You have 13 yrs 11 mths left to buy a GM gas or dsl vehicle

Dadoffourgirls wrote:
Unfortunately here in Michigan, my EV is only a local commuter. I would not even take it for a 200 drive yesterday. Not sure that I would be able to plug in when convenient, and when I needed to be back home.

There are not fast chargers everywhere. This is one charger near the outlet mall which was one of the destinations. Additionally, they are not as efficient at 75 mph in 20 degrees Fahrenheit. Plus, I now that my electricity is not clean. I see the freighters unloading coal. I see the generator from my house.

So there is much that needs to change between now and 2035.

I can see where the mindset in Michigan would be slow to embrace EV's.
Trying to tell Detroit the the ICE is dead is an obvious tough sell.
However the big three or is there now just 2.:@ are aware change is coming even if selling the idea locally is tough.
GM has announced there commitment to EV's in an effort to begim changing the mindset of its customers. GM is aware the mindset will not change overnight.
What is also confounding to me is that Tesla is a USA company but we don't seem to embrace or take pride in the fact that Tesla is American Engineering at its finest.
Tesla technology rivals the achievements of NASA yet we are slow to embrace it as a country.
I guess most of the country is content and not looking to replace the ICE. The country as a whole is certainly not fully behind the climate change initiatives.
I can say my entire perspective on climate change and renewable energy changed after driving a Tesla. I'm not in the "New Green Deal Camp" but I can clearly see the ICE is going away in a hurry and that an energy revolution is already underway.

There are continuous outages from equipment failure or needed upgrades. There is a lot of equipment. Just as there are vehicles failing every minute that need repair or maintenance. This is different from inadequate supply. 19 years since, not every year.

You can talk about related issues all day and still it had been 19 years since generating capacity was inadequate. And actually there was adequate supply until a natural gas generator when off line due the peak demand day last summer. If that plant kept running that day CA would have exceeded the historical maximum demand.

I was on CAISO monitoring that day and watched it unfold.

Could the grid in CA be better? Yes. They are working on it every day. Not a static situation.

time2roll wrote:

SPRey wrote:

time2roll wrote:

SPRey wrote:
California is the 3rd largest electricity producer--behind Texas and Florida, and #1 in solar, geothermal and biomass) has rolling blackouts every summer because the demand for electricity exceeds production.

You keep repeating this lie. Please provide a link.

Guess I am also your research assistant...lol.

In 2018, California had a total summer capacity of 75,926 MW through all of its power plants, and a net energy generation of 195,265 GWh. Its electricity production was the third largest in the nation behind Texas and Florida. California ranks first in the nation as a producer of solar, geothermal, and biomass resources. Utility-scale solar photovoltaic and thermal sources together generated 13.8% of electricity in 2018. Small-scale solar including customer-owned PV panels delivered an additional net 12,919 GWh to California's electrical grid, equal to about half the generation by the state's utility-scale facilities.

Liberal leaning Wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_power_stations_in_California

The rolling blackouts every summer due to inadequate supply I have trouble with.

California has first rolling blackouts in 19 years

And 19 years ago it was part of the entanglement with Enron

Homey, blaming others (Enron) may feel good, but it ignores the real problem: that was then and now is now. The problem today is Cali is unable to produce electricity and must import it. And here is the problem, moving power from "there to here" requires transmission lines.

From a 2017 report that fell on deaf ears--

Much of the U.S. energy system predates the turn of the 20th century. Most electric transmission and distribution lines were constructed in the 1950s and 1960s with a 50-year life expectancy, and the more than 640,000 miles of high-voltage transmission lines in the lower 48 states’ power grids are at full capacity. Energy infrastructure is undergoing increased investment to ensure long-term capacity and sustainability; in 2015, 40% of additional power generation came from natural gas and renewable systems. Without greater attention to aging equipment, capacity bottlenecks, and increased demand, as well as increasing storm and climate impacts, Americans will likely experience longer and more frequent power interruptions.

https://www.infrastructurereportcard.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Energy-Final.pdf

Equipment failure and human error is the main cause.

