After a recent extended trip without hookups, and a lot of research, I decided I need more battery capacity! But I have no room for another battery. About two years ago I bought two Battle Born 100 AH Lipo4 batteries. I downsized my motorhome to a smaller Class C and there isn’t room in the battery compartment and no nearby location to put another. But BattleBorn does make 270ah battery that will fit in the existing compartment. If I was buying now I’d definitely get that one over the two 100AH batteries. And I still may get it anyway. But it is $2400! I may go ahead and do it if I thought I could sell my two year old batteries. Is there a market for used LiPo4 batteries? I think I paid about $900 each for them and they are $950 each now. If I could get half that I’d pull the trigger and get the bigger battery.

SOK 206 ah batteries are just over $1000 on Amazon. And they are the size of a typical car battery.

Somoething to think about when comparing batteriesLead acid come in flavors some of them even using 20% of the rated capacity is not recommended (GC batteries are DEEP CYCLE meaning 50% is the recommended minimum SOC.. MARINE/deep cycle around 75-80% minimum SOC (meaning a 100 AH battery you can only use 20-25 AH) Starting 80 or more (Do not use more than 20%)LiFePO4...You can use like 99% of the capacity. and over 90 before you notice voltage drop.

Couple things to consider. 1. There IS room somewhere. Especially if going with more LI power. It’s low amp draw you don’t need welding leads to hook them up. Even if the supplemental batteries are 10’ or a bit more away from the connection point to your DC panel or existing battery box. 2. You could improve your quiet charging (presume solar because if you had a generator you likely wouldn’t have the same query). 3. You could add a big DC DC charger and use the Moho as a generator. 4. You could get a small quality inverter generator or even a cheapo bigger inverter genny for far less $ than what you’ll lose on selling and re-purchasing Battleborns. Probably be money ahead even if you purchase additional LI battery power frugally. Maybe even $0 cost if you find a nice used Honda or Yami genny at a decent price. The used Honda I bought 10 years ago is still worth what I paid for it. (Likely more…FJB)5. You overpaid once for batteries. Taking a 50% hit on those to overpay again (Battleborn) is doubly silly. 6. If you really think adding only 25% capacity (200 vs 270A) will do the trick (seems like you’d be asking the same question again next year though…) then options 2,3 or 4 are easy solutions that may or will yield better results.7. What do you “really” need? Your post alludes to a single trip that (idk what “after lots of research” means) presumably you either went lights out and the beer n burgers got warm or you had to curtail your power use to make it the whole time with cold beer. You’re planning on this being a more regular occurrence in the future? If so, options 1 or 2 are your best bet. If not, see option #6. In all cases option #5 is a very poor choice IMO unless you like showing off your trick overpriced batteries…..Which brings about #8, which is actually a spin on #1. You could showcase your Grunt Style, military inspired high tech power supply in the camper. A little plexiglass cased 12V ottoman with quick disconnects comes to mind. Or maybe a Battleborn night stand?And I almost forgot. Option #9, wholly endorsed but never sponsored by our very own expert @pianotuna. Scrap it all and go 24, 36, or 48V. On the upside you could likely do it for the same or less $ than that one new Battleborn big boy battery!And finally option #10, serious about this one. Use your Moho start battery in a pinch and keep one of those little LI jump packs in the event you need cold beer a bit more than an engine that doesn’t need a jump start. You could even upgrade your start battery for not alot of money (in battle born dollars) and maybe only use the jump pack as a beer coaster.

Hi,Have you switched lighting to led technology?If you have an inverter make sure it is NOT left on between uses.Add solar generation to your bag of tricks? It is far cheaper than replacing the battery bank.

IMHO, Battle Born batteries are Way over priced !Search online. There are several other companies offering similar batteries for much less money.

Scotty I need more power! | Good Sam Community

67 Replies

ktmrfs
Explorer II
Aug 20, 2023
msmith1199 wrote:
ktmrfs wrote:
msmith1199 wrote:
Ktmrfs, okay I do have the wizard button, but it was hidden behind a power cable the ran over it. I tried the manual boost mode and it didn’t appear to be going into boost. But the batteries were near fully charged so I’m thinking that may have something to do with it. So I left the batteries on with the fridge and some other stuff running and I’ll got back out this evening with the batteries run out and see if I can get the boost mode to work.

