Are You Buying All These Half-ton Claims?

spoon059 wrote:
By the way... what 36' long trailer is light enough or has low enough tongue weight to even meet the specs of a half ton truck???

As a half-ton truck owner I don't believe there is one - after you take in to account all your other passengers/cargo.

By the way... what 36' long trailer is light enough or has low enough tongue weight to even meet the specs of a half ton truck???

fx2tom wrote:
No, you did take them out of context by implying that a driver towing relaxed is driving recklessly.

You are towing with a 1/2 ton truck and a 25 ft trailer. That is not the equivalent to towing something 11 feet longer.

Towing with a 3/4 ton makes me more comfortable. There was absolutely nothing wrong with my equal-izer set up. The one part we do agree on is that an idiot can screw up towing regardless of TV.

Dude... seriously? Read the WHOLE thing I wrote, not just the two sentences that got your panties in a bunch...

I wrote that if someone drove a half ton that was improperly set up, then moved up to a 3/4 ton and still didn't fix the issues (weight distribution hitch, too little tongue weight, too little tire on trailer, etc) then he was just masking the problems. Normal, everyday driving would "feel" better in the 3/4 ton with everything done wrong. However, when you have an emergency situation or high winds and your hitch and sway controller aren't right, or your tongue weight it too low, you are still going to have the same problem that you did in the improperly set up half ton. The only difference is that you will "feel" more comfortable until the fit hits the shan.

It doesn't make it safer, it just masks the symptoms.

Its kinda like having a cold. You can take cough medicine, decongestants, Tylenol, etc to mask the symptoms... but you still have a cold.

If you are towing within your weight limits... ALL your weight limits... and the truck is properly set up with a weight distribution hitch, sway controller, brake controller set up right, you have adequate tires (LT, not P rated), the brakes on the trailer are properly adjusted, the axles/tires on the trailer are sufficient, the tongue weight is 12-15% then you will be FINE with a half ton. Yes, a 3/4 ton will probably tow it with more ease. So will a 1 ton, so will a class 5 truck or a class 8 truck.

The question, however, is WILL A HALF TON SAFELY PULL THESE LOADS? The answer is YES... if it is properly set up.

No different that a 3/4 ton can safely pull within its limits if properly set up. No different than a 1 ton, etc etc.

However, if the tow rig is not properly set up it is unsafe. Pulling with a heavier truck will mask the issues the majority of the time... but it is still unsafe.

I didn't twist your words, I didn't pull them out of context. I simply disagree with your blanket statement that a 3/4 ton truck is inherently safer as a tow vehicle than a half ton. I never said a relaxed driver is reckless. Quite the contrary. I am very relaxed when I tow... but I pay attention. A dumbass that is unaware he is a dumbass and pulling something that he isn't prepared to handle is reckless.

Sounds like you might have a guilty conscience...

Fast Mopar wrote:

brulaz wrote:
1) Heavier vehicles are safer than lighter ones. My insurance company charges me more insurance for the little Cruze than the F150 because of the increased possiblity of disability, etc.

Is that what your insurance company told you, or is that what you are assuming?
...
I disagree with the weight comment. It may be partially true, but it sounds too much like a blanket statement. There are many factors involved.

When asked, my insurance broker told me this. I vaguely remember reading other articles confirming it. But will not "risk" my life on its truth.:)

There are people overloading all of the weight classes. Those are the ones I am speaking of. I travel with about 7000 pounds with my heavy half. But that is below the maximums. About a 2000 lbs camper and 4000 lbs trailer. Besides being under maximums. I don't sag in the back and I don't sway going down the road. My truck and trailer both run level. Just sitting on the overloads enough that I don't get a jar if I hit a bump or pot hole.

I drive a Ford. But in my opinion the vehicles most likely to look bad going down the road are those such as the Ford Raptor with no equalizer hitch. Larger than stock tires or 4 feet in the air. Vehicles that are set up for dessert running seem to be the worst. And a lot of them are pulling 5th wheel toy haulers. I see them all the time going to Pismo.

I would imagine that all of you others with half tons would agree with me if you saw some of the vehicles I am speaking of.

Those of you on these boards know about and are concerned with safety. What worries me is those that think that they will only be towing a few times a year and really just don't care about weight limits. I say, sure you can easily lift a 100 lbs. But 101 lbs may herniate a disc. Stay below your limits.

Some are right in saying that a few hundred pounds over are okay. As long as you are level and in good condition I think you are right.

All of us who are concerned about safety and take care of their equipment should be together in denouncing the ones that don't. No matter what class they are driving.

My equipment is hooked up all the time. I will drive them to the store and around every week. I do it to make sure things are lubricated and batteries are charged up and ready to go anytime I need it. Even tough I only go a few times a year. I only park in places I can depart from easily and will not interfere with others going to the store.

I drive the speed limit of 55 mph. Not so much because its the speed limit here in California. But because I drive mainly 2 lane roads when I go camping. If I try to drive faster. It would be safe. But It wouldn't be safe for me to pass another vehicle going 53. And eventually I would catch up to someone like that. Why not relax. If some one wants to pass I don't hesitate to pull over.

