First TT for Drycamping

It is really hard to find a nice boondocking TT. I have a 34' Avion and it is just way to large to get back where we want to camp. My wife gave me a choice, fix our old Avion C-11 camper or buy her an Airstream Bambi. I looked at the Airstream and it is nice, but it won't do the kind of boondocking that I wanted to do, especially since it held only 23 gallons of fresh water and less than 500# after it was wet. Since I couldn't find anything to fit my needs, I decided to put the C-11 on a trailer.

My specs, or wish list were:

Under 20' in length,
80 gallons of fresh water minimum,
100# of propane,
20 gallons of gasoline,
2 batteries minimum, I now can take 7 batteries,
Minimum of 1000# capacity after wet, mine will carry 1500#,
Capacity to take an extra quad,

After doing some extensive camping, the only thing that I need to do, besides mounting the TorkLift Power Max box (capacity of 5 more batteries), is to set it up for an outside shower. All this will require is a Camp Chef hot water heater hooked up to another LP tee, and an outside shower tent. I already have an external water pump with hose bibs.

Except for the extra quad, I would think that someone makes something close in specs. Boondocking RVs seem to be somewhat rare here in the US.

I am really intrigued by the possibility of using solar energy to recharge our batteries. I realize that camping in Michigan won't always offer the most sunlight but if the panel(s) are movable I'd think you may be able to capture enough sunlight.

We go on a fly-in fishing trip to Ontario every year and they have installed solar panels in their bush cabins. They just use one deep-cycle 12-volt battery and always provide enough power run the CFL lights for a couple hours in the evening plus recharge small electronics (GPS, camera batteries, etc.)

I'm assuming that the water pump would be the main energy usage in a travel trailer(?) Any idea how long a deep-cycle battery might last with conservative water usage? Are there other power-users I'm not yet aware of?

Right now, a *long* trip for us would be 9-10 days. Due to work schedules we more commonly camp 3-4 days at a time.

I have little to offer in terms of advice, but will be following this thread with interest since we are in the market for a trailer of roughly the same size, though we may need to go up to about 24 feet before it's all said and done. We did some hard shopping yesterday, seems that at our size point most of the fresh tanks are around 27 gal, with a few models having 40 gallons.

Most of our camping is sort of a midway between true boondocking and campground facilities. We tend to camp at events where sometimes there is power (for a charge), but almost never any water or sewer hookups. We typically only camp for a weekend, 3-4 days max. When we had the old Bounder, it had a 60 gal fresh water tank, but for most trips I only filled it half full (OK, mostly because I was afraid the tank might fall off onto the highway, but point stands: two adults got on just fine on 30 gallons of water for a long weekend)

Someone posted a web guide to dump stations earlier, use that to help plan. Just about any private campground you would pass on your route will let you dump for a small fee. Another source we have used a lot are some of the bigger RV dealerships have dump stations. Some free, some a small charge.

One holding tank tip is to divert gray water from showers, dish-washing, and such into the black tank. You typically don't use anywhere near as much capacity in the black, and the extra water helps at dump time. We keep a small bucket in the shower to catch as much shower run-off as possible, especially those first couple of minutes when the water is getting up to temperature. Then the bucket is poured into the toilet. After washing dishes, the dishpan is also emptied into the toilet. Saves space in the gray tank, and puts soapy water in the black.

The largest power usage on a typical boondocking TT will be the furnace fan in the winter time. The pump doesn't use much power because you aren't using it that much. Obviously, I'm not including things like AC, television, microwave, etc. I can go two days with the furnace running most of the night, on one deep cycle battery. In the summer, I run a Yamaha 1000 watt generator to run my AC for about 6-7 hours which also charges the batteries and lets me charge phones, watch telvision etc. if I want to. If I didn't need the AC or the furnace, I could easily get by with two batteries for close to a week without any issues. Keep in mind, all of my lights are LEDs.
The biggest learning curve that I had was that I need a shower tent and outside shower water heater (like a Camp Chef) and then all will be great. This way I won't fill the gray water tank and I don't need to shower in the cramped wet bath. We were able to get by for over two weeks this summer, but 3 days had power in a campground and many days were were pulling the trailer. I never refilled the 80 gallons of water over these two weeks and I never filled up the black water tank. I did dump it once in the middle of the trip and once near the end.

