U of M study

transamz9 wrote:

wing_zealot wrote:
For the life of me I can't figure out why diesel owner's continuously start these threads for the umpteen billionth time. It's like they need to repeatedly keep justify their decision to buy a diesel. You don't need anyone else's permission to buy a diesel. If your happy - great! If you're trying to prove something, you're not succeeding, so give it up. Those that want a diesel own a diesel, those that don't, don't. They remind me of hawkers at the county fair. The more threads they open the more I suspect they are trying to sell snake oil.

It's for the many people that buy gas because they are told that diesels cost more to own. If you are happy with your purchase and don't like these threads then don't read them. I'm not the OP and could really care less what someone buys I just like threads that give people good info. Take it how you want. Maybe you keep reading the umteen billion threads because you want to find a way to justify what you bought?

Why would I have to justify spending $8,000.00 less for a truck that does everything I ask it to and has a higher payload to boot?
In hindsight now that I think about it you did provide me with an awakening though. They'll never quit no matter what. Sayonora.

wing_zealot wrote:
For the life of me I can't figure out why diesel owner's continuously start these threads for the umpteen billionth time. It's like they need to repeatedly keep justify their decision to buy a diesel. You don't need anyone else's permission to buy a diesel. If your happy - great! If you're trying to prove something, you're not succeeding, so give it up. Those that want a diesel own a diesel, those that don't, don't. They remind me of hawkers at the county fair. The more threads they open the more I suspect they are trying to sell snake oil.

It's for the many people that buy gas because they are told that diesels cost more to own. If you are happy with your purchase and don't like these threads then don't read them. I'm not the OP and could really care less what someone buys I just like threads that give people good info. Take it how you want. Maybe you keep reading the umteen billion threads because you want to find a way to justify what you bought?

For the life of me I can't figure out why diesel owner's continuously start these threads for the umpteen billionth time. It's like they need to repeatedly keep justify their decision to buy a diesel. You don't need anyone else's permission to buy a diesel. If your happy - great! If you're trying to prove something, you're not succeeding, so give it up. Those that want a diesel own a diesel, those that don't, don't. They remind me of hawkers at the county fair. The more threads they open the more I suspect they are trying to sell snake oil.

proxim2020 wrote:
From looking at the original study back in 2013, there really isn't much of a difference in the depreciation gap between gas and diesels at the 5 year mark.

Silverado - 9% advantage for diesels.
Sierra - 10% advantage for diesels.
Ram - 1% advantage for diesels.
Ford - 13% advantage for gas.

When it comes to cars and SUVs the gap is more significant. With trucks, not so much. I'd imagine each year beyond the 5 year mark the gap slowly shrinks down to irrelevant.

So what you are saying is I get to drive a more capable truck for the same end cost.

Tom_M wrote:
The gist of the article is that depreciation is the key factor.

"Although the combined costs of insurance, repairs, maintenance and fees and taxes, are higher for nearly all diesel models, the lower depreciation values and lower fuel costs of diesel vehicles contribute to a lower total cost of ownership—especially among passenger cars and SUVs."

I think the REAL gist of the article is the disclaimer below:

"Belzowski says, however, that diesels are not without their challenges, including the potential increase in the cost of diesel fuel compared to gasoline, and the resulting need for diesels to continue to improve their fuel economy to maintain their total-cost-of-ownership advantage."

Also Diesel in many parts of the country is as much as a Dollar more than Gas. This extra cost, plus the cost of more oil, more filters, more frequent oil changes means that the gain in MPG of diesels is easily offset by these extra costs. Further the outcome of this article could very well be negated simply by geography. Where one lives. A diesel owner in California is not going to save money, while a diesel owner in a cheap fuel state such as South Carolina may well.

I see no where in the article where these issues are addressed. This makes, for me at least, he Premise of the article faulty, leading to an almost predetermined conclusion.

This is to say nothing of the issue of comparing the resale value of Diesel trucks with Volkswagen Jettas (in averaging).

Despite the Underwriters link to the automotive manufacturing world it must be kept in mind that Bosch makes many MORE fuel injection systems and other parts for GASOLINE engines than it does for diesels.