Once I'm in the foothills. A 10 mph hairpin turn is the same for everyone. Not much safe passing being done by anyone. So for my own safety and others. I pull over as soon as possible for those that insist on passing.

I'm not one to get in a hurry. That's why I like my bathroom in back for traveling. :>)

CKNSLS wrote:

BurbMan wrote:

buddyIam wrote:
With commercial operations such as refineries, power plants and manufacturing plants, they use a different type of rating. Operation speed is always set below what total output could actually be. For instance, if a refinery is rated a 100 barrels/hour output. It would actually have the capability to put out more barrels/hour. The closer you get to your max rating, the greater the probability of failure. They reduce the rating because actually running at max would reduce the amount of time between maintenance, and increase the probability of failures.

I don't think any of us want to see a failure on the road. Both for safety and inconvenience reasons.

Same applies to trucks...it's all about Duty Cycle. I have no reason to doubt the manufacturers rating for a truck, whether it's a 150, 2500, 3500, etc...The question is how often? A 150 with EB is designed to be a fun to drive general purpose pickup...and the few times per year that the owner needs to tow heavy, it can deliver the mail. But if you were, say, a landscaping contractor, and you used the 150 to tow a 12000 lb landscaping trailer every day to jobsites, the 150 won't last as long as a 350 would.

This argument has been used as well and is not true IMHO either. I have towed my 5,500 pound travel trailer 8,000 miles in 8 months. A heavier "duty cycle" than most towing with a half-ton will ever see. The truck is a half-ton Crew Cab Silverado with the 5.3.The trailer is 29 feet long. I HAD ZERO ISSUES. Not even a flat tire.

There is a guy over at bobistheoilguy.com that runs a fleet of half-ton Silverados with few issues. So-I don't buy in to the "duty cycle" thing either. Both from first hand experience and from what I read over on the above mentioned website.

5500lbs for 8000 mi?
That's not getting into the duty cycle yet.
Yes the newer crop of 1/2 tons are Alot more capable as those from 15-20 years ago.
It's not even a fair comparison for hp, amenities and suspension/brakes.
You put a 1/2 ton thru its paces for years on end at max capacity and it will have more wear and tear than a HD doing the exact same work. I've had almost exclusively F150s for company work trucks for 20 years now and I can tell you that I can and do flatten out a set of rear leaf springs in 30-40kmi, every truck, every time. Also greater wear on other components. I've put mile for mile with other superintendents who don't work their trucks and the difference is noticeable.

Exactly my point Ben, when you're operating within the specs (weights) you're good to go! Thanks for validating it Ben.

Fordlover wrote:

bid_time wrote:
But you can load that airplane within it's maximum specs (takeoff weight) and safely get it in the air and flying.

If conditions are correct. I wouldn't want to try it say at Tenzing-Hillary Airport/LUA

There's always those pesky asterisks and fine print at the bottom...

But the pilot (driver) does take note of the weights...knowing that
the plane may fall out of the sky if over loaded...especially in adverse
weather conditions

I've been on puddle jumpers for business to remote towns (acquiring
IP and/or the company) where the pilot would get up while the engines
were warming up...he's move folks around 'that fat' guy...without saying
doing so due to 'that fat guy'...leveling the load (left to right and
front to back)

bid_time wrote:
But you can load that airplane within it's maximum specs (takeoff weight) and safely get it in the air and flying.

If conditions are correct. I wouldn't want to try it say at Tenzing-Hillary Airport/LUA

There's always those pesky asterisks and fine print at the bottom...

BurbMan wrote:

buddyIam wrote:
With commercial operations such as refineries, power plants and manufacturing plants, they use a different type of rating. Operation speed is always set below what total output could actually be. For instance, if a refinery is rated a 100 barrels/hour output. It would actually have the capability to put out more barrels/hour. The closer you get to your max rating, the greater the probability of failure. They reduce the rating because actually running at max would reduce the amount of time between maintenance, and increase the probability of failures.

I don't think any of us want to see a failure on the road. Both for safety and inconvenience reasons.

Same applies to trucks...it's all about Duty Cycle. I have no reason to doubt the manufacturers rating for a truck, whether it's a 150, 2500, 3500, etc...The question is how often? A 150 with EB is designed to be a fun to drive general purpose pickup...and the few times per year that the owner needs to tow heavy, it can deliver the mail. But if you were, say, a landscaping contractor, and you used the 150 to tow a 12000 lb landscaping trailer every day to jobsites, the 150 won't last as long as a 350 would.

This argument has been used as well and is not true IMHO either. I have towed my 5,500 pound travel trailer 8,000 miles in 8 months. A heavier "duty cycle" than most towing with a half-ton will ever see. The truck is a half-ton Crew Cab Silverado with the 5.3.The trailer is 29 feet long. I HAD ZERO ISSUES. Not even a flat tire.

There is a guy over at bobistheoilguy.com that runs a fleet of half-ton Silverados with few issues. So-I don't buy in to the "duty cycle" thing either. Both from first hand experience and from what I read over on the above mentioned website.