Forum Discussion

Shortems's avatar
Shortems
Explorer
Sep 02, 2015

1994 Ford E350

OK so I am new to this forum but I am looking for some help and guidance, because I might have rose colored glasses on.

First some background. I recently obtained a Ford E350 Glaval conversion van for use as a tow vehicle (believed to be capable of Towing 10,000 lbs). The van has about 110,000 mile on it a 460 7.5l motor 4.10 rear and the e40d transmission with about 500 miles on it (replace prior to being placed in storage for 13 years). The van was purchased new by my Father to be the family tow vehicle for our camping trips up and down the East coast. I am looking to use it for the same purpose to tow my new 35ft travel trailer dry weight 6,500 lbs fully loaded weight 9,985lbs. Typical weight of trailer as used 7,700lbs

Now the questions.
1. Should this van with this configuration be able to tow 10,000 lbs (based on trailer life tow guide it should)
2. Should I be able to maintain highway speeds 65mph while pulling on an interstate while climbing a hill or do I need to slow down and use flashers?
3. If the van can pull this kind of weight what would cause this vehicle to not be able to pull the weight? (See list of work completed to date below).

For me to recieve the van it drove about 400 miles from my parents house to mine. Here is a list of work completed prior to my first pull.
1. New wheel cylinders calipers and brake lines
2. New shocks front and rear with tow shocks
3. New radiator (old one had two pin holes)
4. Full time up plugs wires cap
5. New computer (engine was running rough all tests pointed to ECM once changed seemed to fix problem)
6. Oil change
Completed after my first and only pull
1. Two new transmissions
2. Installed a larger tranny cooler
3. Tested catalytic converter for back pressure
4. Checked timing
5. Tested fuel pressure at injectors

My first pull was a short 3 hour pull from my house with some thruway, back roads and holes. I will say the travel was not what I expected the van struggled on all roads unless flat barely maintaing highway speed. The first 40 minutes of the trip the stock temp gauge was running high, still in the normal range but high. During the trip while ascending a hill on a back road I lost the transmission (remember new only a couple of hundred miles) the temperature never exceeded the normal range again high but did not exceed it.

I have since received another reman transmission from Jasper. I had high hopes the new transmission would solve the struggling towing but the Towing did not improve any again the vehicle struggled at highway speeds while ascending a hill (4 miles long) on the interstate I was barely able to maintain 60mph (speed limit is 65) this time I had a transmission temp gauge and was running temp in the 240 range (not good I know). I delivered the trailer home and parked it. While backing the trailer in I reached temps in excess of 260 (blew Tanny #2) luckily the tranny was under warranty and was replaced at Jaspers cost and I was to convince them to install a much larger cooler.

I don't want to give up on this vehicle because it has the perfect amount of space for my family while traveling but I need to know if it can handle the trailer we have and if my expectations are too high.

Any help and guidance is appreciated.
Tow Vehicles

7 Replies

  • Hank85713's avatar
    Hank85713
    Explorer
    Sep 06, 2015
    Vehicles that will maintain speed limits while towing and climbing are few and far between, even new ones if you read the road tests. As noted plan on going slower up hill. I towed our TT with an 89 F250 with the 351 engine. We passed a lot of vehicles and were passed by a lot particularly when going up hill. It had a tendency to run a little warm and I found out it had some dirty injectors in it. Replaced them and it ran better. Went to performance wires and ignition system (Mallory) and it really ran well. Actually could have gone to larger injectors once the ignition system was installed. High heat issues are not always due to radiator cooling but other things that cause excess heat such as lean running injectors. Never did have a pinging issue. You might also want to consider a lower temp Tstat. I also had the 4:10 gears in the truck very seldom used 1st gear all starts in 2d except when towing.
  • Shortems's avatar
    Shortems
    Explorer
    Sep 06, 2015
    Thank you all for the responses. This is what I had thought. I had rose colored glasses on. As I mentioned the van was given to me from my father. When I got it he said it was the best tire vehicle he ever had no problems towed his TT (the one I grew up with) and fully packed was close to 10,000. Well I came to find out his that (by asking Mom) that trailer dry weighed 5,100lbs and fully loaded was only 6,600lbs. I love my Dad but always go to Mom for the full story.