Chezmoose, all of your questions are good ones -- and there are lots of answers! Over on the Boondocking and Dry Camping forum, there are discussions about fresh water, about batteries, about lighting, about dealing with gray and black water, and so forth.

If you want to get way back into the woods, a truck camper is the best option -- but it is too cramped for me. So we have opted for a little trailer. My advice is to get the smallest trailer you can stand to be in (and can stand up in). I really like the Casita and the Scamp, but most models do not have enough headroom for me.

The other issue is ground clearance -- not every trailer can be modified with an "axle flip." Trailers with torsion bar suspensions can be raised, but not a whole lot. Clearance is important on rocky roads. (But even if you have a lot of clearance, take it real slow to avoid damage.)

You want a good match between your tow vehicle and your trailer -- a trailer that is too long or too heavy will wag the dog. Coming from a PUP, you will notice a steep decline in mpg. There is no cure for that -- even a small TT creates a lot of air drag.

Be sure to take it slowly, one step at a time. Boondocking is tremendously rewarding, but there is a learning curve. Start small -- a couple of nights. Monitor battery usage. Measure water usage. None of this is rocket science.

In terms of which rig to buy, there are a lot to choose from. This is our second Fun Finder, and we are happy with it, but some other folks have had quality control issues. (There are two Fun Finder forums or clubs online -- almost every make has its own user group, somewhere.) Lance now makes a new line of small trailers -- that firm has a great reputation for building strong truck campers, so I have hopes for their trailers!

Most crucially, keep asking questions!

It sounds like are camping styles are somewhat similar. Most of my camping is in national forests and I opted for a 16’ to get as far back in as possible. And I graduated from a PU, too. Coming from a PU I imagine you’re pretty frugal with your lights and water.

My thoughts would be stick with your sub 20’ idea if you want to get well off the beaten path. The biggest tanks you can get, LED lights, and as much ground clearance as possible would all be advantageous, too. Also two true deep cycle batteries. I use one group 27 marine battery and can manage to get the best part of a week out of it. Generators are an option, but I like to camp in natural setting and motors running seem out of place there. So I don’t have one. I camp in the forest so solar isn’t a good option for me or I’d have it. If you have the option of open meadows it might work for you, though.

I carry extra water in 5 gallon cans if I’m boondocking and just refill as needed. In a cg with water I just fill there and carry it back to the TT and refill. It’s just a matter of having something to funnel the water in the fresh water tank, basically a two person job with one holding the funnel. As far as dumping goes, just pay attention to what’s in the area you’re camping in and you’re almost sure to find a dump site. You may have to pay a small fee, but I don’t recall ever having to do that.

RV Dump Station Finders:
http://www.rvdumps.com/dumpstations/

and http://www.rvdumpstations.info/

One problem I have found is in what people mean when using the terms, "dry camping" and "boondocking".

Many seem to use them interchangeably. Others use boondocking to mean out in the boonies away from people as in "dispersed" camping in nat'l forests. And dry camping as just camping anywhere, state park or any park, without hookups of any kind.

If dry camping in nat'l forest or nat'l parks (as well as BLM or COE) campground, normally will have water close by, or at least they often do. As well as having a dumpsite close by. Not always but often.

When we have boondocked in the past, there was often water not far at a forest campground, etc.

Dry camping while traveling (more like dry overnighting), we have found water at service stations, welcome centers, Walmat/K-mart stores (garden centers), many other places.

Some town have dumpsites. Some service stations. Some rest areas (not in NM anymore).

To extend battery charge, Solar is pretty good. My son has two large panels on his TC in Alaska. We have a small one which helps. We both use Honda generators to keep them topped off as well.

Showering can take battery down. My CPAP machine does a job on it. May have to get a second battery to go with the single we have on the trailer. There is room on the tongue where the battery is. But haven't yet. Just run the generator a little, doesn't take too long each day.