From looking at the original study back in 2013, there really isn't much of a difference in the depreciation gap between gas and diesels at the 5 year mark.

Silverado - 9% advantage for diesels.
Sierra - 10% advantage for diesels.
Ram - 1% advantage for diesels.
Ford - 13% advantage for gas.

When it comes to cars and SUVs the gap is more significant. With trucks, not so much. I'd imagine each year beyond the 5 year mark the gap slowly shrinks down to irrelevant.

That would be why I have a 8 year 125,000 mile bumper to bumper Mopar warranty. Funny my 04 never had a injector go bad but then I always ran a fuel lube supplement from day one along with full syn engine oil.

Don

Perrysburg Dodgeboy wrote:
Well I didn't pay $10,000 more for the diesel option in either my 2004 Ram 2500 or this 2015 Ram 1500. My 2004 diesel pickup sold for $18,500 a full $10,000 more than a hemi pickup.

I was fill up today and a guy pulled up with a 2009 Dura-Max that was in near perfect condition and he asked how I liked my Ecodiesel. As we talked he said he was thinking about ordering a 2016 GM but that the dealers would not even give him low wholesale for is currant truck. When I told him what I got for my 2004 less than a year ago he said well it looks like I'm going to have to sell it myself. If you trade vehicles in you are going to take a huge hit every single time.

A note diesel in my area is the same or less at some stations than gas right now. So that even makes it more beneficial to own a diesel.

Out of warranty cost for a diesel should be lower than for a gas engine. No tune ups, $645 for my DD 1998 Avenger and that was with my employee discount mind you. The only thing that will put a hurt to you is if you have to replace a injection pump, but it's not like we are seeing these things dropping like flies. Gas injectors fail just like diesel if not maintained. So

Don

I got $18k for my 05 Super Duty with 170k miles on a trade in. Now I wish I would have kept that truck for farm/ranch duty.

Gas injectors do not fail like diesel injectors. Our 05 cummins had 5 injectors fail and were replaced in two separate events along with the 6th injector being replaced to be proactive since the truck was in the shop. This happened with the truck using nothing but MOPAR filters too. In all the years of fuel injected gas engines I never replaced a single injector.

Since I purchased my 05 Super Duty diesel has been more expensive than gas to a tune of $0.60 for the most part and current diesel prices being ~$0.30 more than gas. Expect diesel prices to increase even more than gas during winter months.

You wont drive your current truck enough miles to get your ROI back for the diesel option. Throw in a out of warranty repair on your diesel engine or exhaust system (remember the DPF has a limited life span) and your ROI will be in the red big time.

Well I didn't pay $10,000 more for the diesel option in either my 2004 Ram 2500 or this 2015 Ram 1500. My 2004 diesel pickup sold for $18,500 a full $10,000 more than a hemi pickup.

I was fill up today and a guy pulled up with a 2009 Dura-Max that was in near perfect condition and he asked how I liked my Ecodiesel. As we talked he said he was thinking about ordering a 2016 GM but that the dealers would not even give him low wholesale for is currant truck. When I told him what I got for my 2004 less than a year ago he said well it looks like I'm going to have to sell it myself. If you trade vehicles in you are going to take a huge hit every single time.

A note diesel in my area is the same or less at some stations than gas right now. So that even makes it more beneficial to own a diesel.

Out of warranty cost for a diesel should be lower than for a gas engine. No tune ups, $645 for my DD 1998 Avenger and that was with my employee discount mind you. The only thing that will put a hurt to you is if you have to replace a injection pump, but it's not like we are seeing these things dropping like flies. Gas injectors fail just like diesel if not maintained. So

Don

fla-gypsy wrote:
A thinly veiled advertisement to sell more diesel vehicles with more Bosch fuel pumps perhaps? I mean researchers never tweak their research to get the desired results do they?

You do know that Bosch makes pumps and injectors for gassers too right? The Ecoboost engines have Bosch fuel pumps. Bosch makes gasoline injectors for many OEMs like BMW, Ford, GM, FCA, and many more. Bosch also makes brakes, rotors, spark plugs and so on. In fact I would wager than they make a lot more OE gasoline engine parts each year in the US than diesel. So where some of you guys only think that Bosch is diesel only is beyond me.