StirCrazy, it’s in LI mode and has been since I installed the LI batteries.

yes, little bitty button is somewhat hidden, and not well documented.

And if the battery is near full charge, yes it may go into boost mode but charging current won't change much or current will drop pretty rapidly. . At least on Lead Acid batteries.

Didn’t work. Got the batter down to 43% and tried everything with the wizard button and could only get 16amps going to the battery for the charge. I also only get 14.1 volts now out of the converter and it should be 14.6 voltes in the lithium mode. So I don’t think the converter is in lithium mode. I think the little switch got busted the first time I tried to use it because it’s so small. I had ran some trouble shooting things with the factory rep and he told me it sound to him like the switch broke in lithium mode, but now that I have the SmartShunt I’m not convinced of that. So I’m going to call them next week and discuss it. And, it looks to me like the 4560LI is much better suited to what I want anyway. And I can get that converter unit and swap it with the 4560 without having to swap everything else out. It’s just a plug and play. So I’ll take to them about that next week. It’s under $300 and if it works better, (sounds like it does) that’s worth it to me.

yes, it is not acting like a PD converter should behave. with the battery(s) at 40% on a 60A converter I'd expect you to get at least 40A, likely even more. The 16ish A is more like the unit in 13.6V output. I think once you get one that works as it should you'll find that a couple of hours will get you charged to 80+% charged.
pianotuna
Nomad III
Aug 20, 2023
msmith1199,

My older PD converter did 14 volts in boost into 875 amp-hours of lead acid. Before wizard it did 13.2

It did do 14 volts every 23 hours for 15 minutes.
msmith1199
Explorer II
Aug 20, 2023
ktmrfs wrote:
msmith1199 wrote:
Ktmrfs, okay I do have the wizard button, but it was hidden behind a power cable the ran over it. I tried the manual boost mode and it didn’t appear to be going into boost. But the batteries were near fully charged so I’m thinking that may have something to do with it. So I left the batteries on with the fridge and some other stuff running and I’ll got back out this evening with the batteries run out and see if I can get the boost mode to work.

StirCrazy, it’s in LI mode and has been since I installed the LI batteries.

yes, little bitty button is somewhat hidden, and not well documented.

And if the battery is near full charge, yes it may go into boost mode but charging current won't change much or current will drop pretty rapidly. . At least on Lead Acid batteries.

Didn’t work. Got the batter down to 43% and tried everything with the wizard button and could only get 16amps going to the battery for the charge. I also only get 14.1 volts now out of the converter and it should be 14.6 voltes in the lithium mode. So I don’t think the converter is in lithium mode. I think the little switch got busted the first time I tried to use it because it’s so small. I had ran some trouble shooting things with the factory rep and he told me it sound to him like the switch broke in lithium mode, but now that I have the SmartShunt I’m not convinced of that. So I’m going to call them next week and discuss it. And, it looks to me like the 4560LI is much better suited to what I want anyway. And I can get that converter unit and swap it with the 4560 without having to swap everything else out. It’s just a plug and play. So I’ll take to them about that next week. It’s under $300 and if it works better, (sounds like it does) that’s worth it to me.
msmith1199
Explorer II
Aug 19, 2023
pianotuna wrote:
msmith1199

From the downloadable manual.

PD4500LI - The full rated load is available for load, battery charging or both. When functioning as a regulated battery charger the converter has a nominal voltage output of 14.6 VDC. The system is designed to sense voltage on the battery and will taper the charging current as the battery becomes charged.

CAUTION

The 4500LI series converter/chargers are designed to recharge lithium iron phosphate (LiFePO4) batteries only.

DO NOT USE TO RECHARGE LEAD/ACID BATTERIES!

