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Sliding-into-ho's avatar
Sliding-into-ho
Explorer
Nov 30, 2018

Not sure upper stableloads are right for me (UPDATED)

(UPDATE 10/23/2019 here: http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/29794168/gotomsg/29988533.cfm#29988533 Safe to say the upper stableloads were NOT causing any issues that I didn't have already, but the stock shocks very likely were. Upgrades continue! Big thanks to the massive wealth of knowledge on this board. In the first page of responses alone, pretty much all the relevant considerations were addressed. You Rock! Thanks also to Torklift who reached out and went the extra mile to help me get dialed in.)

Rig: 2017 F350, SRW, FX4.
Tire sticker 3243lb
Rear GAWR: 7230lb
TC: NL 9-6, 2600 Dry, 2900 Wet

The only suspension mod the dealer installed is upper stable loads. I wanted the lowers, but they said they don't install them because they don't want to deal with the drilling.

I've never hauled a TC before, but plenty of heavy trailers. The stable loads don't feel quite right. If you've ever ridden in a New York taxi cab in the 80's or 90's (you know... the Ford Tauruses and Lincoln Town Cars with shot suspensions), that's sort of the sensation: floaty, bouncy, vague, disconnected.

I wouldn't say there's a lot of sway in terms of magnitude of movement, but when it does sway, it bounces back and forth from side to side.

My hunch is simple: my rig may not be quite heavy enough to warrant full size stable loads, which engage too much of the upper overload spring (lower spring rate) and not enough of the higher spring-rate lower overload. I suspect this is why Torklift unequivocally recommends lower stable loads first. But to be clear, I don't have any experience with this and these are just guesses.

The rear fender is 1-2 inches higher than the front fender, depending on the load, for what it's worth.

Here are a few things that I would try next, but if you feel like you know a more ideal solution, please let me know:

1. Remove stable loads and get a baseline for how the truck handles fully stock. After all, I'm under my door sticker weight (I've removed a propane tank and the heavy rear patio).

2. Shave an inch or two off the stable load blocks

3. Uninstall stable loads and, assuming too much sag/roll, upgrade shocks to rancho adjustable and add Hellwig Big Wig.

4. Last option would be air bags, which would probably only need minimal inflation.

Thanks in advance for any thoughts!
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  • Bedlam's avatar
    Bedlam
    Moderator
    Nov 30, 2018
    You want the StableLoad pads to engage the upper spring with the camper loaded. This is what gives you additional stability and less sag. If your camper is so light, that the upper overload spring has no deflection, you actually need a taller pad than your current StableLoad. The lower StableLoad wedges will do less for sag but will engage the main spring pack earlier giving you less sway (this may be why you see some references to installing this product first).

  • Sliding-into-ho's avatar
    Sliding-into-ho
    Explorer
    Nov 30, 2018
    Also, since I'm almost certainly going to do the Ranchos, which model number do I want? I see multiple options that will fit my truck.
  • Sliding-into-ho's avatar
    Sliding-into-ho
    Explorer
    Nov 30, 2018
    A few questions, what air pressure are you running?


    55 front and 72 rear (cold). I was thinking about inflating to 65/80.

    Are you sure the fastguns if you have them are adjusted right?
    Only thing I know about adjusting fastguns is what the tech at the dealer told me during delivery. Tight enough to just barely require 2 hands to close, and always on the hook that's farthest away. Closing the front ones, I can visually see the cabover drop about a an eighth of an inch as it cinches down on the bed mat. That sound right?

    @Sbryan, You don't have issues with stable loads only, or with stable loads plus all the other stuff you've upgraded? I would guess if I added all that other stuff, things would be better

    @Cheftim, yes, I could see the Rancho upgrade being just the ticket. Cheap and easy to install, so I think that's my next move.

    A few other random thoughts:

    1. For those with previous generation F-350s, and I'm not sure if it matters, but the 2017+ unloaded suspension is much more compliant than the previous generation. All that to say, what worked for a 2015 might not work exactly the same for a 2017+.

    2. I wonder what would happen if I filled up my fresh tank? Low COG, toward the front of the bed. Might help things feel more grounded and stable?

    3. with respect to weights, I haven't driven the TC over the scale yet, but from I understand, Northern-Lite is pretty dead-on when it comes to their closet stickers. My closet sticker was 2655 before I removed 100lbs of bumper/patio. Big difference between that an a loaded 'anything' with a slide.

