My camper has the Lippert electric stabilizer jacks where both rear jacks lower with the press of a single button. Pressure is not applied to the trailer until both rear jacks have made contact with the ground. The front jacks opperate the same way. Has anyone used the Bal lock arm stabilizer bars with these jacks. How well did it help to stabilize the camper?

Same idea as the JT Strongarms I have on mine. Best mod I ever did. They eliminated just about all the movement in my tt, even with the kids running around. The JTs look a little beefier though.

plasticmaster wrote:My camper has the Lippert electric stabilizer jacks where both rear jacks lower with the press of a single button. Pressure is not applied to the trailer until both rear jacks have made contact with the ground. The front jacks opperate the same way. Has anyone used the Bal lock arm stabilizer bars with these jacks. How well did it help to stabilize the camper?I have the Lippert jacks. The BAL Lock system will work with them as will the JTs.I will not use them on my TT though.The Lippert jacks with their equal pressure design makes it impossible to rack the frame.Installing a lock arm system would eliminate the Lipperts equal pressure system.Since I always boondock and my jack legs often are sitting on different soil densities, that Lippert feature appeals to me a great deal.If I camped in campgrounds with hard surface pads, I could see the advantage of the lock arm systems.

Would these Bal lock arm bars work better with my existing Lippert electric jacks or would they work better with manual scissor jacks? I ask this because I'm considering installing manual scissor jacks as well.

I put the BAL stabilizers on my TT with the same electric Lippert system you have. They didn't work at all (or very little). They worked great on my old TT with manual scissor jacks.The problem is the carriage underneath the trailer slides to do the self adjusting part. The BAL arms don't do anything to stop this, and this is what is causing the trailer to move. I am very disappointed in the Lippert self leveling electric system. It does it job in supporting the corners of the trailer, but does little to stop the side to side movement when you are walking around. The only way to solve this problem is to get the electric jack system that has a motor for each jack at each corner of the trailer.Here is a video of the carriage sliding, it moves whether the BAL arms are used or not. Lippert self leveling problem

tll wrote:I put the BAL stabilizers on my TT with the same electric Lippert system you have. They didn't work at all (or very little). They worked great on my old TT with manual scissor jacks.The problem is the carriage underneath the trailer slides to do the self adjusting part. The BAL arms don't do anything to stop this, and this is what is causing the trailer to move. I am very disappointed in the Lippert self leveling electric system. It does it job in supporting the corners of the trailer, but does little to stop the side to side movement when you are walking around. The only way to solve this problem is to get the electric jack system that has a motor for each jack at each corner of the trailer.Here is a video of the carriage sliding, it moves whether the BAL arms are used or not. Lippert self leveling problemThat video is a joke. The inside channel is rattling around loose inside the outer channel.The jacks are obviously not even close to being as tight as they should be.It was staged that way on purpose for some reason.Probably by the following video, which is of the Ultra Fab jacks... IOW, they have an agenda, which is selling their jacks. Pretty sad.But having owned an Ultra Fab TJ for about 20 minutes before it broke,,, I can understand why they stoop to underhanded fake tactics to sell their junk

Bal lock arm stabilizer bars? | Good Sam Community

plasticmaster
Explorer
Nov 06, 2017
Another update...In addition to the scissor jacks, I installed the Bal lock arm bars to the rear jacks. I also bought for around $40, two ratcheting cargo bars from Harbor Freight to instal between each front scissor jack diagonally up to the opposite frame. Also, my custom made X chocks between the wheels prevent front/back movement. These changes have helped tremendously. I'll have to decide if it's worth the effort to utilize all of them on short weekend trips, but I'll definitely utilize them on longer trips. Almost all shake is gone now after making these changes.

Here's a pic of my custom homemade X chocks. It's 4x4 wood pieces with a full threaded rod to cinch them together. Since I have the wide spread axles, I had to also use 2 turnbuckles to tighten them diagonally. This prevents the see-saw motion of the chocks if the wheels were to try to rotate. They work very well.
plasticmaster
Explorer
Oct 30, 2017
Update...I removed the electric jacks and installed the manual scissor jacks and, WOW, what a difference. The camper shakes much less now when someone comes up the steps. I'm still getting some movement, but nothing like before. I'll still be installing Bal lock arms on the rear jacks. That should help even more. I don't think I can put them side to side on the front with the shape of the camper frame near the front, but I'll have to see.
plasticmaster
Explorer
Oct 26, 2017
This has been an interesting discussion and I've learned a lot. Much thanks to those that contributed.
Huntindog
Explorer
Oct 26, 2017
plasticmaster wrote:
I've thought about this some more. Fuses blow and circuit breakers trip to prevent damage from occurring. Sometimes while hooked up to 30A, my wife will forget and turn on the hairdryer while the air conditioning is running. Within a few seconds, the breaker trips. I'm glad my camper has circuit breakers or else serious damage could occur. Why would I purposely push something to the point of tripping the circuit breaker every time I use it? That just doesn't sound good to me. From my own experience on my concrete driveway, I know that tightening for a couple seconds like in the Lippert manual leaves me a very unsteady camper. Tightening until the motor starts groaning and straining results in the same. I don't think any consumer should have to push a product until the breaker trips in order for it to work effectively. This is why I've ordered 4 manual scissor jacks and will be installing them soon. That's what I used on my previous camper for 8 years. I would hand crank them until they put just a slight pressure on the camper. They provided much more stability than these electric jacks do.

