Trailer Brake Gain

3oaks wrote:

Lynnmor wrote:
The F150 is only available with a gas engine so no exhaust brake is available. What the OP found out was too little truck and engine for his trailer. Now if second gear doesn't control the speed then you go even slower till you get to where you can buy enough truck.

Not necessarily. He may have enough truck. With a little more experience, he will know how to use the right technique when descending steep grades.

I never followed anyone down a steep grade that I didn't see their brake lights come on. Why, because their speed was accelerating. I don't think they all ran out and purchased "more truck". Knowing the right gear and proper braking technique comes with experience.

Agreed. I didn't read anything in the OP that says "too little truck." Others have mentioned accelerating downhill but the OP never did. I sense inexperience that we've all had.

I have a 2013 F150 w/the Ecoboost and a 7000lb travel trailer. It's not uncommon to be in 2nd gear going down steep hills.

As others said, the engine will rev really high, but they are designed for that. The 3.5l does not have as much engine braking capability as the larger V8s did.

One thing you will learn as you gain experience is to slow down at the top of the hill. If you start at 65mph at the top of a 6-10% downhill grade you will have a much more difficult time maintaining speed than if you say, slow down to 50mph at the top of the hill. Watch how the big rigs handle the large downhill grades.

Thank you everyone for your input and advice. I must admit the steep grades on alt 14 were unexpected. I never really thought of the down hill slop when planning my route. I did a lot of research before I bought my 2013 f 150. Knowing the weight of the trailer I was interested in, Videos forums etc. The trailer weight is 5,400 lbs empty. I figured I was under 1,000 lbs added weight. Propane clothes 1/3 water tank for stops. I am well under the GCVWR. The power going up was exceptional at that altitude with the twin turbos. I am thinking of upgrading the brake pads for safety. even though we are not planning any mountain trips in the near future. Experience goes a long way in situations like this and I hope to gain lots of experience in the future enjoying our new rig on many family adventures. Again thanks again for the input and safe travels to everyone.

Lynnmor wrote:

Those tiny 3.5 engines can't be expected to hold back loaded crew cab trucks towing 29' bunk house trailers. My little Malibu has a 3.5.

They do decently. Over the 4th we had our 35' up at the PA Grand Canyon and the truck did fine up and town those mountains. Nothing like out west but still some steep grades. Tow Haul had it in 2nd down some hills but it did very well.

That being said I also have the 3.5 Ecoboost in a car and it also needs 2nd to generate good engine braking.

Lynnmor wrote:

And half the time you will have superheated brakes. Give me a break!

I guess if you are using the brakes, you should know if they are going away and need to stop. You just can't bypass the physics.

Simple test. Ride your brakes down a hill to keep 30 mph. Try to stop at the bottom. Bet you have a hard time. Now downshift to keep 40 and pulse them to bring your speed back to 30. Try to stop at the bottom of the hill. Which will be easier to do? The physics says it's all the same but it's not.

Yes the physics says that to slow xxx lbs from yyy to zzz will take a certain amount of energy and produce a certain amount of heat. But it ignores the time component. Much easier for the system to handle one shot of all that heat vs the long and slow buildup.

I've driven in the mountains and it's much easier to stop if you pulse and release with a downshift vs riding them the whole time and trying to stop.

lbrjet wrote:
Alt 14 has some 10% grades and is the worst choice for crossing the Bighorns. You should have been in first gear going down.

Yep!

Those tiny 3.5 engines can't be expected to hold back loaded crew cab trucks towing 29' bunk house trailers. My little Malibu has a 3.5.

itguy08 wrote:

Lynnmor wrote:

This stab braking was taught to truckers many years ago and pertained to air brakes. It does not matter how you play with the brake pedal, the same amount of heat will be generated to slow the vehicle a given amount. Repeatedly super heating and then cooling the brakes will gain you nothing.

Sure it will gain you something - brakes in an emergency. Say you're going down a 10% 4 mile hill. Break and release method means 1/2 of the time you will have cool brakes. Using them going down means you may have say brakes that are already 1/2 way to the fade point. Now say you get cut off or something happens 1/2 way down that hill. With brake and release you have a lot more headroom before your brakes overheat and fade. If you use them and keep them warm you may very well be overheating them in an emergency situation.

And half the time you will have superheated brakes. Give me a break!

I guess if you are using the brakes, you should know if they are going away and need to stop. You just can't bypass the physics.

Alt 14 has some 10% grades and is the worst choice for crossing the Bighorns. You should have been in first gear going down.

Lynnmor wrote:

This stab braking was taught to truckers many years ago and pertained to air brakes. It does not matter how you play with the brake pedal, the same amount of heat will be generated to slow the vehicle a given amount. Repeatedly super heating and then cooling the brakes will gain you nothing.

Sure it will gain you something - brakes in an emergency. Say you're going down a 10% 4 mile hill. Break and release method means 1/2 of the time you will have cool brakes. Using them going down means you may have say brakes that are already 1/2 way to the fade point. Now say you get cut off or something happens 1/2 way down that hill. With brake and release you have a lot more headroom before your brakes overheat and fade. If you use them and keep them warm you may very well be overheating them in an emergency situation.

jake2250 wrote:
Agree on the tow/Haul being your friend,, but if you still feel the need to brake, I have found and been told by long time truck drivers to Not drag the brakes but to brake enough to bring it at least 20 mph slower than posted seed, then let her coast and build speed while letting the brakes cool, let the engine do its job and if you feel you need to brake then bring it back down and let it coast (not accelerating).. letting the transmission and engine slow it down..

This stab braking was taught to truckers many years ago and pertained to air brakes. It does not matter how you play with the brake pedal, the same amount of heat will be generated to slow the vehicle a given amount. Repeatedly super heating and then cooling the brakes will gain you nothing.