Shopping for used 5er, comparing used Artic Fox and Komfort

[Bluebeard]

My wife and I are in the market for a used 5th wheel. We are not interested in the fancy 40 foot behemoth, we are looking for something no longer than 26 feet. We travel down a lot of dirt roads, and I want to be able to turn around in a limited space if need be. My question is we are comparing a 2002 Arctic Fox 20-5N and a 2004 Komfort 25 FS. Most of our travels will be boondocking and we typically go out in late fall to the mountains, where it is usually pretty cold in the mornings and evenings- with occasional snow. Any plusses or negatives about either? My wife found one of those "pissed consumer" websites that was doing a pretty good job bashing the new arctic foxes, but since this is pretty old stuff, I figured any of the weak stuff would have been replaced by now- although both trailers look to be in pretty good shape.

Also, does anyone know of another used brand of that vintage that has a slide out bedroom along with the living area slide out? We looked at an older Komfort that had it, but it was pretty beat up- I was just wondering if anyone else did that with that small sized trailer.

One of our big issues is interior storage- which is really valuable in the small trailers. If anyone has any suggestions for a smaller 5th that uses its space really well, let me know. We have 2 big dogs so we want to have a lot of floor space for them to lay while we are inside.

Thanks for any input.

[FMB]

Bluebeard wrote:
Yeah, I upgraded the batts to 2-6 volt, so I am good there. Battery minder is a good idea, but I think a charge controller is the same thing, right? Did you do anything to change the cabinets? I was trying to think of a way to extend the kitchen counter when the slide was out. Also, I was thinking about adding a catalytic heater somewhere. In our old Keystone Cougar, when we were camping in a snowstorm, the heater fan was cycling all night long and although it didn't do such a good job of keeping the trailer warm, the constant cycling of the fan, kept us awake all night.

Does anyone have a schematic of the construction of the trailer? I'd like to find a good "cubby hole" to hide valuables when we aren't there. Any ideas? It would be nice to see the schematics of the unit to determine where there are enclosed spaces that aren't being utilized.

Progressive Dynamics converter/charger has (had) an add on piece that timed the charge to give a boost occasionally then float the charge after fully charged. That is the "charge controller" I was talking about.

We didn't do anything to the cabinets or countertops as they sufficed for us. We did have a problem with the heater where it would enter the cool down stage (no flane, just fan) and when the fan turned off, the fan would restart before it even stopped. It would do this several times before stopping. Kept us awake and drew the battery down prematurely. The problem was the thermostat and when I replaced it, problem went away. Oh, and the Fox is much better insulated than your old Cougar I think.

We bought a cheap ceramic oscillating space heater for heat when connected to electric in a park. It lives in a cabinet when not in use.

For hiding places, there isn't many and it depends on the intelligence of the thief. Our Fox was broken into and ransacked but they were not aware of the space under the bed. For small items, try under the drawers in the hallway. Don't think of trying to hide anything from Canadian Customs though cause they know everywhere and tear out drawers on a regular basis. How do I know? I keep my pistol in the drawer next to the bed but left it at home to travel through to Alaska. The dog hit on the drawer and they dug for the gun that wasn't there.

[Bluebeard]

Yeah, I upgraded the batts to 2-6 volt, so I am good there. Battery minder is a good idea, but I think a charge controller is the same thing, right? Did you do anything to change the cabinets? I was trying to think of a way to extend the kitchen counter when the slide was out. Also, I was thinking about adding a catalytic heater somewhere. In our old Keystone Cougar, when we were camping in a snowstorm, the heater fan was cycling all night long and although it didn't do such a good job of keeping the trailer warm, the constant cycling of the fan, kept us awake all night.

Does anyone have a schematic of the construction of the trailer? I'd like to find a good "cubby hole" to hide valuables when we aren't there. Any ideas? It would be nice to see the schematics of the unit to determine where there are enclosed spaces that aren't being utilized.

[FMB]

Bluebeard wrote:
By the way, we bought the 2002 25-5N-

Any of you who have had one of these, are there any hints or tips you can offer to improve our "experience" of this thing?

Congrats on your purchase. A few things to consider, first, if it's time for new batteries, consider upgrading to two T-105 6volt batteries (in series) as the combined power is more than what you will get out of two 12volt batteries (parallel).

We also put baby locks on the cabinets because of all the gravel/dirt roads.

Add on the booster antenna for the TV antenna. Cheap and easy.

Added a battery minder to keep the battery from cooking when plugged in for days.

I'm not sure why you would need a solar panel. Your batteries should last a good 4 days or so. Mine does, even with a CPAP at night. Oh, yeah, get an inverter large enough to power whatever 120V items you may have.

