F350 payload dispute

Huntindog wrote:

GVWR SHOULD be what the manufacturer rates the vehicle based on it's lowest rated part. That can be an axle, the frame, tranny, any part of the brake system, u joints, or countless other things.
The manufacturer never states just what the limitation is.
With enough research, one may be able to get a pretty good idea, but can never be 100% sure. Only the manufacturer knows for sure.
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This is it. Just adding total weight ratings minus actual truck weight isn't accurate. The mechanical components bolted to the frames may be the reason for the 1000lbs. difference.

Torque, HP, and number of gears going up have increased carrying and towing capacities more than the improvements to axles and frames.

More in play than just a number on a scale.

I agree with the above. I would not buy a truck knowing I had to upgrade to tow what I want, but I have no problem upgrading a truck I already own for a job that may take it over OEM specifications. My F250 originally carried half a ton while towing six tons. After upgrading wheels and suspension, it carried two tons while towing four. I replaced this truck for a 5500 to carry three tons while still towing that four ton trailer.

I’ll keep it simple for the OP. New F350 diesel, right?
You can haul around 4000lbs until the tires/wheels ratings are maxed.
Shortly thereafter, the OE springs will be maxed out.
Put around 6000 in the bed and the rear axle will be close to its max rating.

You can pine over exact, to the pound, numbers ad nauseam, or know that you have a very capable truck and the guidlelines above are safe and within reason.

Wadcutter wrote:

Bionic Man wrote:

Wadcutter wrote:
Manufacturers do not make the law. Legislatures make the law. The sticker doesn't mean anything about what is legal to haul. It's like the tag on your mattress. It tells you what the vehicle is about.
I taught truck and vehicle law for over 20 years and was recognized by the courts in truck weights. I didn't get my knowledge by listening to some fat guy around a campfire like a lot of the 'experts' on this forum.

I have no doubt that in a state like Illinois, the sticker on the door may carry legal weight. I can tell you without a doubt, that they don't everywhere.

Then post the law that proves your point. I taught truck weight laws for several state and worked several states and with the feds, including Colorado. Provide the cite to prove your statement. Any state will do.
Simple fact, in every state, manufacturers do not make the weight laws. Those are set by state statutes.
Then tell us what Holiday Inn you stayed at or the campfires where you told the stories.

I may have asked you this before, but we’re you the “dot” specialist cop in Hainesville, IL back in the day?

My advice i empirical both in careers & hands on, plus college and common sense are my qualifications...toss in older than most on this/these forums (70 next year). For here, my first career in Industrial Controls, Robotics, Process Controls, Factory Automation and military stuff. No automotive, but people movers

Gotta add first...decide if you believe in all of the OEM's 'ratings', 'specifications', etc. If not, then academic this thread. If yes, then research and bone up on 'your' OEM's specifications, ratings, limits, etc...plus your states rules of the road and the states you plan on driving to and through

Another point is that all things designed, engineered, etc are not for the good days out there...but for the day Mr Murphy crosses your path (and it is NOT always the 'other guy' that he touches).

Either you have the right sized stuff and adjusted correctly spot on or NOT. No time to go back to the store for bigger/better/etc, nor re-adjust

That is to 'manhandle' the situation enough to regain control or maintain control of the situation. Otherwise just along for the ride

There are: 'can do it', 'should do it'....to 'rated for it' via the OEM's specifications, which is basically their CYA for their liability of their product...AKA...their contract to you, the owner/driver. The only person responsible for the setup is the driver...even if they did NOT choose the components that makes up that setup. Nor any of us advisors on these freebie forums. We have no skin in 'your' game...now is there any liability to us.

A think can be designed to be safe in all situations, but then it would not be affordable to civilians. Heck even military stuff has their specification limits too, but way more than a similar civilian version.

Confusion on most and on this have to make this point clear, as many do NOT understand corporate parts bin design & choice of components & systems.

As you go up in class TV's, the volumes diminish greatly. So to have specific, say rear axle assemblies, for everything above the lowest class, half ton, would be cost prohibitive or too costly.