According to NERC, the leading cause of electric transmission outages in California is Faulty Equipment/Human Error.

California experienced 118 electric transmission outages from 1992 to 2009, affecting a total of 19,772,487 electric customers.

Transmission Line Faults and Overloads affected the largest number of electric customers as a result of electric transmission outages.

https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2016/09/f33/CA_Energy%20Sector%20Risk%20Profile.pdf

Up until 2019, I lived in So Cali (native born--66 years young this year) and ever since the big one (2000) we experienced 3-4 power outages each year; some briefly some more than 24 hours. All were related to overloads. The power surge destroyed some of my electronics and SCE paid for the damages.

From Cali ISO--Historical demand for power was July 24, 2006 with 50,270 MW, which exceeded supply. Cali can only produce about 3/4 of that.http://www.caiso.com/TodaysOutlook/Pages/default.aspx

And we have left leaning Bloomberg that concluded between October 15, 2017 - December 31, 2019, California had 50,015 interruptions (blackouts) that impacted 51,192,509 customers.https://www.bloomenergy.com/bloom-energy-outage-map

A few years ago I read the cost to run 1 mile of transmission lines was a couple million dollars....hmm, times 640,000 miles; that's a lot of dough!

Not saying those with electric cars are wrong, just suggesting there will be a problem when demand for electricity outpaces available supply.

There you have it, argument and sources that blackouts were not limited to just 2000, 2019 and 2020. Sorry homey, they happen every year.

Dadoffourgirls wrote:
Unfortunately here in Michigan, my EV is only a local commuter. I would not even take it for a 200 drive yesterday. Not sure that I would be able to plug in when convenient, and when I needed to be back home.

There are not fast chargers everywhere. This is one charger near the outlet mall which was one of the destinations. Additionally, they are not as efficient at 75 mph in 20 degrees Fahrenheit. Plus, I now that my electricity is not clean. I see the freighters unloading coal. I see the generator from my house.

So there is much that needs to change between now and 2035.

Yep. Here in BC too. Especially L2 at destinations like shopping malls and outlet stores and tourist attractions where people spend a couple hours. Hotels are coming along here with L2 but still lots of room for improvement. But i notice more every week on plugshare. Restaurants are another area where both the restaurant and the client would benefit.

Unfortunately here in Michigan, my EV is only a local commuter. I would not even take it for a 200 drive yesterday. Not sure that I would be able to plug in when convenient, and when I needed to be back home.

There are not fast chargers everywhere. This is one charger near the outlet mall which was one of the destinations. Additionally, they are not as efficient at 75 mph in 20 degrees Fahrenheit. Plus, I now that my electricity is not clean. I see the freighters unloading coal. I see the generator from my house.

So there is much that needs to change between now and 2035.

Lantley wrote:

nickthehunter wrote:
As far as I”m concerned, most of this thread is pure garbage. Claims of all types are backed up by nothing. My dad told me “if it seems to good to be true, it probably isn’t. When I read posts like this thread where people are boasting about all the supposed Benefits, I keep tripping over the fact that all these claims and boasts are accompanied by links to reliable sources. And so when I discard everything the has no backup, I’m left with 12 pages of an entertaining science fiction novel.

I suspect the truth is a wildly different story then the one predicted here, with a hell of a lot more zeroes behind the ultimate price tag.

It's all about mindset. You don't have to believe, but the energy revolution is still going on without you. Look around you will see charging stations at Walmart, hotels and other places. Most that I see (now that I have become aware to look for them) are not being used.
However I can see a day that we will charge our cars while out shopping.
Those who do not own EV's are less aware of the changes/infrastructure that is taking place. However those that own EV are very aware of the locations of charging stations and the changes going on.
If you don't have an EV mindset the changes are all nonsense.
But if you have a interest in EV the changes that are underway can't come fast enough.
GM announcing they are terminating the ICE in 15 years should be a wake up call

Good morning,

And keep in mind that those charging stations you see are DC fast charging stations. Generally speaking the people that use those are on a road trip from somewhere else probably hundreds of kilometers away. Non EVers are under the impression that EVers use these like gas stations. They don’t. The vast majority of charging is done at home and some at work. There will never be a need for as many DC fast chargers as there is for gas stations. If you drive a gasser 100 percent of your fueling will be done at gas stations. If you drive an EV 5 percent of your fueling will be done at fast chargers. The rest will be done at home or work.

