Cyclone: Almost burned it down. Thanks Heartland Q.C.

[tgreening]

Spending a couple of weeks at Disneys Fort Widerness. Needless to say its hot, so 2 ACs running, some fans, etc. I was out n about the campground when I get a call from the wife that the breaker panel is smoking, hurry back. Get back and yes its smoking and smelling weird as well. Pull all the******from under the sink, because it seemed like a good idea to put your main electrical right under a major wet area, but other than one waywRd baggie with some sink stoppers i. It, nothing hot gotten close to the backside of the panel. Baggie wasn't melted, but I could see smoke coming from back of the panel as well.pet my hand on the main breaker and boy howdy was he hot.

Eight people and 3 dogs to keep cool in the 95 heat had me reluctant to shut it down but I told the wife to go kill power at the post. I was reluctant to mess with the breaker box till then.

The breaker was never seated properly from the factory. Inside the panel were two metal fingers that were supposed to press between corresponding contacts inside the breaker. Hold your hands in front of your face in a praying position. Those are the breaker contacts. Slide a finger between tose two hands and you get the picture.

One finger was where it was supposed to be. The other finger was bent uup and simply resting on top the contacts and not pressed between them. Enough for "contact" but not a good connection. And of course we all know a poor contact, with some decent amp draw means excess heat. In this case enoguh, over time I'm guessing, to finally melt the top out of the breaker.

When I pulled it out the entire top of one side was gone, and the contacts fell out into my hand. I wish I could get a photo up right now but for whatever reason my cell service is declining to cooperate.

Luckily everyone was awake and they spotted the issue. Everything I care about in the world was inside that camper...wife, kids, mutts. If I had lost them to some schmuck too concerned about "gettin anothern out da door", well, I was a decent hunter back in the day. I'll post the photo first chance.

[deltabravo]

tgreening wrote:
I'm guessing one of these campers would go up like a box full of drier lint once it lights off.

[tgreening]

Jwmoehrle wrote:
I know this is old, but that breaker looks like it was defective rather than a heartland assembly issue. Unfortunately rv's are not built by licensed electricians, or plumbers.

Defective how so? It wasn't just some cheap chinese knock-off which is what I first suspected. It was a cutler/hammer breaker, which is first rate.

[mlupone]

Jwmoehrle wrote:
I know this is old, but that breaker looks like it was defective rather than a heartland assembly issue. Unfortunately rv's are not built by licensed electricians, or plumbers.

While not an assembly issue, it may be a poor choice of components. Components fail; we all get that, but how often are their sub-assemblies and components failing and does this illustrate a supply chain issue? I would ask the manufacturer how they choose their supply chain. Do they have a supply chain risk management program? What is their supply chain predictability?

In any event, FWIW.

[Jwmoehrle]

I know this is old, but that breaker looks like it was defective rather than a heartland assembly issue. Unfortunately rv's are not built by licensed electricians, or plumbers.

[d-mac1]

Bummer on the pump. Hope not too much stuff ruined. At least it was clean water.

One thing I learned when buying our unit....its often the temporary help the manufacturers hire during peak season that do the shoddy work. Full timers know the drill but still make mistakes...and they can do crappy work too, but less likely.

Am I incorrect in saying that a good portion of the reason that car manufacturers have went to an automated assembly line is for good quality control? I wouldn't think that is feasible with an RV.

[tgreening]

Custer south dakota. Water pump exploded on the last night there and flooded basement. Yee haw....

[abom2]

I have worked in Quality Control and Quality Assurance for most of my adult life. From the Aviation industry, Power Generation (Fossil and Nuclear), to Petrochem and Oil& Gas.

One thing I can tell you for a fact: You cannot inspect in quality. Quality starts with you base materials, components, and sub-assemblies.

Then your assemblers, craftsman, painters, warehouse/materials personnel have to be knowledgeable in their work and in the Quality Program.

This Quality Program HAS TO BE lived and breathed by every individual. This is especially applicable to the Production Management.

I have been a QC Manager and a QA Manager on many jobs. Some of these projects were Multi-Billion dollar project. (Anywhere from 1 to 12 Billion)

These had huge staffs of QC Inspectors, QA Inspectors, QA Auditors, etc.

While these folks may catch some of the problems it starts with the lowest person on the pole and runs to the top.

Git'er Done, Make My Production Numbers, We'll fix it later just leads to more quality problems.

Management HAS TO not only support but be the EXAMPLE of Quality and Safety first, and build it right the first time. Anything beyond that is lip service to deceive the customer and make themselves feel good.

Quality does have a price. It is not as high as production and the bean counters would have you believe.

Training and personal ownership of ones work has proven that costs can be maintained, quality is there, and productivity is also maintained.

I was raised by craftsman and quality inspectors. Schooled in it throughout my life. Experience has taught me and has shown me time and again the truth to what I have written above.

I have seen time and again manufacturers/fabricators who have quality problems will hire or promote the lowest paid person who "will do what is needed to keep their job" to provide an illusion that they have a quality program.

That is joke number ONE.

Yes, I am passionate about quality. I was taught my whole life to first build it, then you will know what it takes to make it the right way. Then you will know as an inspector what to look for when it was not done right.

Growing up I was taught and worked as a carpenter, welder, a/c installation, warehouse, oil tool manufacturing, machinist apprentice, etc. I needed to eat and help support our family.

In each case I worked up into the Quality Dept. The companies sent me to additional training courses and paid for me to test and receive my various certifications and licenses from those recognized code producing societies.

I have always pushed to increase my knowledge and experience in the Quality arena.

No matter my knowledge, expertise, or passion for quality one truth comes out.

I can help create, implement, and enforce the Quality program and requirements. But without the WHOLE team knowing what quality program is, how they implement and perform their part, and everyone supports it 100% it will NEVER happen.

[tgreening]

Yeah, I wouldn't putz around. We got lucky. I'm guessing one of these campers would go up like a box full of drier lint once it lights off.

[Ric_Flair]

The 12v overhead light switch in mine must have a loose connection. Get's hot after a short period.

[Stefonius]

Frightening! I'm glad you and your family are safe. I have a 12v circuit in my trailer that's loose... one slideout goes dark and I have to jiggle the fuse to turn it back on. I think your story has motivated me to pull the panel and fix the connection properly.

[walker111]

Scary stuff. Most important is family is healthy!

[tgreening]

Here's the offending circuit breaker. This is as it came out of the breaker box. The contacts fell out when I pulled it. I can't believe it was actually still functioning till I pulled it and it fell apart.

[tgreening]

Purchased new. As far as electrical work goes, the only thing worked on was the transfer switch. It went bad a year or so ago and was replaced. The initial install was amazingly slopoy. There was one screw installed holding it to the "floor". The lid was just sitting on top the box with no fastening screw in place. The wiring was run with the idea of just getting it there. Most dirrect route from point a to point b with no nod to neatness or orginization. Disappointing work.

I double checked the replacement and it was installed as well as could be considering what the tech started with.

I'm on my way home now and will get a photo or two uploaded. I saved the breaker, for some reason. Just a reminder I guess of things to check on my next unit.

[WhitehouseLV]

steiny93 wrote:
interesting that it has gone for a few years then have trouble; has someone been working on it lately?

I've seen two different rv's where the neutral lead coming into the coach was loose; both melted through and smoked a bunch; you probably want to double check those as well.

I noticed that too.

OP - did you buy your cyclone new or used?