I agree that the CB method is not the best solution. A more elegant one would be to equip the jacks with clutches like many of the better TJs do.
Still the CB is a very effective method of accomplishing the same thing as clutches. As the motor works harder the amp draw goes up. When it reaches the point that the amps required are more than the CB can handle, it pops,, stopping the jack, just as a clutch equipped jack would. In fact one could put in a lower rated CB if they thought that their jacks were capable of more force than was desireable.. Going up in size, would be risky as something may be limiting it wiring, motor, etc.. Though I think that 6 amps is pretty low for the size wire mine have, and I think my CB may be larger than that, just because of how the generator ramps up during use.

At any rate, those are some expensive jacks, (500.00 each, new) so you can most likely make money on the swap.

As for Larry. He knows how I feel. But he thinks that I should have no problem with kneeling, crouching sitting on a low stool etc.

His body is not my body. I feel better when I stand next to the TT and push a switch.
LarryJM
Explorer II
Oct 26, 2017
plasticmaster wrote:
I've thought about this some more. Fuses blow and circuit breakers trip to prevent damage from occurring. Sometimes while hooked up to 30A, my wife will forget and turn on the hairdryer while the air conditioning is running. Within a few seconds, the breaker trips. I'm glad my camper has circuit breakers or else serious damage could occur. Why would I purposely push something to the point of tripping the circuit breaker every time I use it? That just doesn't sound good to me. From my own experience on my concrete driveway, I know that tightening for a couple seconds like in the Lippert manual leaves me a very unsteady camper. Tightening until the motor starts groaning and straining results in the same. I don't think any consumer should have to push a product until the breaker trips in order for it to work effectively. This is why I've ordered 4 manual scissor jacks and will be installing them soon. That's what I used on my previous camper for 8 years. I would hand crank them until they put just a slight pressure on the camper. They provided much more stability than these electric jacks do.

You"re learning, but not quite there yet IMO:B;)

below is a post I made several years ago and have successfully used it now on two trailers going back to 1981:

HEREare the jacks I purchased.

Jacks Method: The whole "SECRET" here is in the where and how you put and set these 4 jack stands. You might have to do a little experimenting based on the specifics of your trailer and it's living layout and who uses it. The first secret is to get the support much closer to the suspension points and I have found based on our 31'+ TT that about 4 to 6 ft in front and to the rear of each axle is a good target area. The second just as important step is in how you set these jack stands up. This is where that electric tongue jack is a life saver. You need to start with the trailer about 1" down by the tongue and put the rear jack stand in and "SNUG THEM UP" hand tight. Then you raise the tongue of the trailer about 2" "TONGUE HIGH" and put in the front jack stands and again "SNUG THEM UP" hand tight. Then you lower the tongue till all weight is off and then raise it again to just get a good pressure on it. Some will caution about "tweaking" the frame when putting pressure on these jack stands, but IMO that just is not an issue since we are only now talking about most support being across a span of between 8 and 12 ft and to the close to 30' if trying to support the entire span of the trailer on the existing stabilizer jacks. Also, you're not "LIFTING" the wheels off the ground you just need to get a real good upward force on the frame at those points. I actually measured the force when I dialed in my new system with my Sherline tongue scale and had around 400lbs of force on each jackstand. Now if once you find the best new locations for these jackstands you can remove and discard the old front jacks and depending on how well the overall stability is from movement in the rear of the trailer you might be able to also remove those rear stab jacks or if needed deploy them to just take out the "FRAME FLEX" component from that 10' or so span between your new rear jack stands and the actual rear of the trailer. As a consideration you might even store the removed jacks and put them back on when you get rid of the trailer so the next clueless owner won't feel he's not getting what is generally installed on trailers now days.

Before naysayer huntingdog chimes in about the garbage of having to crawl around, etc., etc. I have developed a procedure which avoids all this and has several side benefits such as a quite "potty stop" necessity to pull out the trailer steps and to work around your sewer connections and other things left to the believers to develop for themselves.

Note there have been a handfull of believers in this method and properly done all have endorsed it a one if not the best alternative to stabilizing longer trailers (i.e. those 30' and longer).

BTW I was in CW several days ago and saw an upgraded version of the above shown jackstands that look like they might even be a better alternative, but IIRC a set of 4 is close to $100. These look more like a traditional car jackstand and incorporate a screw portion for fine tuning and height adjustment along with a better footprint. However I'm still using the same ones for the last 36 years and they have never had an issue or required once ounce of maintenance.