Other folks are dead set against any generator use a all. Depends on your philosophy on generators.

If going to take rough backcountry roads, will take a different set up as compared to using small campground with small sites but easy to drive to them.

:EIt is always good to be able to get a vehicle and/or trailer out as well as into an place.

There may be exceptions, but the smaller a unit is, the smaller its holding tanks will be.

That is why we have a larger freshwater holding tank in our pickup.
Extra Water & How to Transfer It. an old post.

My son's Lance TC has a pretty large fresh water tank, but he also carries an auxiliary tank (can't member what size), which can be seen in this photo below:

It is on the ground here (empty). Carries it empty, then goes to get water when needed.

We have a Fun Finder 210WBS that we like very much. I think the floor plan is practically perfect for a couple. We too boondock often and have found this camper to be very good. As to battery life: we initially had problems using a typical 75 AmpHour deep cycle battery. It would last only about 3 days even if we used no lights, radio, or water pump. Basically we just used the battery for the refrigerator control board (gas for actual cooling) and the CO/Propane sensor. It turns out the refrigerator was drawing significant power continously for a heater in the door frame to prevent condensation. Some refrigerators have a switch to turn this heater off; ours did not so I installed my own switch. With this heater off the battery lasted 7-8 days! If we use the radio occasionally and even the water pump we can still get about 6 days out of the battery, and there was no condensation problem around the refrigerator door.. We avoid using the campers lights using a couple of LED lanterns instead. I plan to upgrade the camper's lights with LED bulbs which should enable us to use them without reducing battery life very much.

Once you start boondocking you will learn a lot .
We can come home from 4 different directions .
We have learned where the dump stations are enroute home from each .
We rarely pay to dump.
If you are buying a new trailer the battery(s) are actually a line item option .
Choose no battery and go buy TWO 6 Volt GC-2 golf cart batteries from costco .
If your tow rig only has one battery look to see if there is a space where the auxilliary battery tray should be . In a Chevy pickup/Sub/Avy that would be on the passenger side just behind the air filter .
If you can only have one battery in the TV then replace the batt with an Exide Edge AGM or Optima AGM. They will stand up to more abuse if run down .
Always leave home with your RV batteries fully charged from a 120V source for 24 hours .
If you spend money on good 12V batteries you can save money on the amount of solar or eliminate it . Once again Heavy Duty jumper cables .
We mount the headband LED lights from costco on our caps at night . The light is always shining right where we are working . AAA batteries . We use the little LED lantern too .
I own 3 solar showers . We have stopped using them . Even boondocking we take a brief shower in the trailer . We get a better shower and we just refill the fresh water a little more often . The 12V does not suffer much .
We carry a little 400 watt inverter to get 120V that clamps on to the tow vehicle battery . These have a parasitic draw so it is only hooked up when we need it . It is used only to recharge the Nook reader , electric shaver , sometimes a laptop .
If you spend some time at the hardware store you can figure how to make a garden hose fitting for your 5 gallon jugs . ProfDan139 uses a broomstick with a hook on it to hold the watercan above the RV fill . Smart dudes , them professor fellas !
The refer is the item most critical to 12V voltage drop . When the refer computer does not have enough volts it shuts off the propane . Watch the refer and you will know when you have run the batteries too long .
Boondocking is by far the best camping we do . We have created a circle of friends that prefer this also .
No genny , no TV , no dagnab text messages , no cell phones .
Just great camping along the stream or lake with no fees or camp hosts .

DesertHawk mentioned a Scamp - there are a number of fiberglass trailers in the 18' - 20' range including 5th wheels available from a number of manufacturers. I have an Escape 17B with high lift axle that can go just about anywhere my tow vehicle can pull it. Escape Trailer Industries makes a 15', 17', 19', and 21' as well as a 20.5' 5th wheel.

Again, there are many manufacturers of lightweight fiberglass trailers. Because of the construction methods, most fiberglass trailers will hold up to rough roads better than stick built trailers. They are also usually lighter, and more aerodynamic, providing better gas mileage.

I have links to blogs by owners, manufacturers and other information at my Fiberglass Trailer Page.