    So I forgot to mention the clutch fan was replaced during the work on the van, it wasn't fully engaging. It definitely roars when it kicks in. The torque was replaced each time the tranny was replaced and locks up when driving. When I tow I keep the overdrive off.

    After the first tranny went I had installed a tach and a tranny temp gauge. This is how I knew I was running hot. Per Jasper (the tranny remanufactured) they don't send the tranny fluid through the radiator. Apparently the 94 fired tranny lines in the radiator were to small. Luckily due to the warranty Jasper replaced the tranny and provided a much larger cooler. This new cooler send to be keeping the tranny temp down about 30 degrees which fit me is comforting temps in the 160 no load and 190 with load.

    The last tow I did not long about 30 mile tow the tranny never went over 160. I took note of the following. The TV runs at about 2800 rpm with overdrive off no trailer and runs about 3000 with overdrive off with the trailer at 65. The only difference is how far I am pressing the gas peddle. Without the trailer I have a long way to go with the trailer there is little left. I did try to advance the timing by the degrees, this didn't seem to give me any more power but it did make the engine run a little hotter. I will be seeing the timing back.

    This was all really helpful and brings my expectations to where should be.

    Next year I am planning on taking a 1,500 mike trip this set should be ok right? Or do I need to consider a different TV I hope not.

    Michael
  • Anmacc2's avatar
    Anmacc2
    Explorer
    Sep 02, 2015
    I towed with ford e series vans from 1976 - 2003. 2003 -present I have a Chevy express. Vans tow differently than pick-ups. Wind/air displacement, center of gravity, inertia, are all different. Vans are more slow and steady. They're cargo horses, never known for performance. Your conversion is probably eating up some weight. Your TT is upper end for all limits. If you're going to use your old van then you have to be in the mindset of SLOW AND STEADY. You have some cooling issues. Go to the biggest radiator with the biggest fan you can fit. Go with the biggest transmission cooler you can fit. CHECK your brakes. They are light for what you're pulling. Now relax, slow down, and enjoy the journey. BTW/ For short trips to shows I sometimes tow my TT with my 1987 CROWN VICTORIA. That gets people's attention.
  • carringb's avatar
    carringb
    Explorer
    Sep 02, 2015
    I think you have been given very good advice.

    The 460 is a capable motor, and Marty nailed the GCWR at 16,000 pounds. That means you can't quite tow 10,000 pounds and stay within spec, only because your van's unloaded weight is surely over 6,000 pounds.

    That said... while being the quick up a hill is probably not realistic, if should be able to make it no problem without overheating or eating transmissions. I think the fan clutch is a good place to start. If your van doesn't sound like a big-rig when pulling hills, your fan-clutch is shot. It's LOUD!

    Also, high trans temps can also indicate your Torque Converter is not locking up. When you slowly tip into the throttle do your RPMs go up as well? Or to they stay steady as the engine makes more power? If they are rising with throttle position, it is not locking up. The most common cause for this is not a transmission problem however, but a faulty Coolant Temp Sender (it uses a different one for transmission operating than the one for the dash). Faulty coolant temp sender makes the transmission stay unlocked, because this is part of the warm-up strategy.

    Finally, as mentioned above, debris from the old transmission is the most common way to trash a new transmission. If you don't replace BOTH coolers, then Ford requires installing a MagneFine in-line transition oil filter. I have one on my van, and don't even drop the pan anymore for service. Just swap MagneFine filters and some fluid.
  • Golden_HVAC's avatar
    Golden_HVAC
    Explorer
    Sep 02, 2015
    Hi,

    Perhaps 60 MPH on a 4% grade while towing is a bit to much to expect from any gas towing rig. Most slow to 55 or even 45, and use second gear. Even in my motorhome, I am slowing to 45 in second gear, and I have a 17,000 pound motorhome towing a 3,000 pound car.