Larry
plasticmaster
Explorer
Oct 26, 2017
I've thought about this some more. Fuses blow and circuit breakers trip to prevent damage from occurring. Sometimes while hooked up to 30A, my wife will forget and turn on the hairdryer while the air conditioning is running. Within a few seconds, the breaker trips. I'm glad my camper has circuit breakers or else serious damage could occur. Why would I purposely push something to the point of tripping the circuit breaker every time I use it? That just doesn't sound good to me. From my own experience on my concrete driveway, I know that tightening for a couple seconds like in the Lippert manual leaves me a very unsteady camper. Tightening until the motor starts groaning and straining results in the same. I don't think any consumer should have to push a product until the breaker trips in order for it to work effectively. This is why I've ordered 4 manual scissor jacks and will be installing them soon. That's what I used on my previous camper for 8 years. I would hand crank them until they put just a slight pressure on the camper. They provided much more stability than these electric jacks do.
Huntindog
Explorer
Oct 26, 2017
tll wrote:
So here is an excerpt from the Lippert manual, the method of running until the breaker trips certainly goes against what Lippert recommends.

"The Electric Stabilizer Jack should be extended until the footpads make contact with the ground. By keeping the switch depressed for another 1-2 seconds, the jack will set and be
ready for use. The Electric Stabilizer Jack should never be extended more than two seconds beyond initial
contact with the ground. The Electric Stabilizer Jack is used for stabilizing the coach, not leveling the coach.
In the event the system shuts off while trying to stabilize the coach, the 6A in-line automatic reset circuit
breaker has tripped and will reset within 10 seconds. This is an indication that the jack is not being used as
intended and is trying to support too much weight
'
Interesting. I have never seen a manual.
I run the front jacks first, then the rears. I do this after leveling, both side to side and front to rear. It always ends up level. I don't get anywhere close to 6 inches of lift. Probably because the front is so much heavier than the rear, and that doing it that way raises the front some, making it harder for the rear to raise so much.
I would never touch the TJ after tightening the rear jacks. That could seriously overload them. AS the TJ is capable of lifting the front of the TT completely. The PJs are not that strong.

I do not believe the CB is in the motor. Though I have never taken a motor apart. I think it is likely in the wiring some where. It resets really fast. Not 10 seconds. I also think it may be more than 6 amps. From the way my generator ramps up when using them.

Since this is a fairly new product, the manual may be wrong. It would not be the first time in the RV industry. Progressive has revised their EQUALIZER manual at least twice, and Reese has done the same for their Dual Cam hitch. And that was after a big discussion on this forum about the problems in setting it up according to the manual.

Another thought. when set on concrete, the jacks trip the CB pretty fast. When I am boondocking, it takes longer. It varies depending on how soft the ground is. Whether you go by the 1-2 second rule or not, it is obvious that the two scenarios load the jacks at different rates as the legs will sink into the ground at different rates, and not at all when on concrete.
The videos I have seen showing how loose he jacks are have not been taken on hard surfaces such as concrete or asphalt.. Does the manual not distinguish between different surface types? If not, then that is an obvious error.
tll
Explorer
Oct 26, 2017
So here is an excerpt from the Lippert manual, the method of running until the breaker trips certainly goes against what Lippert recommends.

"The Electric Stabilizer Jack should be extended until the footpads make contact with the ground. By keeping the switch depressed for another 1-2 seconds, the jack will set and be
ready for use. The Electric Stabilizer Jack should never be extended more than two seconds beyond initial
contact with the ground. The Electric Stabilizer Jack is used for stabilizing the coach, not leveling the coach.
In the event the system shuts off while trying to stabilize the coach, the 6A in-line automatic reset circuit
breaker has tripped and will reset within 10 seconds. This is an indication that the jack is not being used as
intended and is trying to support too much weight
'
tll
Explorer
Oct 26, 2017
Well it looks like I may have learned something here today. Compared to the manual jacks on my old trailer, I run the Lippert jacks much tighter. It appears that I may be able to go tighter yet. I have even run them until the motor bogs down a bit for the rear ones, and then raised the tongue jack to put more pressure on them. When I get the trailer out of storage next spring I will have to try the method of running them until the circuit breaker blows. Should make for some interesting leveling issues, as I can already lift the rear by a good 6+ inches. I will have to set the trailer pretty nose high and then raise the rear until level, hoping that level and circuit breaker tripping happen at the same time!

Is the circuit breaker located at the motor?
Huntindog
Explorer
Oct 26, 2017
jbjuices wrote:

Question on the Lippert system...on the back jacks, one side goes down first, hits the ground and then the other side goes down. It's brand new, so wondering if this should be fixed, or just how some systems work??

Hmm. Mine lower pretty much equal until one leg hits the ground, then the other leg goes twice as fast until it too hits the ground.

Something must be dragging on the slow side. It probably won't hurt anything, but I would get it looked at.

I recently read a report here, of someone who had a problem with his jacks and Lippert sent him brand new replacements.
IIRCC, it was a known issue with certain model years.

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