Why can't I get a TRUE Deep cycle battery anymore?

Trojan HAD to find a niche because it is impossible to out-cheap bargain basement warfare and win. Made in Mexico batteries are done in the LTH plant in Monterrey Nuevo Leon as are Optima and others. Gigantic rail lines multi lane highways and vast border commercial crossing points. Everything but electrical power and diesel fuel is ridiculously cheaper this side of the border.

By processing reclaimed batteries for the lead costs are minimized. Trojan chooses the high-hurdles route. Better quality but crippled by significantly higher production costs. Rolls and their flooded batteries are also in the same boat. Lifeline of course is a domestically produced AGM product. Niche markets aredemanding. My alternators had to actually be tougher than factory originals. Just dealing with the famous, Ford, spin-open, rotor nightmare was tough. I had a special 6000 RPM lathe and hand held twin contactor 48 volts 9 amps. Those rotors that passed this test were dipped in urethane and baked. All rotor rebuilders SAND off cured varnish. Not me. A 3 hp motor powered a twisted wire brush and pole pieces were buffed clean whe still hot from the oven. Another lathe finished slip rings to around a quarter-thousandth of an inch. I purchased special re-wound stators from Bill Lund at Lund & Flynn Chula Vista CA. New used laminations meaning old copper windings were not burned to reclaim the old copper. Burning HARMS silicon coated laminations killing output versus rotor RPM.

Every one of my remans had new 150 amp rated rectifier bridges NTN LUA bearings and custom Saint Marys Carbon brushes. 12SI Delco alternators lost the useless turbine fan.

Yes they could not compete with Velcro and wingnut "Bringer back 500 times it has a lifetime warranty" garbage. But guess what -some- customers are smart enough to figure out what the game was and insisted on saving more money in the long-run.

The type of customer who did not drive 20 miles to save 25 cents a gallon on gasoline.

It all depends on what the customer can tolerate. "Vacation ruined? Shucks bringger back er, Fred isn't it? We'll find one that works! No matrer what it takes (you)"

Trojan Batteries. I had a set of t-125 on my prior TT for over 10 years and sold it with them going strong. Bought two new t125's and we dry camp all the time. Im sure Ill get at least 10 years out of this set. Best deep cycle battery on the market as far as I am concerned. They are made for use in golf carts and electric forklifts as well as heavy marine industrial use. Sure you can buy inexpensive ones but they wont last as long. Trojan Batteries are built to last. Yes they arent cheap but you do get what you pay for.

All I wanted was a Stepford, wife.

Fact is, the Johnson Controls, RV battery has no changed in say 15 years. It's still 2.75% antimony .050" plate thickness.

What changed was the label. The prolific growth of off-grid left the never-was-deep-cycle car jar batteries the laughing stock of the battery industry.

WHHAAATT? No change?

That's right. Oops I screwed-up: The label changed.

As Bob Marley put it...

"Don't Worry Be Happy"

pjw73nh wrote:
As the title says. Why can't I get a true deep cycle battery any more? I suppose I could get a $250+ high end one (Optima/Trojan etc), but I am looking in the sub $150 range. I use my trailer 6 times a year and pay close attention to battery maintenance. I consider them disposable after 3-4 years.

I used to be able to get them at Walmart/Sams/Autozone etc... Now all they offer is is deep cycle RV/Marine batteries.

I don't need the starting power or vibration resistance of a marine battery. I want a reasonably priced TRUE DEEP CYCLE NON MARINE battery.

"Reasonably priced" is the limiting factor in your search.

Here's what we have two-of in our RV - but they weren't reasonably priced. If I get 5 to 8 zero-maintenance years out of them to amortize their cost over ... then IMHO their 230 amp-hours of true deep cycle AGM capacity were worth every cent: http://www.fullriverbattery.com/product/batteries/DC115-12

By the way, we just returned from our longest continuous dry-camping period ever, and they performed brilliantly using a combination of 13.8 volt converter and Honda EX650 portable generator recharging, 13.8 volt converter and built-in Onan recharging, and idling Ford V10 130 amp alternator recharging. They needed recharging from about 50% SOC about every third day when supplying the refrigerator controller powered full-time, two CPAP machines powered about 8 hours each night, LED interior lights powered as needed, and occasional phone, laptop, and Jetpack recharging.

I did not "fully" recharge them during this time, as indicated by the current they were still drawing at the end of each recharge session. They got fully recharged by the engine alternator on the 7 hour drive home from the campsite. They are kept fully recharged 24/7 at home by the 13.8 volt converter in the RV.

for DAILY needs NOT INCLUDING A/C
for a/c you will need the generator,

IIRC .. one member can run a small window a/c from his solar augmenting his batteries
during the peak of the day, only about (2) hours then the batteries start going down hill fast

i think he did this testing in his driveway, not when camping

MrWizard wrote:
LeRoy
lots of variables
..
technically it may be possible, there are few here that claim to do it
but how feasible it is ? well....

lithium, offers about 1/5 the weight and (4) times the cost, maybe more

technically it may be possible That is the answer that I needed. I fully understand an energy audit and battery needs. I was trying to figure out if I could go generator free. That is only use the gen set on non-sunny days. Now I know the answer.

I kind of made the decision to go with AGM's for the maintenance free advantage. My camper batteries are in a very inaccessible area. Li-Ion are light weight but expensive and will still need to be bulk gen charged each day. From what I have read, both AGM and Li-Ion batteries want to be very fast recharged each day for the longest life.

Thank you Mr. Wizard,
LeRoy

LeRoy
lots of variables
life style, how much power do you use in 24hrs ?
in your ideal scenario
the solar has to be capable of supplying that during the daylight max solar hours
that means returning every ampHR+ used overnight, plus all the ampHrs being used during the day, or they will NOT be at full charge when dark comes
and it has to do this in the winter (short daylight hours) wherever you are at

technically it may be possible, there are few here that claim to do it
but how feasible it is ? well....
depends on those factors mentioned, amount of power use and size of solar array and where you 'winter' etc..

4, 5, 6 or more big batteries, are heavy and expensive, using AGM
my battereis weight 102# each, and i have (5) of them

lithium, offers about 1/5 the weight and (4) times the cost, maybe more

Total battery bank ampere hours

Divide total by a factor of six.

This gives a comfortable amount of hotel power plus can recharge batteries with consistancy.

Better to be a little light on panel capacity then plan on occasional "rest days" for hotel extraction and let the sun top off the batteries.

Full solar reliance means ignoring absorbsion charging specs offered by OEM. Voltage must be set higher.

Buy your batteries and buy an amp hour meter first. You need to live-the-life and know for a fact what your lifestyle needs as far as daily amp hours. Once you have that amp hours figure return and get advice from the panel a d controller nerds.

MrWizard wrote:
Here is my routine
There are exceptions, on the avg
I start the generator in the morning and run thru breakfast, maybe lunch
I run until charged, or charged to the point that solar can supply the needed power while also to charging...

I want to go to AGM batteries this fall and want to FULLY recharge them with solar ONLY everyday to get the best battery longevity.

I am very confused. Is that even a possibility? Assuming that I have enough solar panels and full bright sun, Is solar ONLY capable of producing enough voltage to quickly and FULLY recharge AGM batteries?

I keep reading about people bulk charging batteries using gen sets early in the morning and allowing solar to top off the batteries to 100% SOC thru out the remainder of the day. So again my mind still wanders if solar ONLY is capable of producing enough voltage to quickly recharge AGM batteries?

A very confused LeRoy

Mex says, "I consume more time daily blowing my nose."

I sympathize -- my allergies are terrible, too. ;)