can a ford ranger tow trailer on steep mtns rds?

time2roll wrote:
With 4500 pound trailer no extra engine braking is needed. Even at the full tow rating no additional engine braking is needed. This would be what the truck is rated for.

https://fifthwheelst.com/SAE-J2807-Tow-Tests.html

The standardized tow rating tests don't involve anything with downhill braking, where your brakes might fade from overuse and cease to be effective. All they require is that the combination be able to stop in <80ft from 20mph without leaving the lane. Stating that equates to driving in the mountains is disingenuous at best.

Even with J2807, tow ratings are ambiguous and often unequivocal to real-world performance.

With 4500 pound trailer no extra engine braking is needed. Even at the full tow rating no additional engine braking is needed. This would be what the truck is rated for.

mkirsch wrote:

jshupe wrote:

mkirsch wrote:
You're not going to downshift and cruise on down the hill with your feet flat on the floor towing a trailer. Most vehicles won't even do that empty.

I do exactly that - I usually let the EB do all the work and don't even have to touch the brakes except to slow for curves.

All your statement does is show that you've never driven anything with an effective EB. Nothing more.

Regarding Op's question, that engine will be far less effective than the 8.1L in your sig. And the 8.1 in your sig will be far less effective than a modern Cummins, Duramax, or Scorpion.

This has nothing to do with the subject at hand here. Last I checked you could not get a diesel with an engine brake in a 2021 Ford Ranger, so the discussion is limited to gasoline engines.

The OP is trying to tow something like a 4500lb trailer. He does not need a big dually diesel.

At what point did I say he needs a diesel? I suggested a larger displacement engine that can offer more engine/transmission braking performance, since engine braking is proportional to displacement (and compression).

jshupe wrote:

mkirsch wrote:
You're not going to downshift and cruise on down the hill with your feet flat on the floor towing a trailer. Most vehicles won't even do that empty.

I do exactly that - I usually let the EB do all the work and don't even have to touch the brakes except to slow for curves.

All your statement does is show that you've never driven anything with an effective EB. Nothing more.

Regarding Op's question, that engine will be far less effective than the 8.1L in your sig. And the 8.1 in your sig will be far less effective than a modern Cummins, Duramax, or Scorpion.

This has nothing to do with the subject at hand here. Last I checked you could not get a diesel with an engine brake in a 2021 Ford Ranger, so the discussion is limited to gasoline engines.

The OP is trying to tow something like a 4500lb trailer. He does not need a big dually diesel.

^True statement by jshupe...

mkirsch wrote:
You're not going to downshift and cruise on down the hill with your feet flat on the floor towing a trailer. Most vehicles won't even do that empty.

I do exactly that - I usually let the EB do all the work and don't even have to touch the brakes except to slow for curves.

All your statement does is show that you've never driven anything with an effective EB. Nothing more.

Regarding Op's question, that engine will be far less effective than the 8.1L in your sig. And the 8.1 in your sig will be far less effective than a modern Cummins, Duramax, or Scorpion.

Scooby
Something to think about on gears. The 6, 8 and 10 so transmissions have a 4, 4.3 and 4.5-1 1st gear ratios. With a 3.42 in pumpkins they are lower geared than the majority of older 3 and 4 sp auto rigs with 1st being in the 2.48 to 3.1 range. I have better engine braking in my 2014 1500 with a V6, than ANY of my SB/BB setups in 25/35 setups in past years. Better starting abilities too.
Along with an overall taller ratio for better mpg's.
As the article mentions, the newer transmissions are what generally makes the newer trucks better overall from a driving experience.
Hence my feelings the OPs truck will do fine!
Marty

JRscooby wrote:

mkirsch wrote:
What is all this malarkey about "engine braking?"

I've owned several full size pickup trucks, all with small block V8's except my '03 Chevy 3500, and NOT A SINGLE ONE OF THEM could hold ITSELF back on any sort of incline using the engine alone. Downshift downshift downshift, rev rev rev, faster faster faster... I ALWAYS had to control the descent with brakes.

The ONLY truck I've ever owned that would control itself on a hill is the '03 Chevy 3500 with the 8.1L and Allison. Turn on tow haul mode, hold the brakes for 3 seconds, and the hill would have to be EXTREMELY steep to need brakes, and then only a brief tap. However, the truck still needs frequent application of brakes to maintain speed with any sort of trailer behind.

Unless you're throwing out a ship's anchor at the top of the hill, you're using brakes.

Just for snots, on a stop you make every day, slip into neutral as you start to stop. Bet you need more brake than normal.

Not really. At slow speeds the truck is basically coasting.

This "engine braking" isn't as effective as people claim it is. You're not going to downshift and cruise on down the hill with your feet flat on the floor towing a trailer. Most vehicles won't even do that empty.

mkirsch wrote:
What is all this malarkey about "engine braking?"

I've owned several full size pickup trucks, all with small block V8's except my '03 Chevy 3500, and NOT A SINGLE ONE OF THEM could hold ITSELF back on any sort of incline using the engine alone. Downshift downshift downshift, rev rev rev, faster faster faster... I ALWAYS had to control the descent with brakes.

The ONLY truck I've ever owned that would control itself on a hill is the '03 Chevy 3500 with the 8.1L and Allison. Turn on tow haul mode, hold the brakes for 3 seconds, and the hill would have to be EXTREMELY steep to need brakes, and then only a brief tap. However, the truck still needs frequent application of brakes to maintain speed with any sort of trailer behind.

Unless you're throwing out a ship's anchor at the top of the hill, you're using brakes.

Just for snots, on a stop you make every day, slip into neutral as you start to stop. Bet you need more brake than normal.

jshupe wrote:

That's my experience with gas engines, not diesels with exhaust brakes. My current truck does a great job managing 25K+ GCW on 6-7% grades without having to use the brakes. The EB in my Duramax was considerably weaker, but still much better than any gas engine I've used.

One thing many don't understand how much the high-speed rearends have reduced the effectiveness of engine braking.
I would still like to see a side by side comparison, same gears/loads/displacement, the whoa power of restricting air going in the engine compared to restricting the air coming out.
I will never forget the first load on the first diesel I bought. That 6-71 did not have any add-ons to help slow the load.

mkirsch wrote:
What is all this malarkey about "engine braking?"

I've owned several full size pickup trucks, all with small block V8's except my '03 Chevy 3500, and NOT A SINGLE ONE OF THEM could hold ITSELF back on any sort of incline using the engine alone. Downshift downshift downshift, rev rev rev, faster faster faster... I ALWAYS had to control the descent with brakes.

The ONLY truck I've ever owned that would control itself on a hill is the '03 Chevy 3500 with the 8.1L and Allison. Turn on tow haul mode, hold the brakes for 3 seconds, and the hill would have to be EXTREMELY steep to need brakes, and then only a brief tap. However, the truck still needs frequent application of brakes to maintain speed with any sort of trailer behind.

Unless you're throwing out a ship's anchor at the top of the hill, you're using brakes.

Obviously, it will depend on a few factors (total weight, engine size & grade).

I was shocked how good the V10 in our 2008 is as an engine brake (F250 towing around 7500lb trailer).

Sure if we are doing a 8-10% downgrade, I have to hit the brakes every so often but far less than if we just relied on the wheel brakes.

With a 4-5% grade, I generally don't have to touch the brake pedal at all.

Of course a smaller engine will provide less engine braking but it should still be your first line of defense as it can provide it's braking power pretty much constantly and indefinitely.