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  • JRscooby's avatar
    JRscooby
    Explorer II
    Dec 09, 2019
    ShinerBock wrote:


    Yes, over two decades. First on the consumer side for a fleet, then on the manufacturer for both engine and vehicle, and now on the dealership side for the largest class 4-8 truck dealership group in the world(140+ dealerships) I used to work at on the dealership level but currently at the corporate offices. We are also the largest customer of Peterbilt(PACCAR), Navistar, Hino, Isuzu, Ford medium/heavy duty and various other makes.


    So selling trucks makes you expert on what taxes the owner and operators of the trucks pay? If I had the money I paid in HVUT, I would be able to buy a new RV.
  • ShinerBock's avatar
    ShinerBock
    Explorer
    Dec 09, 2019
    JRscooby wrote:
    ShinerBock wrote:


    As a person who has been in the medium/heavy duty industry for over two decades, I will say that most of this is false.


    Over 2 decades?
    I don't know what positions you have been in, a lot of them have little, if anything to do with taxes.
    I bought, and put to work, my first truck in '71. '73 I was running 3 trucks, 2 trailers and 2 service trucks. At one time I owned and was working 7, but most stayed between 1 and 3. Sold my last truck in '11.


    Yes, over two decades. First on the consumer side for a fleet, then on the manufacturer for both engine and vehicle, and now on the dealership side for the largest class 4-8 truck dealership group in the world(140+ dealerships) I used to work at on the dealership level but currently at the corporate offices. We are also the largest customer of Peterbilt(PACCAR), Navistar, Hino, Isuzu, Ford medium/heavy duty and various other makes.
  • GeoBoy's avatar
    GeoBoy
    Explorer
    Dec 09, 2019
    In regards to the road tax for EV’s, every year when your registration comes due an EV vehicle owner pays a road use tax based on average vehicle mileage. Simple.
  • JRscooby's avatar
    JRscooby
    Explorer II
    Dec 09, 2019
    wilber1 wrote:


    Just about everything you use in life comes by truck. How do you propose to pay for roads once everyone is using EV's and no longer paying fuel taxes? Right now EV's owners are getting a free ride. That can't continue forever.


    When the price of fuel goes up, freight rates go up, but a smaller percentage of the rate goes to the truck. Higher fuel cost are a tax on everybody. Of course most of the increase in the cost of fuel has been driven by oil companies, not fuel tax. That means the "freight rate tax equivalents" have not gone to the government, to benefit the taxpayers, but to oil companies.
    As for "fuel" tax on EVs. Could they not use the mileage of like sized cars to set the per mile rate? Every year, when filling out taxes report how many miles you put on your EV, and pay the fuel tax on the gas for a like sized car. I know in my state the odometer reading is reported to the state every time ownership changes, and every couple of years for safety inspection. Compare to the miles reported, tax paid. Make the penalty real stiff for under reporting.
  • JRscooby's avatar
    JRscooby
    Explorer II
    Dec 09, 2019
    ShinerBock wrote:


    As a person who has been in the medium/heavy duty industry for over two decades, I will say that most of this is false.


    Over 2 decades?
    I don't know what positions you have been in, a lot of them have little, if anything to do with taxes.
    I bought, and put to work, my first truck in '71. '73 I was running 3 trucks, 2 trailers and 2 service trucks. At one time I owned and was working 7, but most stayed between 1 and 3. Sold my last truck in '11.




    Huntindog wrote:

    I only speakn English.
    The defense dept. sees to it that I do not have to learn another language.

    I like our defense dept. You should too.


    Sometime, just for snots and grins, print out a list of conflicts the US military has been involved in since you where born. Next, print a list of countries that have invaded US.
    I have said for years we aught to move highway maintenance to the defense budget. That would give us unlimited money for highways.
  • Huntindog's avatar
    Huntindog
    Explorer
    Dec 09, 2019
    time2roll wrote:
    Reisender wrote:
    What do you propose?
    Continue with petrol tax and any shortfall can come from other taxation including income or sales tax.

    Road taxes alone are insufficient anyway....

    https://www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol-ca-california-gas-tax-increase-road-repairs-20190620-story.html

    So we will need to lean on sales and income taxes anyway.