If you buy a generator, stay away from the cheap (Harbor Freight) gensets. Way too loud and may help you meet many neighbors, but they won't be in a good mood. Look for something like a Honda eu3000i (heavy but will run your AC) or eu2000i (lighter, but you would need two and the wire kit to run AC). I keep my 3000 in the back of the truck and use a short heavy extension cord to the Fox for the occasional charge or mixer use.

[TXiceman]

Arctic Fox hands down over a Komfort.

Ken

[Bluebeard]

By the way, we bought the 2002 25-5N- it was in immaculate condition, for $8k- we figured we got an ok deal.

Any of you who have had one of these, are there any hints or tips you can offer to improve our "experience" of this thing? Anything I need to change, or improve upon? Looks like I need to get a solar panel to charge the batteries, at a minimum. I am curious if anyone modified it in any way to "improve it". Not spending much time in a small 5'er ever, I'd like to hear other's experiences of mod's they may have done.

[Bluebeard]

I assume a 2500HD gas or diesel is plenty to pull it? I live in the Sierras so everywhere I go is up or down. Actually, I am now shopping for a good used truck for hauling this thing- can I do it with a 2500 or should I shop for a 3500?. Is gas a viable option for towing this, or should I go with a diesel?

I've been told the Duramax '06 and '07 are the best- but being "Best" comes at a steep price (my wife will only let me buy a truck with less than 60k miles on it, so an '06 or '07 with that low miles on it is very expensive). Are any of the prior years good too? I was thinking of looking for the '05 to get the 5 speed allison- any reviews between towing with the 5-vs the 6 speed?

I know earlier engines had injector problems, do you think those early engine problems have been resolved by now?

[FMB]

We researched for about 5 months before deciding a Foc 24-5N would fit our needs, then another 3 months or so to find a dealer to deal with. We bought one of the first new 2004 units and have been very happy with it. It is solid and heavy.

We have put on a bit over 65,000 miles on it to date and you mentioned some off-road or dirt road travels? We have been on some logging roads here in California, but many more miles on gravel roads in BC, Yukon and NW Territories as well as Alaska. The first long trip on gravel was to Coldfoot AK, North of the Artic Circle. That trip took the dinette table away from the wall and it came all apart. It was a bundle of lumber. It was also our first experience with Frost Heaves. I put it back together in Fairbanks with deck screws and never had an issue since.

The next trip north, we drove the 458 mile long Dempster Highway to Inuvik, NWT. Almost all was gravel or mud. No issues, drove wonderful and the sights are beautiful.

I've never had an issue with the length of the 24-5N. We have been in many parking lots, restaurants, stores, campgrounds, etc.. Never been too long. Oh, and spent 4 hours driving in downtown Manhattan looking for a way to get to the Jersey side. I wouldn't go back to Manhattan again with ANY vehicle let alone a FW.

[BadDogPSD]

I've owned three Northwood products, Arctic Fox, Nash, and now a Desert Fox toyhauler. All have been solid, well built units!

[laknox]

donn0128 wrote:
I stand corrected.

No problemo. 🙂

Lyle

[RollandB]

Not piling on Don, my 05 Komfort 291FSG is also a Zieman frame. For the OP, I've had many Komforts over the years and have always found them to be a reasonably priced trailer that is built good (I have had any of their recent built one though). I haven't owned an Artic Fox but from what I see and hear would have them on my short list if shopping. The important thing for us is the floor plan that works best!

[donn0128]

I stand corrected.

[laknox]

donn0128 wrote:
Buggest minus of Foxes is probably the ST tires. I cant remember what year they started using aluminum frames, but it was close around 2002. First couple of years there was some delamination issues. In house frames, built stout for off road.
Komfort was OK, nothing spectatular. Lippert frame.

Not correct, Don. My '04 Komfort 25FSG (same as the 25FS, but with Filon exterior), has the aluminum cage and a Zieman frame. This was prior to Lippert buying Zieman, or so I was told. Heavy and solid, for sure.

Lyle

[n7bsn]

We looked at both models years back and bought the 24-5N for two reasons: 1) it was better made and 2) it had lots better storage.
The 24-5N had the best storage of any 5er in that size range.
If the 24-5N is in as good (or better) condition it would be my choice of the two.

As for the "pissed consumer" web-site, the name tells it all. I looked through it for positive reviews, on -ANY- brand and found very few.

A careful reading of the reviews on AF there suggests that one person posted three times, with slightly different complaints, or one dealer in Canada has real problems.

[donn0128]

I think you would be hard pressed to find better than a Northwood product. They made both Nash and Arctic Fox. Excellent trailers, but like I said heavy!

[Bluebeard]

Any recommendations for "better quality" trailers in the $7k- $12k price range with similar floorplans? I'd like to find one no longer than 26', that ideally has the long slide (or opposing slides) and possibly the bedroom slide.

Also, not knowing anything about slides, it is smart to be looking for trailers of that vintage with a lot of slides?