Shutdown park woes

[agesilaus]

Trouble

The examples all seem to be in California for some reason....

[RGar974417]

agesilaus wrote:
There is no good solution. I'm not in favor of shutting the parks down like was done several years ago. But people need to behave better. Any reports from parks away from big cities? Perhaps they are faring better.

Yes.I just read a report from Yellowstone where the private company that runs the snowmobile tours has taken it upon themselves to keep things cleaned. Of course this time of year there aren't many visitors due to the weather, but they are keeping it going. Many of these parks have "Friends of the Park" groups,some of which have been pitching in to help. It's unfortunate that so many people are so uncaring to trash our National Treasures.

[garyp4951]

This just shows why the NP's were created in the first place, due to destruction from everyone who thought they could do as they please on someone else's property.

[shelbyfv]

agesilaus wrote:
Yeah but these kids are deep dipped in environmentalism, Gaia worship and such. From the moment they step into public schools. Doesn't seem to be the right brand of loving the planet tho.

I missed the part that identified the perps as kids.

[agesilaus]

That is who is not being taught to respect our world by the, "Me First" generation and why things will most likly get worst, before they get better. "Teach your children well" is a lyric from a Crosby, Stills and Nash 70's song. The children of the me first generation were not taught.
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Yeah but these kids are deep dipped in environmentalism, Gaia worship and such. From the moment they step into public schools. Doesn't seem to be the right brand of loving the planet tho.

[agesilaus]

RAS43 wrote:

agesilaus wrote:
There is no good solution. I'm not in favor of shutting the parks down like was done several years ago. But people need to behave better. Any reports from parks away from big cities? Perhaps they are faring better.

Rocky Mtn NP in Colorado is experiencing the same thing.

Well going along with the urban plague theory, I'd say Denver.

[D_E_Bishop]

In 1971, an author from Iowa drove to So Dakota to interview Ben Black Elk a Oglala Lakota Sioux Chief. When Black Elk spoke, it was to the authors ten and seventeen year old sons. Black Elk knew that the young sons had not yet developed unalterable beliefs and habits that his words could not change, he felt only they could learn from the past.

That is who is not being taught to respect our world by the, "Me First" generation and why things will most likly get worst, before they get better. "Teach your children well" is a lyric from a Crosby, Stills and Nash 70's song. The children of the me first generation were not taught.

[RAS43]

agesilaus wrote:
There is no good solution. I'm not in favor of shutting the parks down like was done several years ago. But people need to behave better. Any reports from parks away from big cities? Perhaps they are faring better.

Rocky Mtn NP in Colorado is experiencing the same thing.

[Terryallan]

shelbyfv wrote:
It's unfortunate that the parks weren't closed from the beginning. It will be a mess to deal with.

It is more unfortunate that people can't control themselves. Problem is. those that trashed the parks. walk around like normal people, but are nothing but trash. Next problem is. they breed

[agesilaus]

There is no good solution. I'm not in favor of shutting the parks down like was done several years ago. But people need to behave better. Any reports from parks away from big cities? Perhaps they are faring better.

[shelbyfv]

It's unfortunate that the parks weren't closed from the beginning. It will be a mess to deal with.

[Terryallan]

DutchmenSport wrote:

goducks10 wrote:

GeoBoy wrote:

DutchmenSport wrote:
It's too simple for folks to simply stay away because they are officially "closed." People are pigs! Absolute horrible pigs. Rather than respecting the rules and laws (even during a closure), they somehow justify a closure as a free-for-all and now they can do anything they want. So, they act like heathens, and what's worse, they act like "entitled" heathens. What's next? cannibalism?

X2. You see this kind of behavior more and more every day. Society is really starting to break down.

It stats at the top.

No, it starts at the bottom. It starts with you and me. If (you and me) did the "right" thing, then there would be no need for any kind of intervention from "the top."

If nothing else, those of us who cherish our National Parks, who cherish the great outdoors, and who want to continue to preserve this way of life for ourselves and our children, then all we can do is take our own personal responsibility ... leave your campsite cleaner than when you first arrived. Simple. If everyone did that, at lease one part of this world would be a much better place.

The one who throws a simple cigarette butt on the ground for someone else to pick up is just as guilty as these people who are destroying our parks right now by leaving trash and human waste.

Agree. I was taught to leave a campsite cleaner than it was when we got there. IF you have a way to get the filth in, then you have a way to get it out.

[Beentherefixedt]

The reason all the examples are in California is because that is where the article focused on. There are problems in other places too.

But why are things so bad in the parks in California?

I think it's simple. Just between the cities of Los Angeles, San Diego, SF/San Jose there are approx. 7.2 MILLION people within an easy days drive of multiple major National Parks. This does not include San Bernardino and Riverside Counties or the Central valley.

This is not the case in any other part of the country.

Thus the bad actors can access these parks easily. And the bad ones are attracted by the lack of enforcement and supervision.

But even at normal times things can get a bit testy in Parks where there are SO MANY people vying for a very limited amount of space.

To extrapolate this to the decline and fall of America is hyperbole.

Oh we have serious problems for sure and the lawless types whether they are Neo Nazis or overgrown children with 4 wheelers shi**ing in the open are a concern for sure...but they are not the end of civilization as we know it.

But good people need to stand up and challenge their behaviour.

[agesilaus]

It certainly is associated with some societal upbringing. Just look at the DC National Mall. After some mass meetings the Mall is left without a speck of trash and after other groups meet, the Mall is covered with trash.

It is disheartening to see this behavior transported to the parks. I think we as a group, like to think of ourselves as more responsible than the mass of people. But on the other hand we see graffiti showing up in the parks. I can hope those sort aren't rvers.

[DutchmenSport]

Delete

[wrktfsh]

agesilaus wrote:
Trouble

The examples all seem to be in California for some reason....

90% of the folks there are not from California