.

    Mandalay & Old-Bis (others of course!), following both suggestions. 1st being retrace my steps of what I disturbed and 2nd, did I disturb the electrode placement?

    On the Thermo LP spades, I noticed that they were flopped up and I thought out of place? So I depressed them back down parallel (just like the Elect spades). Was that a no-no? Would it make a difference?

    Next, when replacing the gas pipe it was very stubborn to line that one bolt back into the "frame lined hole" so I placed a screwdriver on top of the pipe and kinda pryed it down and shimmied into place. Perhaps I disturbed the path and correct position of the 2 electrodes? Are they supposed to be heavily engulfed into the flame or just hoovering over the flame? I will have to look, but certainly hope I did not crack the ceramic on the electrode body? That should be visible yes? But assume it would fall out if so? But putting that aside, interested in the electrode placement right now?
  • j-d's avatar
    j-d
    Explorer II
    Jan 06, 2017
    The problem on the 120 VAC side was the WHITE (neutral) wire from the Element, back to the Coach Wiring, was open at the junction box I mentioned earlier.

    It had been lighting on LPG, but not every time. While I was working on the water heater, I inspected the Electrode Assembly. Since it looked good, I didn't replace it. But I DID clean the ground connection and re-install with an anti-corrosion compound on the screw. The diagram doesn't show a GROUND on that assembly, just the "spark plug wire" from the Board, but it needs ground to work.
  • Old-Biscuit's avatar
    Old-Biscuit
    Explorer III
    Jan 06, 2017
    Suburban uses a very simple circuit for electric and for propane
    AC/DC Junction boxes are on backside of WH.....one each side

    Electric..
    120V AC from Main Power panel via a Circuit Breaker
    From CB to On/OFF Switch
    From On/Off Switch to t-stats (Left set)
    (High Temp then via connector wire to Normal temp----HI has 'manual reset push button)
    From t-stats to element (black wire) then to Neutral (white wire)

    Follow the 120V AC VOLTAGE ---find where you loose it



    Propane.......
    12V DC from Dist Panel via FUSED circuit
    TO On/Off Switch to t-stats (Right set) SAME as 120V Hi/normal
    From t-stats to Circuit Board (rear corner of tank)
    From Circuit Board to GAS valve (Brown wire---then to ground) and to SPARK Electrode (Heavy Orange wire)




    Spark electrode fires igniting propane
    Propane flame then 'ENGULFS' spark electrode generating a signal that goes back to circuit board 'PROVING' main flame lit (no signal...shutsdown)

    Electrode is firing/main flame lites
    so Check electrode position (engulfed in flame)
    Check electrode CLEAN (no sooting/carbon...otherwise no signal)
    Check spark electrode ground (assembly mounting screw...clean/tight connection)
    Check electrode ceramic ....no carbon/cracks otherwise signal will track to ground
    Check that electrode high voltage wire connection is clean/tight


    Also check that both High Temp T-stats are not tripped.Push button in to reset
  • j-d's avatar
    j-d
    Explorer II
    Jan 06, 2017
    It'd help to have the exact Suburban Model. If you have electronic ignition (no pilot, starts on LPG from an inside switch), PLUS Electric 120 VAC, then it's probably SW6DE or SW10DE, the 6 and 10 being the gallon sizes.

    If so, understand the Suburbans of this SWxxDE type are pretty much two water heaters, one LPG, one 120 VAC, sharing the same tank and same water. Atwood's different, both heat sources controlled by the Logic Board. But Suburban uses the Logic Board for LPG only.

    So... The odds of BOTH the LPG and 120 VAC failing at once are pretty slim.

    For 120 VAC, the water heater has a switch, and you may have another switch inside the coach. The Breaker, and Both Switches have to be ON. Then there's the Element, has to have continuity. Test resistance with power off and at least one wire disconnected. I think around 10 Ohms. Then there are two thermostats as you know. They should show Zero Ohms, dead Short across the thermostats.

    I just worked on ours. Really convinced the element was bad but it turned out to be a burnt out connection in the junction box feeding the water heater. Our SW6DE has its actual connections in a box on the upper outboard right corner, looking at the heater from INSIDE the coach. The wiring ran from there, about three feet to a "push down" junction box screwed to the cabinet floor. When I opened that box, I found the Neutral side had burned out and lost contact. At that point, I removed that box, gutted it, and connected the wiring with wire nuts and taped over them as well. Used the box to protect the wire nut connections and re-installed it. Water heater works on 120 VAC.

    That's what I did on the electric side. LPG side is more involved. www.bryantrv.com has the service manual online.
  • Mandalay_Parr's avatar
    Mandalay_Parr
    Explorer
    Jan 06, 2017
    Recheck all the electrical connections you disturbed. Don't go chasing symptoms. Always go to the last place you were. Sounds like the control board is not sensing the flame.
    For electric, check for 120v going to water heater. Also might be a fuse on/or around the circuit board.

    Call me. Might be able to help over the phone. I am a good Electrical troubleshooter.
  • jamway's avatar
    jamway
    Explorer
    Jan 06, 2017
    Check all the spade clips and the ground for good clean connections. Some times they look good but are not making a good connection so clean them.

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