    When parking the vehicle is moving very slowly, and it is not unheard of for the transmission to overheat a bit. When it reached 235F+ it is time to shut it off, take a 15 minute break, and see if it cools down a bit. Perhaps more than a bit?

    Some with 4 wheel drive trucks will shift into 4X low range, so that the engine RPM is higher for a given road speed while backing up, and this seems to be easier on the torque converter and engine.

    I think or would hope that the large transmission cooler will solve your overheating problems. Still when you try to go wide open throttle on a hill while towing, it will warm up that transmission. If you do not want to be towed back for transmission #3, then slow down!

    I might suggest washing the radiator, but you just replaced it, so it should be clean. I would replace the clutch between the fan and water pump, unless you hear the fan roar while climbing those hills. The clutch should be locking up and taking the fan from a lazy 1,200 RPM's up to full engine speed while climbing a hill IF the air going through the radiator is over 165F, and the clutch is working. This will quickly cool both the radiator and transmission.

    Much of the heat from the transmission goes into the radiator lower tank, and only about 25% will go out that small transmission cooler into the air. I think that a new clutch will improve the overheating situation on both the radiator and thus the transmission as well.

    Yes the E-350 is a towing beast! You do not have the 'best' year of 460" engine, but have fuel injection and a fairly stout transmission. Try running higher octane gas, and it should improve the performance. The anti-ping sensor will cause the engine to ****** the timing, and enrichen the fuel mixture to stop the pinging, both will reduce the fuel economy.

    I think that the same year F-350 460" engine had a few more horsepower, due to a larger radiator and the ability to pass much more air through the engine compartment. I know that diesel vans over the years had lower HP ratings do to overheating problems. Also the V10 in vans was something like 45 HP less in a van than the truck, and class A motorhomes got the 362 HP V10's due to a much larger radiator.

    If you are still overheating the engine after the new fan clutch, then consider a oil cooler. The later model vans have a engine oil cooler bolted directly to where the oil filter goes on the engine block, and the oil filter bolts onto the oil cooler. Then the radiator lower hose connects to the oil cooler, and on to the block return line. You should be able to find all these parts at a junkyard, if your van did not include them from the factory.

    Good luck,

    Fred.
  • jerem0621's avatar
    jerem0621
    Explorer II
    Sep 02, 2015
    1) ensure your clutch fan is working properly
    2) If you have an external only transmission cooler, look at converting the transmission cooling to a two stage system (Radiator with a built in transmission cooler, that pre-cools the transmission fluid, then is plumbed through an external transmission cooler before returning to the transmission.)
    3) Ensure that the the transmission lines are 100% clear of the debris from the two previous blown transmissions.

    Another thing... don't worry so much about maintaining speed up hill... towing 9,000 lbs... worry about working in the capability of your vehicle... keep the RPM's in the powerband and let the Van work.. If it loses some speed...so what. Its okay...

    fianlly, Your TV is 22 Model Years old now... Don't expect it to perform like the new trucks... they have 360-400 hp and 6-800 lb ft of tq... Massive cooling systems.. and 6 speed transmissions. You have about 245 hp and 400 ish lb ft of tq... similar specs to a new Ecodiesel Half ton.

    Thats about all I can think of right now.

    Thanks and good luck!

    Jeremiah
  • blt2ski's avatar
    blt2ski
    Moderator
    Sep 02, 2015
    That van probably had a gcwr of around 16K when new. Max HP about 250'ish, maybe a few more hp. Torque mid to high 300lb ft, at best 400 or a hair over.

    With this in mind, as I recall, it was rated to around 10K ball mount, then again, that is about the max for any given 2" receiver at the time! A pickup was upwards of 12K in 5w form.

    With that in mind......I would say your performance was on par with what I had with BB GM's at the time.

    marty

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