    4. with respect to stock suspension/FX4, I realize it's 2" higher in the back, but I was under the impression that payload carrying trucks had this rake angle in anticipation for heavy loads in the bed, and would ideally return to level once fully loaded. In other words, with a full payload, I'm guessing a 2 inch rake is not ideal, and that it would handle better if level. But before I worry too much about that, I need to fully load the camper and make sure I'm on perfectly level ground. Then I'll measure again and things might be much closer.

    THANK YOU so much, all. Such a responsive and generous group here!
  • cheftim's avatar
    cheftim
    Explorer
    Nov 30, 2018
    I have 2017 F-350 XLT with AF-990. Upper SLs, Firestone air-bags, Ranchos.

    When camper goes on, upper SLs engaged a bit. Small amount of air in the bags brings back to level. Shocks on 7-9. Rides like a champ. Tires are usually 80 psi rear 70 psi front.

    Waited at first on the Ranchos. After a few rides I installed and they took the taxi ride out for me.

    Hope that helps.
  • Bedlam's avatar
    Bedlam
    Moderator
    Nov 30, 2018
    If you do not have an OEM stabiliizer bar already, get the Hellwig BigWig. I ran upper and lower StableLoads for a 4000 LB camper.
  • sbryan's avatar
    sbryan
    Explorer II
    Nov 30, 2018
    I have a similar setup with a heavier TC (3,600 wet) and have just the upper stable loads and don't have the issues you describe. The truck should be similar (mine is a CCLB F350 diesel, 2013).

    Here what I did to accommodate the camper and achieve a comfortable handling truck:

    Upper stable loads
    Sumo springs
    Upgraded all shocks to Bilsteins
    Added a sway bar (Fords OEM) which wasn't an option when I ordered the truck
    Upgraded from the crappy Michelins to Nokian Rotiiva AT Plus tires rated to 3,750 pounds.
    I have Fastguns and Talon frame mounts.

    Does the truck feel different with the camper on? Of course, but after 20,000+ miles I am very comfortable with the way it handles. It did take a little getting used to (I clearly remember the first trips locally where I was still nervous about the whole set up). But today I am accustomed to the feel of the rig on and off road. The truck rides like a brick empty but that's the price of preparing for the load I put on her. I am about 800 pounds over my GVWR but under both front a rear axle ratings. Some would say I am over the GVWR and therefore unsafe. Everyone has an opinion - I am very happy with my choice.
  • emcvay's avatar
    emcvay
    Explorer III
    Nov 30, 2018
    Something is amiss I think.

    I have a 2010 F350 SRW XLT PS CC LB and find the uppers are very good and I don't really need the lowers. Engaging the uppers brings in a heavy overload spring as soon as the camper is on the truck and I could do away with the air bags (though I do use them with about 20psi in them but still am not sure I need to. I've had them as low as 10 and as high as 30psi and still can't see the difference).

    I can engage the lower stable loads but the lowers engage with the AF990 on anyway so really it's just keeping them engaged during spring travel over bumps etc.

    The sway and rock have more to do with the shocks not handling the heavy weight so I added Rancho 9000's (adjustable)and it's a BIG improvement. I also added the Hellwig BigWig rear swaybar which helped even more. Now I'm very happy.

    If it were me, in order of what I think made the most difference this is what I think would be worth doing:

    1. Make sure tires are up to the job
    2. Upper Stable Loads
    3. Heavy Duty adjustable shocks
    4. Heavy rear sway bar
    5. Lower Stable Loads
    6. Air Bags -- mostly for towing so you can keep the truck level or when you need to level with a heavy camper.

    Your rear end on an F350 is set by the factory 2" higher than the front. This is normal.


    Here I am with a camper that is 1000lbs heavier (or perhaps 1500 if your weights are scale weights and accurate -- don't go by what the Manufacturer tells you)
  • jimh406's avatar
    jimh406
    Explorer III
    Nov 30, 2018
    I doubt the bouncing is from the Stableloads. Airbags will disengage the overloads which is the opposite of what you want.

    A few questions, what air pressure are you running? I suggest 80 rear and probably 70-75 front. In spite of people saying their rigs handle great, it’s going to feel different than what you are used to. Are you sure the fastguns if you have them are adjusted right?

    BTW, I wouldn’t remove a propane tank. It’s not going to be fun to be out of propane on the mtn. I doubt the propane tank is going to change the handle significantly. But, it will stink to not be able to have the fridge, stove, heat.

    FWIW, don’t remove extra batteries either if you have two.

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