part three of the broken frame saga.

JimK-NY wrote:
This whole topic moves beyond my understanding and preferences.

To me a truck camper is about ease of use, mobility including being able to go into the backcountry. I got a relatively large truck camper so my wife and I along with 2 cats could live in it full time. My TC has no slides but is 9.5' and hits 4000# loaded for full time use. IMO, my TC is already pushing the limits. With a 12000# total weight, it is not going very far in the backcountry. No rutted dirt roads, no soft ground, no narrow trails with overhangs.

When much more is desired or needed, it seems that it is time to switch to a 5th wheeler or trailer. At least you can drag it to semi remote areas, unhook and have a truck to explore in. I just cannot imagine trying to deal with the size, weight and limitations of a truck camper weighing 6000, 7000 or even 8000# or more.

So, good for you. Since you don’t prefer a big ole whopper TC on a big truck, you are effectively in a different class of RV. What you just said was akin to saying “I don’t know why people buy those silly 5th wheels. I like little truck campers.” Apples and oranges.

jimh406 wrote:

valhalla360 wrote:
But once you need a 450 or better and have $200k tied up between truck and camper...are you really going to take it into the real back country off roading? At that point, there are other options that will work better.

Fwiw, you don't have to spend $200K unless you want top of the line new for everything. My 9 1/2 ft TC was 8 1/2 years old when I bought my used F450, for instance. I carried it on a F350 SRW for its first 8 1/2 years. In any case, I get that buying something different might be less expensive. Also, a F450 or F350 DRW is not significantly more than a F350 SRW.

I'm not sure what you are thinking is offload. My truck/tc has been on gravel/dirt roads and forest service roads. The real off-road trailers that I've seen that look durable aren't cheap either.

I still have the option to tow, and fit in a single parking space for the most part. I also can take the TC off and use it as a truck. No vehicle with TT can also tow and fit in a parking space. Of course, a TC can also turnaround where almost no TT and vehicle could.

For "real" off-road, I think you are moving into SUV/truck with rooftop tent or lighter popup, but then, the onroad "camping" experience is degraded.

I could buy a 40 year old LN 7000 for $3500 bucks as well….of course.
The fact that you bought all your stuff well used doesn’t mean it’s not $200k for someone to buy new.
The “I bought it used , don’t understand why folks say this is so expensive” argument is just silly. Someone needs to buy new stuff (not me either fwiw) whether you do or not.

jimh406 wrote:

3 tons wrote:
Good to know, I was only referring to your comment below (14,500, seemed kinda low for a F450?…):

“Fwiw, my 2010 F450 has a 14,500 GVWR from the factory”

3 tons

It's because my F450 is a pickup model.

And the guy in the article’s F450 PICKUP is rated at 14,000gvw. Not 14,500 not 16,500.
C&C trucks are not the same aside from the badges on the fenders and the cab/interior. (Although maybe the engines weren’t derated on the 6.4s because they were pretty low already, but this isn’t about horsepower anyway).

3 tons wrote:
Licensing doesn’t change GVWR…New Ram 4500’s are rated at either 15, 16, or 16.5k, and the 5500’s go to 19.5k, I would expect newer Ford and GM to be similar..

Licensing doesn't change GAWRs either, and that's what most TC owners go by, otherwise it would be impossible to put most campers on the trucks the manufacturer claims they are suitable for.

The Dana S110 axle that is commonly used in these is rated for 14,706lbs.

JimK-NY wrote:
This whole topic moves beyond my understanding and preferences.

To me a truck camper is about ease of use, mobility including being able to go into the backcountry. I got a relatively large truck camper so my wife and I along with 2 cats could live in it full time. My TC has no slides but is 9.5' and hits 4000# loaded for full time use. IMO, my TC is already pushing the limits. With a 12000# total weight, it is not going very far in the backcountry. No rutted dirt roads, no soft ground, no narrow trails with overhangs.

When much more is desired or needed, it seems that it is time to switch to a 5th wheeler or trailer. At least you can drag it to semi remote areas, unhook and have a truck to explore in. I just cannot imagine trying to deal with the size, weight and limitations of a truck camper weighing 6000, 7000 or even 8000# or more.

X2

valhalla360 wrote:
But once you need a 450 or better and have $200k tied up between truck and camper...are you really going to take it into the real back country off roading? At that point, there are other options that will work better.

Fwiw, you don't have to spend $200K unless you want top of the line new for everything. My 9 1/2 ft TC was 8 1/2 years old when I bought my used F450, for instance. I carried it on a F350 SRW for its first 8 1/2 years. In any case, I get that buying something different might be less expensive. Also, a F450 or F350 DRW is not significantly more than a F350 SRW.

I'm not sure what you are thinking is offload. My truck/tc has been on gravel/dirt roads and forest service roads. The real off-road trailers that I've seen that look durable aren't cheap either.

I still have the option to tow, and fit in a single parking space for the most part. I also can take the TC off and use it as a truck. No vehicle with TT can also tow and fit in a parking space. Of course, a TC can also turnaround where almost no TT and vehicle could.

For "real" off-road, I think you are moving into SUV/truck with rooftop tent or lighter popup, but then, the onroad "camping" experience is degraded.

This whole topic moves beyond my understanding and preferences.

To me a truck camper is about ease of use, mobility including being able to go into the backcountry. I got a relatively large truck camper so my wife and I along with 2 cats could live in it full time. My TC has no slides but is 9.5' and hits 4000# loaded for full time use. IMO, my TC is already pushing the limits. With a 12000# total weight, it is not going very far in the backcountry. No rutted dirt roads, no soft ground, no narrow trails with overhangs.

When much more is desired or needed, it seems that it is time to switch to a 5th wheeler or trailer. At least you can drag it to semi remote areas, unhook and have a truck to explore in. I just cannot imagine trying to deal with the size, weight and limitations of a truck camper weighing 6000, 7000 or even 8000# or more.

I have a large truck and camper. We don't go beyond forest roads, but I needed the towing capacity of a Super C with less length and better chassis clearance. 4wd is an added plus which is used at least once a year rather than needing a recovery.

notsobigjoe wrote:
I agree, My 1181 is heavy enough. My wife and I looked at a cirrus this last weekend. The 820 model. I don't remember the numbers off the top of my head but it would be a perfect match for my dually. Fully loaded, water and everything else. I would certainly miss the slide out but having something lighter is starting to appeal to us. As many of you know I talked about looking at TT's and such. They are beautiful and unbelievably cheap compared to a TC and with my dually I could tow a palace. I towed for 25 years and I think I would hate it. I think there certainly is a market for the big ones and there are many super duty trucks out there but the price tag is unbelievable.

This is consistent with my take on it. The reason to get a truck camper is to be nimble and go places you wouldn't take most RVs...We've got it in our heads to do the panamerica highway at some point and that is a good match for a truck camper.

But once you need a 450 or better and have $200k tied up between truck and camper...are you really going to take it into the real back country off roading? At that point, there are other options that will work better.

An expensive 20ft off road camper pulled by a 1/2 ton would likely be cheaper and more spaceious.

jimh406 wrote:

3 tons wrote:
Good to know, I was only referring to your comment below (14,500, seemed kinda low for a F450?…):

“Fwiw, my 2010 F450 has a 14,500 GVWR from the factory”

3 tons

It's because my F450 is a pickup model.

Oh, thanks for the clarity - makes perfect sense :C