Shorteelaw wrote:
jmtandem wrote:
We went out today searching for a TT that will meet our needs. We were very upfront with every sales person that we encountered regarding only having 940 max tongue weight available and every one tried to sell us something way heavier than everyone on this site tells us is safe. We found one that we LOVED but then we looked and it was 5300 dry and the dry hitch weight was 800 frickin pounds. Even at camping world they were insistent that we could do 6000 pounds DRY WEIGHT! So so frustrating!
It seems to me the solution is simple. Get more vehicle or look at smaller trailers. Never use brochure weights, nor dry weights. If you use gross weights and then find you are actually a little under gross then you have a small weight cushion. Don't forget to include the hitch weight into your payload reduction. Use 75-100 pounds to estimate the hitch weight.
Most towing guides for vehicles provide the 'best case' for payload and towing. This usually is with minimal options, no other people in the seats, tools, dogs, bicycles, kayaks, bbq, chairs, etc. The more in the vehicle, the less the tongue can weigh to stay within the payload/towing guidelines. The receiver on your vehicle should be placarded with the maximum towing capacities. Typically
two values are provided. One for 'on the ball' towing and the second for using a weight distribution hitch.
Ford does an excellent job in their on line towing guidelines. For gas engines they prescribe a reduction in towing capacity of two percent for each 1000 feet elevation and also a reduction for frontal area of the travel trailer or fifth wheel. Their normally aspired gas vehicles operating above 5000 feet elevation and considering the frontal reduction the towing capacity for the vehicle can be reduced by ten or more percent. Diesels are not affected by elevation as they are turbocharged. Living in Oregon you will be in the mouuntains so elevations and grades are things to think about.
My suggestion is to get the towing/payload guide for your vehicle and use that when shopping. Then use gross weight, not dry, for the travel trailer you want and see if they are a good match. Then use 13 percent for the tongue weight plus the weight of the hitch. For example a fully loaded trailer at 6000 pounds gvwr will have a tongue weight estimate at 13 percent of almost 800 pounds plus 75-100 pounds for the hitch or a total of nearly 880 pounds.
The rule of thumb is to get the RV you want first, then get the vehicle to tow it. Otherwise you are trying to find a RV to fit the tow vehicle, usually a compromise.
I KNOW we need a smaller trailer than they were trying to show us, hence my "frustration" that you quoted. The info you were providing as to how to know how much the receiver is rated for is how I came to the 940 (with wdh). Regarding your last comment... In an ideal world yes that'd be great... However the 3/4 ton trucks were 10,000 more than we spent for our 1/2 ton so the decision had to be made to either get a 1/2 ton and tow a smaller trailer or get neither. We are okay with our choice. There are plenty of lightweight trailers out there.
I guess I came on here for some advice on how to deal with these pushy salesman but instead I'm getting the same attitude of me not know anything.
940 lbs is the max that the HITCH is rated with WD, doesn't mean the vehicle will have enough actual cargo weight left AFTER you subtract your cargo and passengers in the VEHICLE.
So, you need to take a look at your door sticker and see what the vehicle cargo weight ratings say..
Then you add up the passengers in the vehicle and any "gear" or personal stuff that you put into the VEHICLE and subtract that from the vehicle cargo rating.
The result is the max amount of cargo which your vehicle can safely handle. This is the max tongue weight which your vehicle will be able handle.
For instance, my vehicle has 3400 lbs of cargo weight available, Driver is often already figured in at 150 lbs but some argue that the driver is not. In my example we will say that the driver is not..
So in my case, driver and one other adult 350 lbs, two teens 275 lbs and food, drinks entertainment stuff 100 lbs or 725 lbs in the cab.
We take a 4Kw gen at 110 lbs in the back, 4 bicycles for 100 lbs, 6x8 ft outdoor rug 25 lbs, assorted wood blocking and a plank for 20 lbs and 20 lbs of charcoal (got have some good cooking), 100ft of 12ga extension cord for 25 lbs, small tool box for 50 lbs. about 330lbs in the bed of the vehicle.
Add up the vehicle cargo and that is 1055 lbs.
3400 lbs - 1055 lbs = 2345 lbs of available cargo for my vehicle.
My trailer fully loaded comes in with a 750 lb tongue weight which means I am well within my allowable cargo weight of my vehicle..
2345 - 750 lbs = 1585 lbs available cargo..
Basically my cargo weight EXCEEDS my allowable hitch weight (the max is listed on my hitch)
You NEED to find your allowable cargo weight and do what I did above to find the max leftover cargo weight that you can safely tow.
Now to make things easier, instead of attempting to buy a trailer using the dry weights you NEED to search by the GROSS VEHICLE WEIGHT RATING. This WILL simplify your search.
Keep in mind the tongue weight must be within 10% to 15% of the weight..
So as an example we take a trailer which has 7,000 lbs GVWR it should have tongue weight of 700 lbs (10%) to 1050 lbs (15%).
Note, that in the above example that 1050 lbs (15% of 7,000 lbs) is a bit above your hitch rating.
So in reality you NEED to be looking at trailers which have a max GVWR of 7,000 lbs. But keep in mind that if your leftover cargo weight available is LESS than the hitch weight you will need to look for LIGHTER trailers than 7,000 lb GVWR..
Doing so makes your shopping a lot less hassle than trying to take dry weights and adding up all the gear you will be hauling..
Do your homework at home, then go to dealer lots and look at the trailers which fit your needs and weight ratings.