Will a 10 mile commute kill a diesel?

bmanning wrote:

transamz9 wrote:

bmanning wrote:

Me Again wrote:

campingken wrote:
On the Olympic Peninsula in WA diesel is 30% more expensive than gas so that more than offsets the additional 15% better MPG of the diesel. Don't buy one to save money because you won't.

Diesels do like to me driven hard but don't put the pedal to the metal when you first start driving it. Putting the 10 - 12 quarts of oil that is sitting in the pan under extreme pressure is not a wise move.

Gasbuddy for Sequim

QFC
Gas 3.299 Diesel 3.849 or 16.7 percent more.

Chevron on 101
Gas 3.299 Diesel 3.799 or 15.2 percent more.

Safeway
Gas 3.369 Diesel 3.919 or 16.3 percent more.

Don't know how you came up with 30 percent?

Chris(who grew up in PA)

I've come to think that, at current fuel prices, it's pretty much a wash between gas & diesel when it comes to keeping it fed.

Example: my F250 gets about 12mpg running around town; let's assume I'm paying Safeway prices at $3.37/gal. At $3.92/gal for diesel, a diesel owner getting ~14mpg is spending the same on fuel.

I've read some (very honest) reports here of diesel owners getting around that figure (14) in-town. Of course, some of you get better, some perhaps a bit worse if your weapon of choice is a loaded 4x4 diesel dually with deep gears.

Even towing the spread isn't huge. Let's say my 5.4L got 8mpg towing a particular load. That'd be the equivalent of a diesel earning about 9.3mpg.

Funny, this can be spun a couple of different directions. The gasser guy can say, "See! There's little to no fuel savings with diesel!" whereas the diesel guy can say "I get twice the torque but spend the same on fuel!"

That all depends on the two engines you are comparing. There are gas motors that do better than the numbers you said in your post but there are also diesels that do better. Mine does ~18 (I've seen 17 and I've seen 19.5 on hand calculated tanks) in my town driving. I'm driving a Tundra 5.7 right now at work that's running in the 15 range. The 6.2 F250 we have is around 12.

No question, all comes down to the 2 being compared; I was just speaking in general terms. In your case, you have a great model year of the 5.9L for economy/power balance and a gasser would need to return about ~15.5mpg to match your fuel expenditure at ~18mpg (again using $3.37/gal for 87oct and $3.92/gal for diesel).

Who cares... All you guys are squabbling over what amounts to mice nuts when your talking a $40-50k truck. Choosing between gas/diesel should be based on towing needs, not nickel/diming fuel costs.

campingken wrote:
Me Again,

It was a typo. I meant to write 20%. The last time I bought diesel, about 3 weeks ago, regular was $3.19 and diesel was $3.89. That was a 20+% spread. Our non HO 5.9 diesel gets around 14-15 in town and 19 - 20 on the freeway.

Diesels are great when you are towing heavy however, in my opinion, the modern diesel engine is more complicated, has much more HP and torque than the older ones and the trade off is decreased MPG and increased cost.

Well winter is the worst time of year to compare gas to diesel prices. Diesel is tied to Home Heating oil, so the price stays high, gas in winter drops like the temperature due to less demand. Around here this last Summer we had a couple of time diesel was cheaper than gas.

Mileage is only one reason I drive a diesel, it is pulling power. I would like to see a gas engine with around 260 HP, easily pull a 11,000# 5er, at speed (60 mph) up 6% grades on twisty two lane roads.

I have not read every post so this may have been mentioned but have you ever thought about how often FEDEX and UPS drivers start and stop their diesel engine delivery trucks? Not many of them go five miles between stops. On top of that- the first few seconds of zero oil pressure when starting a motor is a lot harder on it than a short commute.

If you want a diesel- buy a diesel.

Me Again,

It was a typo. I meant to write 20%. The last time I bought diesel, about 3 weeks ago, regular was $3.19 and diesel was $3.89. That was a 20+% spread. Our non HO 5.9 diesel gets around 14-15 in town and 19 - 20 on the freeway.