    What do you propose? Ban EVs and double the gas tax? (see article)
    But under your propposal, the EV crowd would still not pay their fair share. Like a true liberal, you want to use more of other peoples money.... Suresales and income taxes will hit more people... But you want to still keep the petrol tax, which you will NOT contribute to at all.

    Personally, I see the roads benefiting everyone. So EVERYONE should pay. Doesn't matter whether you drive a car at all. You live in a society that only functions because of roads. food, services, electricity etc. are all possible because roads exist.
    So dump the petriol tax, and institute a person tax. Everyone pays a fee for the roads.

    Nobody gets a free ride.
  • valhalla360's avatar
    valhalla360
    Navigator
    Dec 09, 2019
    JRscooby wrote:
    Many, if not most loads cube out before hit GVW restriction. And many of those loads move plant to plant/terminal to terminal. This is the place for E trucks.
    Most folks don't understand that to register a truck for weights over 27 tons IIRC, the owner must pay a extra HVUT. Also, CMVs must keep track of miles driven in each state, the gallons of fuel bought/fuel tax paid. If enough fuel not bought in a state, mail money. It will not be the semis that get away from fuel taxes


    Actually, for the same cargo load, a semi will weigh more, so even if they aren't at the 80,000lb limit, it may be 40,000lb for a conventional ICE truck vs 60,000lb for an EV truck.

    Since pavement damage increases with the square of weight, that's not a 50% increase in damage but significantly more...all for the same amount of cargo moved.
  • valhalla360's avatar
    valhalla360
    Navigator
    Dec 09, 2019
    noteven wrote:
    What % of fuel taxs collected goes directly to transportation infrastructure?


    You can argue how effectively it's spent...but pretty much all gas tax goes to transportation infrastructure. It's one of the rare taxes where almost none is diverted.
  • valhalla360's avatar
    valhalla360
    Navigator
    Dec 09, 2019
    NJRVer wrote:

    So how much does a Tesla wear out and degrade the roads?


    Passenger cars do negligible damage to pavement...but they cause the need for additional lanes and other features which eventually need to be renewed due to age as much as wear.

    So yes, Teslas create just as much demand for roadways as standard passenger cars.

    If you want to discuss passenger car (power plant doesn't matter) vs trucks, that's a different discussion.
  • ShinerBock's avatar
    ShinerBock
    Explorer
    Dec 09, 2019
    NJRVer wrote:
    ShinerBock wrote:
    time2roll wrote:
    What taxes are marked to have the military deployed around the globe to keep oil flowing. Why does this continue when we import so little oil?


    Because it was a false assumption that we keep the military around the to keep oil flowing. It was just propaganda used by certain people to pander to political sides. As you say, we import little oil now, but our military is still involved in these places so the assumption that it is for oil is invalid. Although it is kind of funny that a certain political party president can attack a region for a certain reason and not one word is said about lying or it being for oil. However, if the opposite political party did it less than five years later using the same exact reason, all of the sudden they are lying and doing it for oil.

    time2roll wrote:
    What taxes are charged to clean up the oil spills and clean the air from petrol?


    The companies that spill the oil are mainly the ones who are forced to pay for the clean up. As far as air goes, everyone who is buying a gas vehicle is paying for its better emissions when they buy it.

    As far as cleaning the air goes, there are companies such as Carbon Engineering that have the backing of people like Bill Gates that are working to pull carbon from the air and make fuel out of it. They have stated that they could even pull more carbon than what is being put into the air by the fuel. However, they will need ICE vehicles around to buy the fuel so it can pay for the infrastructure. Without ICE, they would likely not have enough money to reverse the amount of carbon in the air.



    Better tell Trump to get the ships out of the Strait of Hormuz and not worry about protecting the oil in Syria then.


    So is that why Obama sent troops to Syria in 2015 and also why the dems chastised Trump for taking them out of Syria earlier this year? Let me guess, when the left does it is for humanitarian reasons, but when the right does it then it is for oil. Just like when Clinton ordered the military to attack Iraq in November of 1998 for reasons of weapons of mass destruction and not one person cried foul. Yet when Bush did the same for the exact same reason less than 5 years later he was a liar that was doing it for oil. Sounds legit.

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