Don’t have that inverter.
ktmrfs
Explorer II
Aug 19, 2023
msmith1199 wrote:
Ktmrfs, okay I do have the wizard button, but it was hidden behind a power cable the ran over it. I tried the manual boost mode and it didn’t appear to be going into boost. But the batteries were near fully charged so I’m thinking that may have something to do with it. So I left the batteries on with the fridge and some other stuff running and I’ll got back out this evening with the batteries run out and see if I can get the boost mode to work.

StirCrazy, it’s in LI mode and has been since I installed the LI batteries.

yes, little bitty button is somewhat hidden, and not well documented.

And if the battery is near full charge, yes it may go into boost mode but charging current won't change much or current will drop pretty rapidly. . At least on Lead Acid batteries.
pianotuna
Nomad III
Aug 19, 2023
msmith1199

From the downloadable manual.

PD4500LI - The full rated load is available for load, battery charging or both. When functioning as a regulated battery charger the converter has a nominal voltage output of 14.6 VDC. The system is designed to sense voltage on the battery and will taper the charging current as the battery becomes charged.

CAUTION

The 4500LI series converter/chargers are designed to recharge lithium iron phosphate (LiFePO4) batteries only.

DO NOT USE TO RECHARGE LEAD/ACID BATTERIES!
msmith1199
Explorer II
Aug 19, 2023
Ktmrfs, okay I do have the wizard button, but it was hidden behind a power cable the ran over it. I tried the manual boost mode and it didn’t appear to be going into boost. But the batteries were near fully charged so I’m thinking that may have something to do with it. So I left the batteries on with the fridge and some other stuff running and I’ll got back out this evening with the batteries run out and see if I can get the boost mode to work.

StirCrazy, it’s in LI mode and has been since I installed the LI batteries.
Grit_dog
Navigator
Aug 19, 2023
pianotuna wrote:
https://ca.renogy.com/12v-100ah-smart-lithium-iron-phosphate-battery-w-self-heating-function/?Rng_ads=5efe0e84a858746d&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0IGnBhDUARIsAMwFDLneMyfk8Narxc6ymC76sMOPsv6LxQ5GPTG3EhtUfd2yr_J1EhhrfUIaAnFXEALw_wcB

Of interest to those who have the funds.

??
OP already has 2 100ah LiFe batteries he’s planning on hocking on the Gregslist…why would he want another one?
pianotuna
Nomad III
Aug 19, 2023
https://ca.renogy.com/12v-100ah-smart-lithium-iron-phosphate-battery-w-self-heating-function/?Rng_ads=5efe0e84a858746d&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0IGnBhDUARIsAMwFDLneMyfk8Narxc6ymC76sMOPsv6LxQ5GPTG3EhtUfd2yr_J1EhhrfUIaAnFXEALw_wcB

Of interest to those who have the funds.
StirCrazy
Moderator
Aug 19, 2023
Grit dog wrote:
OPs camper is only 2 years old. Maybe I misread something a couple years ago when I was gonna can the Wfco for a PD. Canned the whole camper instead….
But I thought all newer PD converters came pre-loaded with the Charge Wizard? Although not having the CW doesn’t prevent bulk charging, it actually controls the finer end of things at the top of the charging cycle and battery maintenance charging.
Maybe it’s just not playing nice with the BMSsses in the BB batteries?
Sorry option 11 just presented.

the 9200 series that had charge wizard built in so no pendent and manual control of the wizard now, where as the old pendant you could use the charge wizard to force it into bulk

if your 4500 series is a newer one it will have a LI mode that you can switch with a physical switch on the power center. this is from the manual.

"DC SECTION FEATURES
The optional OUTPUT MODE SWITCH sets the converter output to either a constant 14.6VDC with the Charge Wizard® disabled
(switch in ‘LI’ position) or a nominal 13.6VDC with full Charge Wizard®
function (switch in ‘LA’ position). ‘LI’ mode is intended
for use with lithium batteries with a BMS requiring a constant converter output. ‘LA’ mode is intended for use with lead/acid
batteries where the Charge Wizard® will optimize battery charging. "

it is a little two position switch just above the wizard manual button. so you have to take the cover off so you can see the boards.

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Scotty I need more power!

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