Diesels are great when you are towing heavy however, in my opinion, the modern diesel engine is more complicated, has much more HP and torque than the older ones and the trade off is decreased MPG and increased cost.

transamz9 wrote:

bmanning wrote:

Me Again wrote:

campingken wrote:
On the Olympic Peninsula in WA diesel is 30% more expensive than gas so that more than offsets the additional 15% better MPG of the diesel. Don't buy one to save money because you won't.

Diesels do like to me driven hard but don't put the pedal to the metal when you first start driving it. Putting the 10 - 12 quarts of oil that is sitting in the pan under extreme pressure is not a wise move.

Gasbuddy for Sequim

QFC
Gas 3.299 Diesel 3.849 or 16.7 percent more.

Chevron on 101
Gas 3.299 Diesel 3.799 or 15.2 percent more.

Safeway
Gas 3.369 Diesel 3.919 or 16.3 percent more.

Don't know how you came up with 30 percent?

Chris(who grew up in PA)

I've come to think that, at current fuel prices, it's pretty much a wash between gas & diesel when it comes to keeping it fed.

Example: my F250 gets about 12mpg running around town; let's assume I'm paying Safeway prices at $3.37/gal. At $3.92/gal for diesel, a diesel owner getting ~14mpg is spending the same on fuel.

I've read some (very honest) reports here of diesel owners getting around that figure (14) in-town. Of course, some of you get better, some perhaps a bit worse if your weapon of choice is a loaded 4x4 diesel dually with deep gears.

Even towing the spread isn't huge. Let's say my 5.4L got 8mpg towing a particular load. That'd be the equivalent of a diesel earning about 9.3mpg.

Funny, this can be spun a couple of different directions. The gasser guy can say, "See! There's little to no fuel savings with diesel!" whereas the diesel guy can say "I get twice the torque but spend the same on fuel!"

That all depends on the two engines you are comparing. There are gas motors that do better than the numbers you said in your post but there are also diesels that do better. Mine does ~18 (I've seen 17 and I've seen 19.5 on hand calculated tanks) in my town driving. I'm driving a Tundra 5.7 right now at work that's running in the 15 range. The 6.2 F250 we have is around 12.

No question, all comes down to the 2 being compared; I was just speaking in general terms. In your case, you have a great model year of the 5.9L for economy/power balance and a gasser would need to return about ~15.5mpg to match your fuel expenditure at ~18mpg (again using $3.37/gal for 87oct and $3.92/gal for diesel).

bmanning wrote:

Me Again wrote:

campingken wrote:
On the Olympic Peninsula in WA diesel is 30% more expensive than gas so that more than offsets the additional 15% better MPG of the diesel. Don't buy one to save money because you won't.

Diesels do like to me driven hard but don't put the pedal to the metal when you first start driving it. Putting the 10 - 12 quarts of oil that is sitting in the pan under extreme pressure is not a wise move.

Gasbuddy for Sequim

QFC
Gas 3.299 Diesel 3.849 or 16.7 percent more.

Chevron on 101
Gas 3.299 Diesel 3.799 or 15.2 percent more.

Safeway
Gas 3.369 Diesel 3.919 or 16.3 percent more.

Don't know how you came up with 30 percent?

Chris(who grew up in PA)

I've come to think that, at current fuel prices, it's pretty much a wash between gas & diesel when it comes to keeping it fed.

Example: my F250 gets about 12mpg running around town; let's assume I'm paying Safeway prices at $3.37/gal. At $3.92/gal for diesel, a diesel owner getting ~14mpg is spending the same on fuel.

I've read some (very honest) reports here of diesel owners getting around that figure (14) in-town. Of course, some of you get better, some perhaps a bit worse if your weapon of choice is a loaded 4x4 diesel dually with deep gears.

Even towing the spread isn't huge. Let's say my 5.4L got 8mpg towing a particular load. That'd be the equivalent of a diesel earning about 9.3mpg.

Funny, this can be spun a couple of different directions. The gasser guy can say, "See! There's little to no fuel savings with diesel!" whereas the diesel guy can say "I get twice the torque but spend the same on fuel!"

That all depends on the two engines you are comparing. There are gas motors that do better than the numbers you said in your post but there are also diesels that do better. Mine does ~18 (I've seen 17 and I've seen 19.5 on hand calculated tanks) in my town driving. I'm driving a Tundra 5.7 right now at work that's running in the 15 range. The 6.2 F250 we have is around 12.

