Ford 2.7 Ecoboost - power question

tragusa3 wrote:

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And yes, I would agree that the weakest link on the truck was downhill. It did it, but I had to stay especially aware of my speed. Many passes, I had to stay in first at 30mph downhill. That being said, I never had brake fade or smelled them. Maybe I could have gone faster and used more brake? nah, I rather be safe.

X2

I tried coming down NewFound Gap in the Smokies in Second gear and could definitely smell the brakes. First gear at thirty mph would have been better but, boy, the high rpm roar just freaked me out, even though it was below red line.

We're just not used to high rpms in this engine as the torque peak is so low (~2500 rpm). After hearing your report and others, I'll ignore the noise next time and try First gear at 30mph.

But another gear between First and Second would help ... understand Ford is working on new gear box with more gears.

As for longevity, I don't expect this engine block to last as many miles as a diesel without a rebuild. But other components (turbos, etc) should last as long, and unless you're putting on many, many miles per year, block longevity is not really an issue.

Sport45 wrote:
Yes, torque does the work. Horsepower measures how fast the torque is applied. A high torque engine without an appreciable amount of horsepower is just as much of a dog towing as a low horsepower / low torque engine. By itself, torque tells you very little about how an engine will perform.

You need to look up the definition of WORK. Torque does no work unless it moves something then that is the definition of work which is measured in horsepower and not torque.

Yes, torque does the work. Horsepower measures how fast the torque is applied. A high torque engine without an appreciable amount of horsepower is just as much of a dog towing as a low horsepower / low torque engine. By itself, torque tells you very little about how an engine will perform.

valhalla360 - thanks for the simple answer. Be careful you are suggesting "torque" does the work... and HP is the measure of it...

So it "sounds like" a guy needs to look at HP numbers and what RPM vs available ratios - and decide what rpm in what conditions he wants to listen to.

That's simple. You run the 375lb-ft engine thru a gear ratio so the torque at the wheels matchs the torque from the 600lb-ft engine.

To keep the speed the same, you run the 375lb-ft engine at higher RPM. If you think about it, most of the diesels top out in terms of HP around 2000rpm. The gas engine is likely around 3500rpm. So run in a lower gear at higher rpm and you get the same HP and torque at the wheels.

Think of it this way, if you can't break a nut free when working on your engine with a standard wrench, you can double the torque by adding a cheater bar but to unscrew the bolt you would have to move the end of the cheater twice as fast to remove unscrew the bolt at the same speed (a nut is a bit different in the sense that torque requirements drop drastically once you break it free)

As fast as possible to the top of a short hill while caning the hapless pickup engine (cue rock geetars) is very low priority.

I was hoping for someone to show the math how a 375lbs-ft torque engine can pull a grade or buck a headwind at the same sustained speed with the same weight etc. as a 600lbs-ft torque engine, based on identical maximum 325hp numbers.

My experiences with heavy duty trucks is higher torque is generally "better" in most situations, but that is a much more standardized vehicle segment - engines are rated the same way by SAE etc. and vehicle size and weights on the road are often nearly identical... so which engine will pull better becomes clear quite easily. In the wind and on the uphill it is the higher torque engine. Accelerating as the road levels out or from a standing start it is the higher HP engine. Those engines do not have 4500 rpm operating ranges to post "big numbers" at rpms that aren't efficient. So the playing field is quite level.

The pickup truck world seems a little more touchy when you question power and performance claims. :)

Sorry if I offended anyone.

I propose a forum term called Towing. It's when someone tries to tow the discussion back on topic :) vs Trolling...

Here is some dyno test data for Ecoboost 3.5L and a V8 non Ecoboost gas...Clicky

Quite a complicated matter to get all the controls and settings to behave themselves and cough up the information :). But good information.

If "someone" were to take a smooth running V10 of say, 7L displacement, (or say 6.8?) and make it an "Ecoboost" and give it power characteristics of 2X the 3.5L, and move the peak torque down to Only 700lb-ft at 2000 rpm, and limit the rpm/peak HP to "only" 550HP or so, that would be a nice RV puller for heavy RV trailers...

and deliver nice mileage empty...

Thank you for posting that Taco.

If your only criteria is how fast you can go up a hill then you are absolutely correct that HP is the number to look at.

It really sounds like you started a trollish post and didn't find the responses you were looking for. Like the lawyers say, never ask a question you don't know the answer to.

Sounds like when I shop for the next tow vehicle alls a guy needs to look for is HP number.

Ok, I dug up some of these videos. Some of these are from the 2012 some from 2014 some tuned some not.

At the 2012 one on link 2 there is a 6.2 that ran 48 mph at the top the 6.7 powerstroke ran 50 mph the same day. I think the ecoboost was ran a different day and it also ran about 50 mph but the trailer may have been a slightly different weight since they fill it with gravel each time so it has a slightly different amount.

The ecoboost and 6.2 gassers are faster than stock 7.3, 6.0 and 6.4 powerstrokes and barely slower than the 6.7 powerstroke. I guess horsepower does mean a little more than torque.



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