GVWR vs GCWR. What is included?

[Bill_and_Marie_]

We have a 2015 Thor Chateau 26A on a Ford E350 chassis. The listed GVWR is 12500#. And the GCWR is 18500#. Does the GCWR include the standard equipment or is that the "dry" weight of the MH? Do I need to go weigh it to find out the actual weight? Is that enough room to tow a light toad (it has an 8k hitch)? Thanks!

[Mich_F]

Throwing some more numbers around. :B
Your 12,500# GVWR vehicle. with full fuel and nothing else has a 1,559# OCCC.Subtracting the OCCC from the GVWR tells you, your vehicle with that full fuel tank and nothing else, should weigh around 10,941#. Subtracting that from your 18,500# GCWR leaves 7,759# which can be towed. Of course that number is totally unrealistic for a tow rating, since neither you or passengers, food gear and whatnot have been thrown into the calculations yet.
As has been suggested, you should have your vehicle weighed,preferably while fully loaded for camping, which will let you know how exactly much you can tow, and carry.

[Golden_HVAC]

Bill and Marie in TX wrote:
Thanks again, and yes, I found a yellow tag that lists the maximum allowable load weight for occupants and cargo as 1559 # so unless we carry 1100+ # worth of food, stuff, and dogs it should be ok. I prefer to always run with mostly empty tanks, just carrying a bit of fresh water (10-15 gals) for flushing and washing hands on the road.

1,500 pounds is not very much weight capacity. You will have to be very careful.

Of course if you will only tow a boat with a 200 pound hitch, you will be fine. Anything heavier, and you will need your actual weight, after packing the RV for a trip, including the 10 gallons of fresh water.

You will need to be especially aware that loading the hitch ball some 8 feet behind the rear axle will transfer a lot more weight to the rear axle than the actual trailer hitch weight. It is like a lever pushing down on the bumper, pushing down on the rear axle, and lifting the front axle slightly.

So 400 pounds hitch weight will mean about 600 pounds more weight applied to the rear tires. Do not exceed your 8400 rear axle weight rating, that is all the tires are rated at!

And with only 1,500 pounds to spare, my guess is that Thor did check the weight on a unit several years ago, same model number, and GVWR - that motorhome weight left only about 1,500 pounds for cargo and other stuff.

Chances are that they did not weigh YOUR motorhome. But a motorhome 'like' yours.

Good luck,

Fred.

[Golden_HVAC]

tatest wrote:
Those are weight ratings, not actual weights.

GVWR is maximum permitted weight for the vehicle, whatever is installed or loaded into it.

GCWR is maximum permitted weight for the vehicle plus anything it is towing.

To find out the actual weight of any vehicle, you have to weigh it.

GCWR - GVWR = 6000 pounds, so if fully loaded you could theoretically tow that much. It is certainly enough for a light towed vehicle, providing you pay attention to Ford's limit of 1500 pounds for tows that do not have their own braking.

The RV manufacturer may have put a lower "maximum tow rating" on the RV, and has likely also put a maximum vertical load limit (sometimes called tongue weight) on the hitch as installed. These could be lower than the rating of the hitch itself, because the hitch is likely installed on an extension to the E-350 frame.

The above information is close to correct, but actually can be many pounds off.

The GCVWR is what the engine can pull.

The GVWR is what should be on the tires, and no more.

If you just take the GCVWR - GVWR and get 6,000 pounds, it is not the right weights. Unless your motorhome is already loaded all the way to it's GVWR, you can tow more than 6,000 pounds.

So take the RV to a scale. Find out the front and rear actual weights. You mentioned the front axle rating and rear axle ratings. you can not exceed those, or the tires likely will be overloaded. Also if you have a really long rear overhand, and tow something like a cargo trailer with a 800 pound hitch weight, it will take off weight from the steering axle, and put it on the rear axle. The ratio is easy to explain. But when you can tell us how much you plan to tow, and what the axle weight are, we can get into the specifics on that.

Basically if you plan on towing less than 7,000 pounds, and have less than 400 pounds of hitch weight, you should be fine.

By checking your axle weights and comparing them to the GAWR, you will know if you are overloading the tires.

Say the rear axle weight is 7,000 pounds and the GAWR is 8,200. By putting a 400 pound hitch weight 8' behind the rear axle, and you have a 16' long wheelbase, you will take away 200 pounds from the front axle and place 600 pounds on the rear axle.

It is very easy to overload the rear axle, especially with a cargo trailer. But a boat is likely less than 200# hitch weight, and should be no problem.

Good luck,


Fred.

[Bill_and_Marie_]

Excellent point, bottles are just too heavy, specially in cases!

[stickdog]

Canned beer weighs less than bottled beer same goes for boxed wine.

[Bill_and_Marie_]

Thanks again, and yes, I found a yellow tag that lists the maximum allowable load weight for occupants and cargo as 1559 # so unless we carry 1100+ # worth of food, stuff, and dogs it should be ok. I prefer to always run with mostly empty tanks, just carrying a bit of fresh water (10-15 gals) for flushing and washing hands on the road.

[DrewE]

Bill and Marie in TX wrote:
Thanks for the info! I also found a GAWR of Front 4600# and Rear 8500#. I guess this is max load per axle?

Correct.

GAWR = gross axle weight rating
GVWR = gross vehicle weight rating
GCWR = gross combined weight rating

There should be a sticker somewhere that lists the actual weight of the motorhome as it left the factory, the size of the water tanks, and how much weight is left for other stuff on the chassis, etc. Often this is pasted in the back of a cabinet somewhere. It's no substitute for getting the unit weighed with your stuff and in your traveling configuration, but it is something of a starting point.

[wildtoad]

Bill and Marie in TX wrote:
Thanks for the info! I also found a GAWR of Front 4600# and Rear 8500#. I guess this is max load per axle?

Yes sir.

[wildtoad]

GVWR is the maximum amount of weight that the vehicle is rated to support on the chassis. If it is in the motorhome, on the motorhome it counts towards the GVWR. The GCWR includes the GVWR and the weight of what you may tow. So if you were maxed out on GVWR you could tow a 6,000 lb toad. If you are under the GVWR then you could tow a heavier toad up to the 8,000 lb max of the hitch.

You should weigh your mh as you expect to travel with it anyway to determine the proper tire pressure to use.

[Bill_and_Marie_]

Thanks for the info! I also found a GAWR of Front 4600# and Rear 8500#. I guess this is max load per axle?

[tatest]

Those are weight ratings, not actual weights.

GVWR is maximum permitted weight for the vehicle, whatever is installed or loaded into it.

GCWR is maximum permitted weight for the vehicle plus anything it is towing.

To find out the actual weight of any vehicle, you have to weigh it.

GCWR - GVWR = 6000 pounds, so if fully loaded you could theoretically tow that much. It is certainly enough for a light towed vehicle, providing you pay attention to Ford's limit of 1500 pounds for tows that do not have their own braking.

The RV manufacturer may have put a lower "maximum tow rating" on the RV, and has likely also put a maximum vertical load limit (sometimes called tongue weight) on the hitch as installed. These could be lower than the rating of the hitch itself, because the hitch is likely installed on an extension to the E-350 frame.