Me Again wrote:

campingken wrote:
On the Olympic Peninsula in WA diesel is 30% more expensive than gas so that more than offsets the additional 15% better MPG of the diesel. Don't buy one to save money because you won't.

Diesels do like to me driven hard but don't put the pedal to the metal when you first start driving it. Putting the 10 - 12 quarts of oil that is sitting in the pan under extreme pressure is not a wise move.

Gasbuddy for Sequim

QFC
Gas 3.299 Diesel 3.849 or 16.7 percent more.

Chevron on 101
Gas 3.299 Diesel 3.799 or 15.2 percent more.

Safeway
Gas 3.369 Diesel 3.919 or 16.3 percent more.

Don't know how you came up with 30 percent?

Chris(who grew up in PA)

I've come to think that, at current fuel prices, it's pretty much a wash between gas & diesel when it comes to keeping it fed.

Example: my F250 gets about 12mpg running around town; let's assume I'm paying Safeway prices at $3.37/gal. At $3.92/gal for diesel, a diesel owner getting ~14mpg is spending the same on fuel.

I've read some (very honest) reports here of diesel owners getting around that figure (14) in-town. Of course, some of you get better, some perhaps a bit worse if your weapon of choice is a loaded 4x4 diesel dually with deep gears.

Even towing the spread isn't huge. Let's say my 5.4L got 8mpg towing a particular load. That'd be the equivalent of a diesel earning about 9.3mpg.

Funny, this can be spun a couple of different directions. The gasser guy can say, "See! There's little to no fuel savings with diesel!" whereas the diesel guy can say "I get twice the torque but spend the same on fuel!"

campingken wrote:
On the Olympic Peninsula in WA diesel is 30% more expensive than gas so that more than offsets the additional 15% better MPG of the diesel. Don't buy one to save money because you won't.

Diesels do like to me driven hard but don't put the pedal to the metal when you first start driving it. Putting the 10 - 12 quarts of oil that is sitting in the pan under extreme pressure is not a wise move.

Gasbuddy for Sequim

QFC
Gas 3.299 Diesel 3.849 or 16.7 percent more.

Chevron on 101
Gas 3.299 Diesel 3.799 or 15.2 percent more.

Safeway
Gas 3.369 Diesel 3.919 or 16.3 percent more.

Don't know how you came up with 30 percent?

Chris(who grew up in PA)

On the Olympic Peninsula in WA diesel is 30% more expensive than gas so that more than offsets the additional 15% better MPG of the diesel. Don't buy one to save money because you won't.

Diesels do like to me driven hard but don't put the pedal to the metal when you first start driving it. Putting the 10 - 12 quarts of oil that is sitting in the pan under extreme pressure is not a wise move.

Getting an engine "just" up to operating temperature does little if anything beyond driving it a city block! Might even be worst than the one block drive due condensation that is created during warm up.

The whole thing about operating at temperature is that to cook off condensation it must be operated at temperature for a bit of an extended time. Thus the weekend drive of 20 or 40 miles or more is good for the engine.

I see little difference between the diesel and gas motor in this regard. As I said before, in cold weather plug the diesel block heater in on a timer to turn it on a few hours before you leave for work. Heat right away!!!!

My wife has a Buick Rainier with an Aluminum V8 5.3 engine. I have never seen a vehicle that come up to temp as fast as it does. Like 4-6 city blocks, well actually 1-2 Miles!! Most diesels will not warm up idling unless they have an exhaust brake that comes on to aid warm up. My old Dodge with Banks exhaust brake has that and fast idle below around 28 degrees of long cold soak via ECM programming. It comes up to 1200 RPM on its own. With the exhaust brake on and 1200 RPM it heats up pretty fast.

Now if it has cold soaked below 15 degrees it will after increasing RPM to 1200 and then go into 3 cylinder idle! Yep, it randomly shuts off 3 cylinders at a time and sounds like it is going to throw a rod. Three cylinders are working and three are opposing as compressors.

If you get the diesel drive it like you stole it. They want and need to be worked. Do the 500-600 mile drive train break in and then go tow hard with it. The harder you work it the sooner the engine will be broken in. Figure 10k-20K miles to do this!

Chris