Why many/most "3/4 ton" and "1 ton" TV's has same/similar rear axle assemblies from their suppliers (another OEM) and the TV OEM adds 'stuff'...like brakes (backing plates, calipers, etc)...but the base axle assembly is the same between them. That is where I think most of the confusion and conspiracy theories arise from...and it is based on a bit of truth because of the "corporate parts bin" methodology

This goes with tranny's, frame's, suspension part's/system's, etc

Then the fact that most TV OEM's use the exact same basis sheetmetal cab/body/bed/etc from the lowest class up to most of the higher classes. So they 'look' the same with no difference to many...too many

Most seasoned owners of TV's who actually use their TV's as 'trucks' for either work or towing/hauling heavy...knows more than the average salesperson. Why for trucks, I'll mainly go to a broker for semi's and/or commercial trucks. They actually know much more to IMHO, experts

The new yellow label is a step better, but am still of the opinion to actually go out and weigh your setup. Both empty and fully loaded. Otherwise you really don't know where you are in reference to 'your' setup's ratings

IMHO, go with this generic formula using actual weights: GCWR >/= TV + Trailer + stuff (hitch, people, pets, cargo, after market, etc, etc, etc)


Finally...an oddity to me...folks want to push their limits, advise others to do so because they have been doing that for years with no problems...but then when it comes to a used vehicle...miles matter and always looking for abuse or lack of maintenance... Well if the previous owner pushed the limits and beyond, even low mileage can be risky...to if they didn't and stayed below the limits...a higher mileage TV would be fine... Baffling that to me...


Go out and actually weigh your setup, fully loaded and empty, axle by axle...

bighog01 wrote:
New F350 SRW that I'm considering says 3326 lbs on the payload sticker with a 11500 GVWR. I asked for this info before the dealer had it brought in from another dealer. Salesperson and fleet manager say that its actually 4164 lbs because the factory invoice says the trucks shipping weight is 7336 lbs. Now I'm sure that's weighed with minimal diesel I. The tank. Isn't the door sticker the law? I always thought so. I'm not obligated to buy this truck and I have no deposit on it. Right now I'm not feeling comfortable hitching my Fuzion to it.

It's very simple: Your legal load limit is whatever you paid for when registering your truck in many states.

They will usually let you register it for any amount you want, from the truck's curb weight through the sum of the axle ratings, if not beyond.

I don't know if this helps out or not, but Florida goes by your GVWR or what you declare it to be. I found this out a few years ago. If you go to our tag agency then u can declare a different GVWR but they will ask questions all day about it. Some people down here declare lower just to get a cheaper rate on there tag. Again don't know if this helps or complicates the conversation just my experience.

Wadcutter wrote:

Then post the law that proves your point. I taught truck weight laws for several state and worked several states and with the feds, including Colorado. Provide the cite to prove your statement. Any state will do.
Simple fact, in every state, manufacturers do not make the weight laws. Those are set by state statutes.
Then tell us what Holiday Inn you stayed at or the campfires where you told the stories.

I guess some people think that each state has some super secret database with the GVWR's and load ratings of every vehicle and tire ever made so that they can enforce the manufacturer's ratings.

The law enforces the weight that is on the registration, not the weight that is on the door. Not sure why that is so hard for some to understand.

4x4ord wrote:
I said earlier that I would feel comfortable hauling a 4000 lb pin. Although this is true, I wouldn't be buying a SRW truck to pull an rv with a 4000 lb pin weight. My trailer only has a pin weight of 2400 lbs. I would be sticking with a SRW up to a 3000 lb pin and at over 3500 lbs I would be shopping for a dually.

I agree with those weights. I am comfortable with 3,000 in my SRW 2500 all day long. I think 3,000-3,500 is fine every now and then for short distances. Anything more than that and I would be shopping for a DRW.

I said earlier that I would feel comfortable hauling a 4000 lb pin. Although this is true, I wouldn't be buying a SRW truck to pull an rv with a 4000 lb pin weight. My trailer only has a pin weight of 2400 lbs. I would be sticking with a SRW up to a 3000 lb pin and at over 3500 lbs I would be shopping for a dually.