And yes. It is a mindset thing. With a gas station you are there for one reason. You hang out for 8 or 10 minutes fueling and paying and off you go. With a charge station wether it is L2 or L3 fast charger, you plug in AND LEAVE to go about your daily tasks. Eating, shopping etc.

I have had this conversation even with family and friends, and until they actually spend some time in the car going about the daily routine or a trip or whatever they don’t get it. And then they do...and it’s all over. Especially when they see the operating costs.

Cheers.

nickthehunter wrote:
As far as I”m concerned, most of this thread is pure garbage. Claims of all types are backed up by nothing. My dad told me “if it seems to good to be true, it probably isn’t. When I read posts like this thread where people are boasting about all the supposed Benefits, I keep tripping over the fact that all these claims and boasts are accompanied by links to reliable sources. And so when I discard everything the has no backup, I’m left with 12 pages of an entertaining science fiction novel.

I suspect the truth is a wildly different story then the one predicted here, with a hell of a lot more zeroes behind the ultimate price tag.

It's all about mindset. You don't have to believe, but the energy revolution is still going on without you. Look around you will see charging stations at Walmart, hotels and other places. Most that I see (now that I have become aware to look for them) are not being used.
However I can see a day that we will charge our cars while out shopping.
Those who do not own EV's are less aware of the changes/infrastructure that is taking place. However those that own EV are very aware of the locations of charging stations and the changes going on.
If you don't have an EV mindset the changes are all nonsense.
But if you have a interest in EV the changes that are underway can't come fast enough.
GM announcing they are terminating the ICE in 15 years should be a wake up call

nickthehunter wrote:
As far as I”m concerned, most of this thread is pure garbage. Claims of all types are backed up by nothing. My dad told me “if it seems to good to be true, it probably isn’t. When I read posts like this thread where people are boasting about all the supposed Benefits, I keep tripping over the fact that all these claims and boasts are accompanied by links to reliable sources. And so when I discard everything the has no backup, I’m left with 12 pages of an entertaining science fiction novel.

I suspect the truth is a wildly different story then the one predicted here, with a hell of a lot more zeroes behind the ultimate price tag.

Well, it comes down to GM (and other companies) speculating on wether there will still be a market for anything with a tailpipe in 2035. Does GM sell vehicles in Western Europe. I actually don’t know. But I can guarantee you, in 13 years and 11 months nobody in western Europe is going to be interested in buying some stinky high maintenance expensive to run ancient technology clunky gasser with a tail pipe vehicle. We travel a lot in Europe, and the people in cities already hate vehicles with tail pipes and many down town areas are already closed to any vehicle with a tail pipe.

Like I say. I have no idea if GM sells vehicles in Europe so not sure if this is relevant.

Pick a year. 2040, 2060, 2080. At some time oil will become scarce and expensive. Won't affect those on here knocking renewable energy now but will matter to their grandchildren and future generations. Denial will not change the outcome.

As far as I”m concerned, most of this thread is pure garbage. Claims of all types are backed up by nothing. My dad told me “if it seems to good to be true, it probably isn’t. When I read posts like this thread where people are boasting about all the supposed Benefits, I keep tripping over the fact that all these claims and boasts are accompanied by links to reliable sources. And so when I discard everything the has no backup, I’m left with 12 pages of an entertaining science fiction novel.

I suspect the truth is a wildly different story then the one predicted here, with a hell of a lot more zeroes behind the ultimate price tag.